Official Languages Committee on Nov. 24th, 2011

[Suzanne Bossé]

In fact, there are various ways. The Roadmap targets and performance indicators, in most cases, were not identified in collaboration with the communities. In many cases, we were not consulted for the purpose of setting those targets. So we realized that they do not correspond at all to what we would have liked. In fact, we would have liked the targets to be higher. In immigration, for example, the target is a 1.8% increase in the number of immigrants in our communities, whereas we are aiming for a minimum of 4.4%.

Various means have been used in the past. For example, surveys have been conducted by departments such as Canadian Heritage. There have also been surveys, research. We have had round tables with management and the elected representatives of organizations. Summative evaluations are underway. We have to ensure that our communities, our citizens, are an integral part of those exercises. These are all very valid methods, but, in some cases, they have been abandoned in the past few years.

[Bernard Trottier, Conservative, Etobicoke—Lakeshore, ON]

I would like to speak before putting the question to the Fédération acadienne de la Nouvelle-Écosse.

It is no easy matter to have truly consistent performance measures across the country. The census is not conducted frequently enough to measure linguistic vitality. For example, to get mid-term feedback, we can't tell from census results what change has occurred between 2008 and 2011.

How could we start up a measurement process for the next version of the Roadmap? Perhaps the Nova Scotia people could describe that approach?

[Jean Léger]

I'd like to develop a concept that has always interested me for Nova Scotia, for example, because it's a concept that is extensively used in Quebec, particularly in the RCMs, where there are research observatories on the region itself.

As for the francophone community, we don't really have those research observatories that would make it possible to compile studies on the communities. I believe there would be a lot of benefits in setting up this kind of initiative because the departments could also take advantage of them, as well as the communities and organizations.

As to what indicators should be used and how the data will be measured, I'm not a methodology expert. However, I believe there are strategic factors, such as these observatories, that could enable that.

When I presented my brief to you earlier, that's what I said. At some point, we need more research and innovation. The research observatories could be one way to do that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you.

[Suzanne Bossé]

I would like to raise one point that I consider quite important. In a number of studies that are currently being done by the departments, the language issue is not included. They're trying to define the francophone economic space by working at Statistics Canada, Industry Canada, Human Resources and Skills Development Canada, but the language question is never raised. So how can we manage to develop profiles of anything?

Incredible research is being done in the departments. I have learned a lot about Human Resources and Skills Development Canada this week. There is a departmental research plan, six research themes, 20 research units in the department. However, the communities have access to absolutely none of that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you.

Mr. Aubin.

[Robert Aubin, NDP, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I'll take 10 seconds to assure Mr. Bélanger of the support of the NDP members for his motions, since they support the positions the party has held for a long time. So we'll be there.

Welcome and thanks to each of our guests. Thank you for your clear presentations, which I believe really strike a good balance between the strengths and weaknesses of the Roadmap.

I noted that mention was often made of the lack of clarity in the investments and in the consultation process, and I would even say in the assessment that we are conducting. That has made me think, as I meet the groups, that we can say virtually whatever we want in the report we come up with in March, since the methodology underlying the evaluation is unclear to say the least.

Let's move on immediately to the next Roadmap because that's perhaps where our efforts should be focused. What can we do better?

I have barely five minutes at my disposal. Without wanting to interfere in your speaking time, I'm going to ask you to give me concise answers. You know that we are in the midst of a budget-cutting process. Are you afraid that what might appear as funding in a future Roadmap is what is put on a platter and then withdrawn from recurring programs? Have you heard of any cutbacks that might affect you?

[Marie-France Kenny]

We've had no wind of that, but that's definitely a concern.

We've seen it here; there are certain things. For example, the Treasury Board Secretariat already existed, but it's been put here. So it's entirely funded by the Roadmap. However, it was already there and it was already providing services.

Since it was put there, does that means that it's an investment that will no longer be made? If there is no more Roadmap, will the Official Languages Secretariat responsible for designating offices disappear? I imagine it won't, but we have to ensure that there is continuity in the investments. That's why we're saying this isn't clear. We're not saying the investments aren't being made; we simply don't know.

[Robert Aubin, NDP, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Mr. Robichaud, did you want to add something on this question? No. That's fine.

In your presentations, you talk at length about consultations and genuine collaboration that you would like to see established among the various departments. Fifteen departments are already involved in the Roadmap.

I have two brief questions. Are there any departments not currently involved in the Roadmap that you would like to see join the next Roadmap?

Do you have a suggestion to make regarding the involvement of those various departments? Shouldn't they be spearheaded by a single department that sets guidelines? There could be a kind of single window. Do you really have to beg and knock on all the doors of every department every time?

[Ronald Robichaud]

I could add that, in our province, we have an overall development plan for the Acadian community and our 29 member associations. Under the next Roadmap, we would like there to be a collaborative relationship with the government on how that funding will meet the needs of the province's overall plan for all our member associations and all our communities because they need all possible assistance.

We're still trying to survive in terms of our cultural and linguistic activities. We need all possible assistance, and the Roadmap is a very effective tool. We would like to increase the plan's effectiveness.

[Marie-France Kenny]

If I may add something, the Community Strategic Plan is also adjusted to the overall development plans. So we have a big plan for the community as a whole. We suggest further aligning it with the priorities of the new Roadmap.

Would we like other departments? Ideally, we would like them all. However, it would be good to reinforce what's already in the Roadmap. Consequently, it should not be forgotten that, as regards network capacity, the plate is already full and our resources are way overexploited. Reinforcing the capacity of our association network would be necessary and well received.

[Suzanne Bossé]

I don't think the important thing is to add departments.

I think we first have to take the Community Strategic Plan with the issues and investment priorities that are identified. We have to ask ourselves what departments are relevant to the plan, with the overall development plans, of course, because that forms a whole.

[Robert Aubin, NDP, Trois-Rivières, QC]

So it would be preferable to start with the communities and move up to the departments, rather than the reverse, if I understand correctly.

Mr. Léger wanted to add something.

[Jean Léger]

I would like to speak. Given the economic challenges that our country and the world are facing, I believe the economic departments and agencies should play an enhanced role.

For example, I note the absence of Industry Canada. That's not clear. I believe the Department of Industry should be at the table and take part in the work, as well as all the agencies that are part of Industry Canada. I believe that francophones and Acadians must also be prepared for the current economic challenges.

That department should be a participant in the plan.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you, Mr. Aubin.

Thank you, Mr. Léger.

Mr. Weston, go ahead, please.

[John Weston, Conservative, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thanks as well to our guests today.

My name is John Weston and I come from British Columbia. I like to listen to stories about the use of French. I think French has developed in all parts of our great country.

It is our role as legislators to be accountable to the Canadian people. We occasionally criticize the government. It is normally the opposition's role to do that, but we do that as well. It's good

to catch them doing things right.

I believe the minister should hear your report, Mr. Robichaud. In future, it will be very important to know what we've done right when increasing pressure is being brought to bear regarding the budget.

My first question is for all of you. This government is putting the emphasis on accounting and efficiency.

In five words or less, what could we do to improve the Roadmap? You mentioned coordinating departments. Is there anything else?

Mr. Robichaud, you may begin.

[Ronald Robichaud]

We think there should be increased collaboration. We are the mouthpiece of the community, and we do a very good job with all the member associations.

There should be greater collaboration and better communication between the community and government. That would make it possible to know how projects are advancing, how they are being measured and how we can build on good results achieved by the other provinces. That would also provide better services to our member associations and to the citizens of our communities.

[John Weston, Conservative, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you.

And you, Ms. Kenny?

[Marie-France Kenny]

I can say it in seven words: targets and performance indicators established through consultation.

[John Weston, Conservative, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you very much, that's very specific.

Ms. Bossé, what do you think?

[Suzanne Bossé]

We talked about consultation. I would say reinforce capacity for better data collection.

[John Weston, Conservative, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Thank you.

Mr. Léger, it's your turn.

[Jean Léger]

I would say: impact, dialogue, transparency, collaboration and innovation.

[John Weston, Conservative, West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC]

Perfect. Thank you very much. The gold star.

After 50 years of linguistic duality in Canada, what is your vision, Mr. Robichaud? Would that vision be realized with or without government financial support?

[Ronald Robichaud]

An increase in the number of francophones in the provincial cultural, economic and political fields. In other words, take our place.