International Trade Committee on April 30th, 2024

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Terry.

I'll say this: We're not here to speak. We're here to allow you to speak and to therefore get on the record for the analysts your desires and expectations on fluidity, capital investments, data, digital and the list goes on.

We heard from Mr. Hamilton with respect to the establishment of the Niagara trade corridor. We worked very hard on that with Hamilton and Oshawa. We know the economic investments that are under way. We know the economic investments that are going to happen. The supply chain and logistics strategy is something that I hope comes as an outcome of this committee. As the parliamentary secretary for transport, it's something that I'm very eager to start on with our partners within the supply chain office.

We heard from HOPA about what their successes were within the investments that they're making, especially along the Welland Canal corridor.

My question is for Mr. Jean Aubry-Morin with respect to their intentions on behalf of the Seaway to economically develop the Welland Canal corridor in partnership with a lot of the stakeholders that exist there today.

Mr. Aubry-Morin.

[Jean Aubry-Morin]

Mr. Badawey, thanks for your question.

I'm going to start with one word—collaboration.

Right now there are six major projects along the Welland Canal corridor that we've put our support and expertise behind to make sure that the promoters themselves, the community and also the elected officials have all of the technical support necessary—from the concept level to the pre-project situation—so that all of the gaps and hurdles are removed as much as possible and every dollar that is invested in the corridor can get its full potential.

To go back to a comment that was made before—I think you mentioned it, Mr. Badawey—fluidity equals productivity. When it's not obtained.... Full fluidity will give us what we need.

What we're doing right now is supporting all these projects. For the one that we were talking about a minute ago, which was EV, critical minerals, water and power are three ingredients that will permit the supply chain to be successful in that case. That's the full support and collaborative contribution that we're doing.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Thank you very much.

We'll go to Mr. Martel for five minutes, please.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Witnesses, thank you for being with us this afternoon.

Mr. Aubry‑Morin, you said earlier that there was potential for export growth and that we had the capacity to do more. What are the barriers that are currently preventing us from doing more?

[Jean Aubry-Morin]

Mr. Martel, the simple answer to your question is that all the delays and inconveniences that negatively impact the movement of goods and commodities, whether by ship, rail or truck, are contributing to the lack of productivity that my colleagues alluded to a few moments ago. Having access to a certain capacity on the network, but not using it as effectively as possible, is the biggest barrier we are currently facing.

Accordingly, we need a system that allows for the optimization of all resources. The seaway is currently working on this by implementing a system that provides real-time management of information used for decision-making for pilotage, arrival at port, navigation and the use of seaway infrastructure.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

We know that business confidence in transportation infrastructure in this country has plummeted. In addition, Canada is now ranked 32nd in the world for its transportation infrastructure.

Mr. Aubry‑Morin, the corporation entered into a new agreement with Transport Canada in March. Does the agreement offer a new solution to the problem?

[Jean Aubry-Morin]

I could use the seaway productivity model. If we look at the investment in innovation and technology that has been made since the commercialization of the seaway in 1998, we can see that our productivity has more than doubled.

We also talked earlier about scanning equipment for the Canada Border Services Agency, as well as the use of pilotage services.

If the same approach to technology, innovation and infrastructure integration was used throughout the system, along with information-based decision-making, we would quickly see how the renewed long-term agreement with the federal government could allow us to become an influential player as well as a partner to the other agencies. We could then apply this type of business model elsewhere.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

In your opinion, what would be the biggest challenges in terms of our transportation infrastructure? What solutions do you propose?

[Jean Aubry-Morin]

Madam Chair, what has made the seaway an unqualified success is that it is a strong link at the heart of the supply chain.

There's also the issue of reliability and the ability to get a better return for every dollar invested in infrastructure. Let's take the example of a multi-million dollar investment in a lock made 25 years ago, which lasted 80 years. Today, that same amount allows us to extend the life of a lock to over 120 years. Being able to provide better reliability or better fluidity within the system will allow us to offer more predictability. As a result, it will enable us to make investments throughout the supply chain.

So the answer to your question would be better reliability, which would lead to greater productivity.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Thank you.

Mr. Hamilton, can you tell me more about how short sea shipping could improve the efficiency of our supply chain? I don't know if you can answer in 15 seconds.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Kyle Seeback]

I'm going to suggest that perhaps, if he wants, he can submit the answer to that question in writing.

We'll now move to Mr. Badawey for five minutes.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

We've heard a lot about the investments that are being made. I know that Mayor Steele, as well as Mr. Hamilton and Mr. Jean Aubry-Morin, spoke about some of the activities happening in the Niagara region and southwestern Ontario.

I'm wondering if Mr. Hamilton can hear me.

Ian, can you hear us?

He's trying to respond. I'm not sure he can.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Kyle Seeback]

He might try unplugging his headset and then plugging it back in again.

I'll hold your time while he does that, Mr. Badawey.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

No problem.

[Ian Hamilton]

Is that better now?

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

That's better. Perfect.

We spoke about the establishment of the Niagara ports trade corridor. Mr. Baldinelli brought up the investment in the mid-peninsula corridor, and I thank him for that. We spoke about the productivity that's happening—it may possibly be an anomaly in Canada, but that's what's happening in Niagara—based on a lot of the work that all of the partners are doing together in terms of collaboration, etc.

Mr. Hamilton, I'll ask you the same question I asked Mr. Aubry-Morin with respect to that corridor. What are your thoughts on how we expand the economic activity along that corridor?

Second, do you think a port authority being established along the Welland Canal corridor would be beneficial?

Lastly, on the development of properties that are currently managed by the St. Lawrence Seaway, some of which now are managed by the Hamilton-Oshawa Port Authority, owned by Transport Canada, how would that play into the productivity as well as the land or economic development within the Niagara region?

[Ian Hamilton]

I'll build on Mr. Aubry-Morin's statement around collaboration. Certainly we see that as the foundation for developing Niagara.

There has been a very positive reception from the region and all of the municipalities along the Welland Canal to HOPA's coming in and doing what we can to develop the area.

In addition to collaboration, I think there needs to be actual dollars and cents—infrastructure money—spent to develop the facilities along the Welland Canal so we can really tap into their potential.

One of the key areas is marrying together the different modes of transportation and ensuring that customers today have that modal choice. It was brought up earlier that we're not necessarily trying to move everything to marine. However, we are making sure that we can create the most sustainable supply chains by marrying together rail, marine and road and creating the ability to structure the supply chains in a way that has the most beneficial attributes in terms of cost, environmental impact and social benefits by reducing congestion.

I certainly believe that the track record of HOPA in Oshawa and in Hamilton in particular, along with the start we're off to in Niagara, would suggest that we could take on lands along the Welland Canal, and, in partnership with the St. Lawrence Seaway, find a very happy marriage where we can make the investments and work on that creation of those multimodal hubs and drive more cargo to the Seaway. We would applaud the expansion of authority into the Niagara region. In a lot of ways, this may have already happened by lands being transferred to HOPA's letters patent in the last few months.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Hamilton.

I have a final question for Mr. Reinas.

With the Niagara multimodal trade corridor being established, of course, one would think it would only be between lake to lake along the Welland Canal corridor. In the future, how do you see the town of Fort Erie and, in particular, the Peace Bridge being part of that multimodal trade corridor, especially as it relates to fluidity?

[Ron Reinas]

As has been discussed before, there's a lot of interconnectivity among all of the modes of transportation. Material that comes into Hamilton gets loaded on a truck from short-sea shipping at some point. A lot of times it has to cross the border, so it's all related. The more we can do to make sure that the border functions.... At the border, there has been a lot of investment in infrastructure. It's the non-infrastructure stuff that really needs work in terms of processing time.

There's no point putting a lot of money into building a new port of entry or expanding a port of entry and having 15 primary inspection booths if you're only going to staff half of them.

It's not just infrastructure; it's the human capital and the human resources, it's the processes and it's the procedures. All of it has to be interconnected amongst all of the modes.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Kyle Seeback]

Thank you.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

Thanks, Kyle.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Kyle Seeback]

Mr. Savard‑Tremblay, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Aubry‑Morin, let's pick up where we left off.

Several briefs submitted during the review indicated that the corporation's mandate could be updated to include an economic development component as well. So that would be a new mandate. It was also suggested, among other things, that the corporation could recover other operating costs from users, seek out commercial opportunities and provide instruments to increase non-toll system revenues.

In your opinion, what would be the benefits of granting the corporation new powers such as those?

[Jean Aubry-Morin]

Thank you for your question.

In my opinion, the idea of competition in the search for revenue should be approached with a great deal of caution.

I would like to go back to a concept that was explained at the outset. The St. Lawrence Seaway corridor supplies a market that, if it were a country, would be the third-largest economy in the world. The seaway supports the flow of goods and commodities from both the Canadian and U.S. economies. It's a binational route through the Welland Canal and other places. If we encouraged investments in this network or its development, it would mainly have the advantage of creating value within the Canadian and American economies.

The seaway is operated by a not-for-profit corporation that has successfully recovered its costs since its inception in 1998 and maintained its financial standing.

I hope that answers your question.

[Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Thank you.

Currently, your board of directors is made up of provincial, federal and industry representatives, including shippers and members from the grain and steel sectors. Do you think it would be appropriate to add some spots on the board of directors so as to include other groups, such as aboriginal communities, which we were talking about earlier, as well as unions and municipalities? Would your organization be open to giving these groups a statutory place?