Environment Committee on May 3rd, 2012

[Mary Simon]

I would say there has been a benefit, and it's highly supported by the region in terms of its development. Whether in fact it has almost eliminated unemployment in that area I can't answer directly at this point. We can get the figures for you. But I would assume there is a lot more opportunity for jobs. It depends on how and what those jobs are. As you know, our population up to today is still lagging behind in educational achievement, so sometimes it depends on how well someone is educated and can get those higher-paying jobs, not just the menial jobs.

These are still questions that confront us in the north.

[Robert Sopuck, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Marquette, MB]

Are you familiar with the environmental performance of that mine? Was it done in an environmentally sound way?

[Mary Simon]

As far as we're concerned, it was. There was an environmental review undertaken and the environmental review was accepted and people were involved in that review process.

[Robert Sopuck, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Marquette, MB]

My point was that I'm always looking for shining examples of sound economic development and high levels of environmental protection, and what I've heard is that the Baker Lake mine fulfills both.

I'd like to hear more, Ms. Simon, about the polar bear issue and where you see that going over the next little while. As you know, our government has been a strong defender of the Inuit polar bear hunt, and I presume we'll continue to do so. Polar bear stocks are in good shape, in your view. Could you elaborate?

[Mary Simon]

Yes, they are in good shape, despite the negative predictions of our closest neighbour. We have found that the population of polar bears has in fact increased because the polar bears are starting to come inland. The ice is melting. Polar bears live on ice and they hunt on ice, so when they have no food they start coming to the inland regions of the Arctic. In fact they are going into communities.

That's where the concern is right now. The threat to polar bears is not the hunting, it's climate change, and we have no control over what's happening on climate change. If it becomes ice-free, I don't know what's going to happen to the polar bears. They may adapt. I don't know. I'm not a scientist. But we know for sure they are becoming a threat more and more to the people who live in the communities. As you know, polar bears are vicious animals. They're beautiful, but they are nevertheless vicious.

Now we have polar bear watches in some of our communities when children go to school. Everybody walks to school. They don't want the children to confront polar bears in their community, because they do come into the communities.

[Robert Sopuck, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Marquette, MB]

Churchill has the same thing.

Mr. Farrant, one of the things that I like very much about the organized angling and hunting community is your active involvement in conservation programs.

You talked about the Atlantic salmon restoration program. Can you talk about some of the active programs in Ontario that either you or your member organizations are involved in? By active, I mean actually going out there and doing conservation work on the ground.

[The Chair, Conservative, Mark Warawa]

It will be a very short answer, because Mr. Sopuck is out of time.

[Greg Farrant]

I'll try to be brief again. I won't answer “yes” this time.

I can give you some basic examples in a very short fashion.

The invading species awareness program is on the ground across this province. We have 27 summer students that we hire as a hit squad in every corner of this province. We have a permanent staff up in Thunder Bay dealing with invasive species on Lake Superior. They work with cottage associations, municipalities, marine operators, bait operators, bait-fish communities, law enforcement, and all sorts of local groups on the ground, everything from wash your boats to don't throw your bait out—things like that on a very local level.

The stream steward program enhances habitat, restores habitat by planting trees, restoring streams, and things like that.

Both of them are Trillium award-winning programs from the Province of Ontario.

Those are a couple of examples.

[The Chair, Conservative, Mark Warawa]

Thank you so much.

Ms. Quach, you have five minutes.

[Anne Minh-Thu Quach, NDP, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you all for being here today to give us your information and to answer our questions. I am going to continue with Mr. Farrant.

Earlier, Ms. Leslie brought up the matter of protecting fish habitat. You mentioned establishing a dialogue with the minister that would include you to a greater extent. In the budget bill presently before the House, are you expecting the minister to make any changes that would address your concerns?

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Centre-North, AB]

Mr. Chair, I have a point of order.

[The Chair, Conservative, Mark Warawa]

A point of order, Ms. Rempel.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Centre-North, AB]

I believe my colleague is referring to the fisheries minister. I'd ask her that if she is going to talk about habitat, which is valid, that it stay focused to the scope of the national conservation plan.

[The Chair, Conservative, Mark Warawa]

Are there any other speakers to the point?

Madame Quach.

[Anne Minh-Thu Quach, NDP, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

The witness was talking about protecting fish habitat and wanted to know what the impact of better dialogue with the minister would be. In terms of that dialogue, I just wanted to know if he was expecting any changes to the budget that would protect fish habitat.

[The Chair, Conservative, Mark Warawa]

We have limited time, so I'm not going to take any more input on the point of order.

The point of order is relevant, in that we're a little bit off topic, off the scope. I began the meeting reading the six questions that dealt with the scope. I'd encourage us to focus on the creation of a national conservation plan.

Thank you.

[Anne Minh-Thu Quach, NDP, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Okay. I will ask my question another way. Mr. Farrant, do you feel that the government could amend its budget to provide better protection for fish habitat?

[Greg Farrant]

I'm not sure that the government needs to, based on what we are hearing from Fisheries and Oceans Canada, what we're hearing from the minister and his staff, and officials at the department now. We continue to ask questions about what the changes to the act are going to look like and what they're going to mean on the ground. Thus far, we're getting sound answers, we're getting positive answers that generally give us comfort of where this is going.

As to whether or not this will be reflected in changes to the budget act or other legislation is beyond my scope to comment on.

[Anne Minh-Thu Quach, NDP, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Great. Thank you. Let me move to Ms. Ricottone.

You also talked about protecting habitat. Do you feel that it is logical to have a conservation plan that would protect only some particular species rather than fish habitat in general?

[Julia Ricottone]

When I was referring to habitats, I was mainly referring to land habitats for plant and animal species.

In my opinion, yes, we should.

[Anne Minh-Thu Quach, NDP, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

You also talked about protecting urban areas.

How could the government help to decrease urban warming in a potential conservation plan? You touched on the matter quickly and it was very interesting. You spoke about guidelines that would set a minimum for parks and green spaces and mentioned how that would help to reduce the warming.

Could you give us a few more concrete examples of that and tell us the kinds of government proposals that could help to achieve it?

[Julia Ricottone]

Our goal with that is to help use green spaces in urban areas as connecting points of other conserved areas across the country, because plant and animal species don't live by our boundaries. So if there is a way we could influence more protection of those spaces in urban areas, then that would be beneficial to the overall plan.

[Anne Minh-Thu Quach, NDP, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Thank you.

Mr. Farrant, you mentioned the lack of funding and resources that prevents the plan being implemented to any significant degree. You also mentioned diseases that scientists are testing for and finding, and programs that could help to mitigate those diseases.

In terms of a national conservation plan, would investing more so that scientists could do more testing help with the conservation of more species?

[Greg Farrant]

Certainly more money is always a great idea, but there are a number of things the plan could recommend.

I want to be really clear about this. When we talk about things like wildlife diseases, and we talk about habitat, and we talk about invasive species, these are issues we've been raising with a succession of governments for 20 years in the case of invasive species, so it's not something that's particular to the current government.

More science is always beneficial, but there are a number of things in terms of wildlife disease, such as chronic wasting disease. Putting up a firewall in Canada to provide for no movement between jurisdictions requires no funding envelope. It requires some regulatory change, which is something the national conservation plan could certainly consider. But it's not a case of needing more money to do that; it's simply establishing some different standards, some new regulations to address that.

One of the other things we've long had an issue with—and it's not something that's universally shared across the country, and we recognize that—is the issue of game farms. Game farms are the vectors for the spread of chronic wasting disease. We've long encouraged both the provincial government in Ontario—all parties—and successive federal governments to look at the game farm issue in terms of how diseases spread. It's nose-to-nose contact with these animals, and for 30 years or more game farms have been the proven vectors of how chronic wasting disease gets into the natural population. So again, it's not a case of money, it's a case of jurisdictional regulation.

[The Chair, Conservative, Mark Warawa]

Thank you.

Mr. Toet, you have five minutes.