Evidence of meeting #44 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was aveos.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Louise-Hélène Sénécal  Assistant General Counsel, Law Branch, Air Canada
Michel Bissonnette  Senior Director, Engines and Airframe Maintenance, Air Canada
Joseph Galimberti  Director, Government Relations, Air Canada

11:15 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Law Branch, Air Canada

Louise-Hélène Sénécal

Whether the act applies or not is an issue of legal interpretation. I cannot give you a legal opinion today but we feel that our actions comply with our responsibilities. It is our intention to continue in that manner in the future.

11:15 a.m.

Liberal

John McCallum Liberal Markham—Unionville, ON

During this process and the possible restructuring of who the employer of these workers is, have you sought any assurances from Aveos about maintaining its facilities in Canada? Have you discussed that with Aveos? Have you sought undertakings from them that they will stay in Canada?

11:15 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Law Branch, Air Canada

Louise-Hélène Sénécal

Trade discussions between ourselves and Aveos are confidential. Our business is as a Canadian transporter. It is therefore in our interest that maintenance services not be located too far away.

11:15 a.m.

Liberal

John McCallum Liberal Markham—Unionville, ON

Perhaps Mr. Guimond will have better luck with the witnesses than I have.

I don't think I got very far.

You go, Gerry.

11:15 a.m.

Liberal

Gerry Byrne Liberal Humber—St. Barbe—Baie Verte, NL

Is it built into the contract between Air Canada and Aveos that there have to be activities or facilities in the key centres you were referring to?

11:15 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Law Branch, Air Canada

Louise-Hélène Sénécal

I do not know the contract clauses by heart. I cannot answer that question today.

11:15 a.m.

Liberal

Gerry Byrne Liberal Humber—St. Barbe—Baie Verte, NL

Can you forward to the committee a formal answer on behalf of Air Canada? That's a fundamental question.

11:15 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Law Branch, Air Canada

Louise-Hélène Sénécal

I understand your question.

A commercial contract contains clauses of confidentiality. It is not only up to us to determine if I can provide you with this information.

11:15 a.m.

Liberal

Gerry Byrne Liberal Humber—St. Barbe—Baie Verte, NL

This is becoming bizarre, because we're examining a public statute with certain requirements built into it that Air Canada must maintain aviation maintenance facilities in three key centres. I'm asking a very simple question. The company in question has contracted out those services that would normally be encompassed by the legislation.

So can you not tell this committee whether or not you have built into clauses within the contract that your supplier of maintenance services must provide those services in the three areas we're concentrating on?

11:20 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Law Branch, Air Canada

Louise-Hélène Sénécal

I do not have the contract clauses before me. As I stated, a trade agreement binds two parties: Air Canada and Aveos. I am not in a position today to confirm anything nor to provide you with the clause itself. However we can look into this. If the clause is not confidential, I will be able to share it with you. If it is, we will let you know.

11:20 a.m.

Liberal

Gerry Byrne Liberal Humber—St. Barbe—Baie Verte, NL

Can I ask for a timeline on when we can receive that?

11:20 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Law Branch, Air Canada

Louise-Hélène Sénécal

I can tell you that if Aveos wants to outsource to parties that are not a part of their company, then it must obtain our consent.

11:20 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Merv Tweed

If you can get that information, please provide it to me and I'll distribute it to the members of the committee.

11:20 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Law Branch, Air Canada

11:20 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Merv Tweed

Thank you.

Monsieur Guimond.

11:20 a.m.

Bloc

Michel Guimond Bloc Montmorency—Charlevoix—Haute-Côte-Nord, QC

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

My first question is for you, Ms. Sénécal. Is the Air Canada Public Participation Act still in effect?

11:20 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Law Branch, Air Canada

Louise-Hélène Sénécal

To my knowledge it is.

11:20 a.m.

Bloc

Michel Guimond Bloc Montmorency—Charlevoix—Haute-Côte-Nord, QC

I have a copy of the act before me. I would like to draw your attention to a section in the act which states the conditions that the newly privatized Air Canada was subject to. Paragraph 6(1)(e) requires that Air Canada maintain its headquarters in the Montreal urban community.

Do you believe that you are subject to that provision?

11:20 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Law Branch, Air Canada

Louise-Hélène Sénécal

Section 6 deals with the terms and conditions of the continuation clauses. The continuation clauses include those terms.

11:20 a.m.

Bloc

Michel Guimond Bloc Montmorency—Charlevoix—Haute-Côte-Nord, QC

I can read. Sub-section 6(1) reads as follows: “The articles of continuance of the corporation shall contain”, and paragraph 6(1)(e) refers to the head office.

Do you feel that you are still bound by that clause?

11:20 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Law Branch, Air Canada

Louise-Hélène Sénécal

By the way, the Montreal urban community no longer exists. Our continuation clauses must contain a provision that the head office—

11:20 a.m.

Bloc

Michel Guimond Bloc Montmorency—Charlevoix—Haute-Côte-Nord, QC

I will read paragraph 6(1)(d):

(d) provisions requiring the corporation to maintain operational and overhaul centres in the City of Winnipeg, the Montreal Urban Community and the City of Mississauga;

I would like to ask a question of Mr. Bissonnette, the Senior Director, Engines and Airframe Maintenance. Please be brief because I have several other questions. Could you please explain what the difference is between a maintenance centre and an overhaul centre?

11:20 a.m.

Michel Bissonnette Senior Director, Engines and Airframe Maintenance, Air Canada

Overhaul and repair centres are what I would consider heavier types of operations. Operational centres can be considered as line maintenance operations, but overhaul and repair centres perform long-term maintenance on engines, airframe, and components.

11:20 a.m.

Bloc

Michel Guimond Bloc Montmorency—Charlevoix—Haute-Côte-Nord, QC

Ms. Sénécal, are you of the opinion that Air Canada is complying with the continuation clause that states that you must maintain operational and overhaul centres in the cities of Winnipeg, Mississauga and the Montreal urban community?

11:20 a.m.

Assistant General Counsel, Law Branch, Air Canada

Louise-Hélène Sénécal

As I stated in my opening remarks, yes.