Evidence of meeting #7 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was applications.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Anita Biguzs  Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration
Les Linklater  Assistant Deputy Minister, Strategic and Program Policy, Department of Citizenship and Immigration
Wilma Vreeswijk  Associate Deputy Minister, Department of Citizenship and Immigration
Robert Orr  Assistant Deputy Minister, Operations, Department of Citizenship and Immigration

11:05 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

Good morning. This is the Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration, meeting number seven, on Thursday, November 28. This meeting is televised.

Appearing before us this morning is the Honourable Chris Alexander, Minister of Citizenship and Immigration. He has some of his colleagues here.

We're here today to discuss the supplementary estimates (B) under Citizenship and Immigration Canada.

Welcome, Minister. This is your first appearance before the best committee in the entire House of Commons.

11:05 a.m.

Ajax—Pickering Ontario

Conservative

Chris Alexander ConservativeMinister of Citizenship and Immigration

Thank you, Chair, and congratulations on your reappointment to this enormously prestigious position. If it is the best committee, and I firmly believe it is, that is in large measure because of your exceptional leadership.

11:05 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

All right, you've got 10 minutes.

11:05 a.m.

Some hon. members

Oh, oh!

11:05 a.m.

Conservative

Chris Alexander Conservative Ajax—Pickering, ON

I apologize for having come down the hall a minute or two late. We were under the misapprehension that a certain vote was still happening.

I am pleased to be here to present my department's supplementary estimates (A) for fiscal year 2013-2014 and to answer your questions together with two very talented deputy ministers from my department.

I am pleased to put the supplementary estimates in the context of the many positive reforms that we continue to implement to Canada's immigration system. These changes will help ensure that immigration has a more direct and positive impact on our economy. They will continue to reduce abuse of our immigration and asylum system and modernize the security dimension of our immigration system as the demands placed upon it by immigrants, by visitors, by students, and by business people continue to grow—and indeed need to grow for us to realize the growth potential of this country and to seize the moment that we are all very conscious deserves to be seized.

Supplementary estimates (B) include allocations that will help us continue to implement some of these important reforms, among them, and perhaps the most consequential, being an $8.4 million allocation to support the implementation of electronic travel authorization, or eTA. The eTA is a very quick online form for travellers who don't need visas to come to Canada. This simple process will help us to prevent criminals and terrorists from entering Canada and will protect the vast majority of legitimate travellers from being tied up in the bureaucracy and scrutiny that these higher-risk groups need to be subjected to.

Travel authorization for all visa-exempt passengers before ticket purchase will buttress Canada's security systems. It's a best practice. Many of our partners—maybe not many, but several—have it in full measure.

As you know, Mr. Chair, under the action plan on perimeter security and economic competitiveness, we committed to work with the United States to enhance the security of our borders, and eTA will allow us to screen visitors from countries that do not require a visa and who travel by air to Canada. The exception, of course, would be our American neighbours, who are with us inside the perimeter. Working together, our travel authorization systems will not only help to address possible security threats to North America, but they will also help us ease the flow of travellers who do not pose any potential risk to our countries. That's because we'll be able to identify and screen out inadmissible individuals while they're still overseas rather than when they arrive at a Canadian port of entry, which potentially represents a considerable cost savings as well.

Another commitment under the beyond the border initiative involves Canada and the U.S. working together to establish and coordinate entry and exit information systems. I know you have discussed these arrangements in this committee, and they have been raised at Public Safety as well. Under this initiative, Canada is developing a system to exchange land traveller information with the U.S. so that a record of land entry into one country is considered a record of exit from the other.

Once this system is in place, we will know who entered Canada and when they left, which is invaluable information when one is tracking the integrity of one's immigration and visitor visa system. This will provide my department with valuable, objective travel information that will assist with the processing of cases and identifying instances of fraud across multiple business lines.

Citizenship and Immigration Canada's supplementary estimates include an allocation of $1.2 million to upgrade our IT system to access entry and exit information.

To further protect our borders and safeguard our asylum system, $3 million is being allotted for the global assistance for irregular migrants program. This program furthers our government's commitment to combatting human smuggling, which regrettably and sadly is a profit-driven criminal activity that exploits vulnerable people and poses a threat to the integrity of our borders.

Through the program Canada is providing support to migrants who are intercepted as part of the destruction of a human smuggling operation. The program will also help manage the basic needs of intercepted migrants, ensuring that they have food, water, and shelter, as well as facilitate voluntary returns and reintegration in their country of origin.

As you know, Mr. Chair, under the 2012 budget implementation act passed by Parliament, CIC is terminating applications and returning fees paid by certain federal skilled worker applicants who applied before February 27, 2008. The elimination of this large backlog of applications will allow the department to focus on new applicants with the skills and talents our economy needs right now—talented people from around the world who will most successfully contribute to our future prosperity.

It also sets the stage for Canada's move from passive economic immigration to active recruiting under a new application intake system.

This relates to the dramatic reduction in processing times that we've seen for the federal skilled worker program, from seven or eight years at its peak in its legacy form we inherited from the previous Liberal government down to approximately one year now.

Mr. Chair, our number one priority remains the economy. Immigration is a key part of the government's plan to grow it, to spur job creation, and to ensure long-term prosperity for all Canadians. Our immigration plan for 2014 will help meet our economic needs by maintaining the highest sustained level of immigration in Canadian history.

As we continue to welcome record high numbers of immigrants, we are also committed to transforming the immigration system into one that is faster, more flexible and focused on meeting Canada's economic and labour market needs.

Let me emphasize that many of the immigration security measures being implemented by transfers made under these supplementary estimates (B) flow out of recommendations of this committee. If you look at electronic travel authorizations, the need for biometrics, migrant smuggling prevention, exit and entry, all of these relate to your previous studies, to your input, and so they are a matter of a high level of consensus within this Parliament and across Canada.

We have completely transformed the federal skilled worker program with new criteria to select skilled workers who will be better positioned to succeed and contribute to the Canadian economy. Let's keep in mind that the economic outcomes from our federal skilled worker program remain among the best we have, superior to almost every other immigration program in the country. We want them to stay that way.

We've also created new economic immigration programs that respond to emerging economic trends. Two have been launched this year alone. One of them is the start-up visa program, unique to Canada. It's a step to ensuring that entrepreneurs, particularly in the technology field, but anyone who wants to be part of this start-up nation, are cleared to become a permanent resident once they do a deal with a venture capital partner, an angel investor, or an incubator. This gives us a particular focus on innovation and entrepreneurship.

The other is the federal skilled trades program, created only in January in response to requests from Canadian employers to more quickly and efficiently bring to Canada skilled tradespeople to work in construction, transportation, manufacturing and service industries. The first ones, as you know, arrived in August.

Mr. Chair, these programs and our immigration system as a whole are vital to Canada's long-term economic health and to our competitiveness on the international stage and our long-term prosperity.

Immigration itself is a competitive field. The measures we are carrying forward with these estimates help us remain successful as we compete with other industrialized countries who must also rely on immigration to help fuel their economic growth. We want the best people to come here and not go there.

Our government fully believes that Canada can and should compete actively to attract the best and brightest newcomers to resettle here. To that end, as you all know, we've been working on a brand new recruitment model that will select immigrants based on the skills and attributes Canadian employers need. We're consulting the provinces, territories and employers on this new way of managing economic immigration applications that will create a pool of skilled workers to be matched to employers and who benefit from expedited processing.

We've discussed it here before. There will be two steps: firstly an indication of interest step, which will involve providing information electronically about skills, educational credentials, language ability, work experience, and other attributes. Those who meet the eligibility criteria will have their expressions of interest placed in a pool, placed in priority order, and ranked against others in the pool. Only the best candidates, including those with in-demand skills or job offers, will be invited to make a formal application for permanent residence.

It will be faster. We will only be inviting those in numbers we have the capacity to process. It will make our system dramatically better. Because candidates can only submit an immigration application if and when they are drawn from the pool and invited to apply, backlogs will become a thing of the past. We'll certainly be able to match application intake more efficiently to capacity and speed processing times

but that will be done through a well-established partnership with the provincial and territorial governments and with the private sector.

Mr. Chair, this new recruitment model is an effort to move from a passive approach to an active one, from the mechanical processing of applications in the order we receive them to the proactive selection of the people our economy needs from a very large pool of candidates—in other words, the best candidate, not the first one who applied.

Needless to say, it will be more responsive to Canada's ever-changing labour market needs and will help ensure that newcomers achieve greater success and make positive contributions to Canadian society as soon as possible after their arrival.

With these changes, Mr. Chair, we will remain on track to continue updating Canada's immigration program, modernizing it, and tailoring it to the needs of the 21st century economy, which moves at the speed of business and in which we compete with other potential countries with active immigration programs.

Thank you for your attention and for the opportunity to present. I look forward to your questions.

11:15 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

Thank you, Mr. Minister, for your presentation. The committee members will have some questions and comments.

Mr. Menegakis.

11:15 a.m.

Conservative

Costas Menegakis Conservative Richmond Hill, ON

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Minister, for joining us today and for your testimony.

I also want to thank our officials for joining us today. I look forward to hearing from all of you.

Let me begin by wishing all of our friends in the Jewish community who are celebrating today a Hag Hanukkah Sameach.

Minister, in your testimony you referred a fair bit to backlogs and the significant actions that our government has taken to reduce those backlogs. Could you tell us if no actions had been taken what the backlog would be today compared to what it is now?

11:15 a.m.

Conservative

Chris Alexander Conservative Ajax—Pickering, ON

Thanks for the question.

To take one very concrete example, which comes up a lot in our constituency work across the country, in the case of Chandigarh, backlogs are still an issue there, but the approval rate was also an issue. Until we reformed the regulation of consultants and strengthened our partnership with India to make sure integrity was on the agenda from both sides, we had a very low approval rate—34% in 2004. I'm proud to report that in 2012 it was 53% and it continues to rise. There has been a 19% increase.

On backlogs, in 2006 we inherited a backlog across the board, across all programs, of 843,434 applications, the better part of a million. It went up and peaked at a million before we had fully implemented the measures we now have in place, and since that peak it has steadily declined to the point where in 2013 we are at 475,000 with continued declines projected for next year and the year after. If no action had been taken, if we had remained on the same path, we would certainly be in the neighbourhood of 1.7 million in the backlog now, moving to two million and above next year.

Above and beyond that, Mr. Menegakis, as you know, we would be continuing to break faith with applicants, because we would be accepting applications that realistically we had no capacity to process. So the date when they would be processed would be ever further ahead. We've all read novels from great artists with famous names like Kafka and Orwell in which these kinds of things happened. They should never have happened in Canada, and we are proud to have made progress in ensuring they never happen again.

11:20 a.m.

Conservative

Costas Menegakis Conservative Richmond Hill, ON

Thank you.

Minister, can you comment on the wait times, now that our government has sustainably reduced the backlog in family reunification? How has the average waiting time changed?

11:20 a.m.

Conservative

Chris Alexander Conservative Ajax—Pickering, ON

For which kinds of applications? Visitors, immigrants...? Let me give you an example and then you tell me if there are other areas that are of interest.

With respect to the federal skilled workers program, there are hundreds of thousands in the backlog and a peak wait time of seven or eight years. Imagine an engineer who applied in 1995, 1994, 1999 to work in aerospace engineering, advanced manufacturing, or the oil sands, only to be told that his or her application would be processed in seven or eight years. The engineer won't be accepted necessarily, just processed. How do you plan your career in that case? How do you know what the Canadian economy will look like in seven or eight years? How do you know what to do in the interim?

No one plans his life like that, and we were wrong to expect that we would get the economic immigrants we needed with such a long backlog.

Today, following the measures your committee has helped us take, the waiting time is one year. The points system has been changed. The assessments of our labour market are improving, and the match between federal skilled workers and the real needs of employers is tighter than ever.

Under expression of interest, it's going to go from one year down to six months. We hope it will go below that, but let's start with six months. That will be a major improvement and also put us in a very competitive frame.

With regard to parents and grandparents, there has been some controversy. When we came into office, it was 64 months or more. Then, because the policy was in place, more applications were coming, not enough were being processed, and the wait time went up. We are proud to say that now the backlog for parents and grandparents is smaller than it was when we came into office. It was 108,000, and now it's something like 90,000, or will be by the end of this year. The wait time is 64 months or less, and last year, 2012, this year, 2013, and next year, 2014, we will have admitted a record number of parents and grandparents, while managing the intake of new applications so that we're not taking them under false pretenses. We are also positioning ourselves to re-open to a limited number of new applications in 2014.

In addition, while trying to restore trust with families who want their parents and grandparents here and who have a right to expect reasonable processing times, we've innovated. Not every parent and grandparent wants to come as an immigrant. We put in place the super visa, which has proven to be more popular than anyone anticipated. More than a thousand are being issued per month, not just in India, but around the world. We have multiple-entry visas, secure access for weddings, visas to help with child care. These serve all kinds of purposes, without putting an enormous additional cost on the Canadian health care system, because the families themselves assume the cost of health insurance.

11:20 a.m.

Conservative

Costas Menegakis Conservative Richmond Hill, ON

Thank you very much, Minister. That's a very thorough response that covered everything.

I'm done, Mr. Chair, with my questions.

11:20 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

You are indeed.

Mr. Cash.

November 28th, 2013 / 11:20 a.m.

NDP

Andrew Cash NDP Davenport, ON

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'd like to thank the members of your team, Minister, for taking the time out of what is no doubt an incredibly busy schedule to be here before this committee.

As I listen to you, it almost sounds as though your government hadn't been the government for the last eight years and that wait times were simply and exclusively caused by the former government. For anyone listening to this deliberation at home, immigrants waiting years and years to get word on whether their parents or grandparents will be able to unite with them here in Canada, your deliberations today offer cold comfort, as they do for the parade of people who come to our offices asking for help.

Through these estimates, we see that CIC is getting extra funds for operating expenditures. What isn't clear is how these funds are going to reduce wait times for families waiting to reunite or for live-in caregivers waiting to get their permanent residency. There are outrageously long waits for those in that program. The moratorium on parent and grandparent applications will continue in January, with a limit of 5,000 applications per year. People are already facing excessive wait times to reunite with their families. According to your own website this morning, the waits are more than eight years for countries like China, India, the Philippines, and Sri Lanka.

If the CIC is receiving more money for its operations, why is this cap in place? How are wait times going to come down for those who have been waiting for years for permanent residency through the live-in caregiver program or for their parents and grandparents?

11:25 a.m.

Conservative

Chris Alexander Conservative Ajax—Pickering, ON

Thank you, Mr. Cash, for the question.

Everything we do is focused on reducing those backlogs and wait times, and we have brought them down overall by 50% or more, and even more dramatically in the federal skilled worker program. For parents and grandparents, I went into some detail about what we've done; and yes, the backlog is not gone, but those in the backlog are being processed at an unprecedented rate.

I hope that when Canadians, whoever they are, applicants or relatives of applicants, come into our offices as MPs, they get this information. It's certainly there on our website. It's certainly there in the testimony in front of this committee that 25,000 parents and grandparents—a record number—were processed in 2012, that even more will be processed this year, and that the super visa is available. We want families to have those options and we want that backlog to come down.

Yes, we opened up a limited number of new applications last year, but that's because we're processing 20,000 more applications from the backlog. You won't find any other country, in any jurisdiction, that is as generous to families as we have been, and rigorous in protecting and processing the applications of those submitted in this case.

What we don't want is a return to the dark days when we were accepting applications under a misapprehension. People thought we had the capacity to process them and would process them right away. In fact, we were piling them onto inventories. We're no longer doing that.

11:25 a.m.

NDP

Andrew Cash NDP Davenport, ON

I just want to get to the point about our not having the capacity, which you've repeated twice now. Do you mean you simply don't have enough people to process the applications? Might not that have something to do with cuts, right across, on the government’s side?

What are you talking about when you say you don't have the capacity? What does that mean?

11:25 a.m.

Conservative

Chris Alexander Conservative Ajax—Pickering, ON

This government has put more resources into Citizenship and Immigration than ever before—

11:25 a.m.

NDP

Andrew Cash NDP Davenport, ON

But what does it mean when you say you don't have the capacity?

11:25 a.m.

Conservative

Chris Alexander Conservative Ajax—Pickering, ON

We are processing the largest sustained levels of absolute numbers of immigration in Canadian history, and we have the resources to do that. What we don't have the resources to do is more than that.

If we accept applications that would justify twice or three times the immigration we're getting, we wouldn't have the resources to process those. We have the resources to process our immigration levels planned for 2014, which are at the same levels we've had in recent years. In fact, the target is slightly higher: 63% economic immigration; 26% family reunification, a very strong number; and 11% refugee and humanitarian cases, which is still a strong number. We have the resources to do that, but we don't have the resources to process applications that are not part of that plan. Yes, some of that plan involves processing applications that are in inventories.

On live-in caregivers, if I can just respond to your earlier question, we are also taking action. It's not part of the supplementary estimates (B), because we have those resources already in place under our levels plan, but we are committed to processing 17,500 live-in caregivers from that backlog, which also grew under the Liberals and continues to grow and which needs to come down.

11:30 a.m.

NDP

Andrew Cash NDP Davenport, ON

Okay.

You mentioned the EOI system again today. I appreciate that this is a brand-new system you're rolling out in 2015, but I want to ask you about it again, because you've made the remarkable statement that for federal skilled workers you're going to bring these wait times down to six months.

11:30 a.m.

Conservative

Chris Alexander Conservative Ajax—Pickering, ON

Exciting, isn't it?

11:30 a.m.

NDP

Andrew Cash NDP Davenport, ON

When are we going to see the ministerial instructions outlining the invitation criteria? When are we going to see that criteria and turn this from a campaign slogan into some real policy here?

11:30 a.m.

Conservative

Chris Alexander Conservative Ajax—Pickering, ON

Well, anyone who's been following the estimates process, the budgetary process, the legislative process, will know that we are engaged with the budget implementation act, which we discussed last time, in our third round of legislative changes to support expression of interest. A lot of what we're doing with backlogs and so forth is to prepare the ground for expression of interest. On the exact timing of ministerial instructions to govern the final criteria, I will defer to my colleagues.

But keep in mind that expression of interest is not a new program. There is a tendency to say the criteria are changing and the collection is changing—

11:30 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

We have to move on, gentlemen.

11:30 a.m.

Conservative

Chris Alexander Conservative Ajax—Pickering, ON

I’ll just say that it’s a framework for the existing programs. For the federal skilled-worker program, the criteria changed in May. You all know about that. It's in force. Those will remain the criteria unless we change them,and we don't have a current plan to change them. Under the EOI, it's January 1, 2015.

11:30 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative David Tilson

Thank you.

Mr. McCallum.