Transport Committee on June 3rd, 2014

[Ed Komarnicki, Conservative, Souris—Moose Mountain, SK]

One area that was raised was the transportation of dangerous goods.

In previous hearings we talked about liability insurance. Are there any issues in terms of carrying sufficient insurance? Is liability insurance a factor at all for the airline industry?

[Capt Scott Wilson]

Not to my understanding.

[Ed Komarnicki, Conservative, Souris—Moose Mountain, SK]

I guess that would take care of my time.

[The Chair, Conservative, Larry Miller]

Mr. Wilson, to follow up, there were a number of questions brought up today about WestJet's exemption, going from a ratio of 1:40 to 1:50. I know that we've all flown on a number of international airlines for whatever reason, and I know a lot of them that come here, if not all of them, have all been operating for years with a more or less competitive advantage when they come into Canada with the ratio of 1:50.

Since the exemption, has your company experienced any safety-related issue because of the exemption, or do you know of any other company that regularly flies into Canada that has had a safety issue because of the fact that they're using that 1:50 ratio? Could you comment on that, please?

[Capt Scott Wilson]

Yes. We've certainly experienced no safety issues operating on one in 50 versus one in 40. In fact, as we've stated before, it's quite easily an equivalent level of safety, and we see many benefits that provide extra safety barriers that we're watching.

As far as an international standard is concerned, when we reviewed, nothing pointed directly toward a concern around operating one in 50. As I said, it's the operational standard. When you look at the percentage of flights that operate under that regulatory jurisdiction versus in Canada or the United States, it far outweighs from that perspective.

[The Chair, Conservative, Larry Miller]

Thank you very much.

We are down to our last questions. You have about two and a half or three minutes, Ms. Morin, and then there will be one more on this side.

[Isabelle Morin, NDP, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC]

I want to come back to what Mr. Wilson said earlier. It's more of a comment than a question.

You spoke about the Australian authorities and exemptions. Yet, according to the information I have here, there were exemptions in 2010, and they apply to certain types of aircraft designed for a 1:50 ratio of personnel on board to passengers. So we are not talking about all aircraft.

Moreover, in 2011, the committee made recommendations that the government upheld. Recommendation 6 stated:

That the Civil Aviation Safety Authority cease providing new exemptions to the 1:36 cabin crew ratio currently mandated by Civil Aviation Order 20.16.3, and that all exemptions to the Order currently in place not be renewed upon expiry.

Recommendation 7 read as follows:

That the 1:36 ratio be retained until such a time that it can be demonstrated that a change to a 1:50 cabin crew ratio in Australia will not result in reduced levels of safety or security.

That's what happened in Australia.

That was a comment. I will now let my colleague ask his questions.

[Mike Sullivan, NDP, York South—Weston, ON]

Mr. Wilson, most of your fleet in fact will have one less flight crew. The 737-700s and the 800s all have a passenger ratio that will cause you to have four where you used to have five, or three where you used to have four. It's only the 600s that have 119 seats. Am I correct?

[Capt Scott Wilson]

That's correct, partially, sir. I mean, the challenge would be in any one day, even an 800 could operate with two flight attendants under one in 40 if there were only 80 customers.

[Mike Sullivan, NDP, York South—Weston, ON]

Yes, exactly.

My final question is for all of you.

There has been some controversy recently about the use of wet leases and temporary foreign pilots by airlines. I don't know if any of you are employing temporary foreign pilots, except Air Canada Rouge might be; I'm not sure.

The public is concerned about the nature of.... How are those people involved, if they are, in a safety management system when they're temporary and they're foreign?

[Marc-André O'Rourke]

We have made submissions with respect to the wet lease policy and temporary foreign workers. I'll let Dave comment on the safety, but as far as our airlines are concerned, the safety management system is again a company-wide system. It should capture all the operations.

[The Chair, Conservative, Larry Miller]

We are out of time. I understand that the Conservatives don't want.... I'm going to give the witnesses two minutes to....

Do you have a point of order or something?

[David McGuinty, Liberal, Ottawa South, ON]

I do, yes, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Larry Miller]

A point of order?

[David McGuinty, Liberal, Ottawa South, ON]

Correct.

Through you, Mr. Chair, I'm wondering if we could ask the witnesses if they're prepared to table for the committee, on the basis of a question I put to them earlier which they were incapable of answering, or perhaps through the National Airlines Council of Canada, whether we could get for our deliberative purposes here, an indication from each of the airlines what the financial implications are for each company moving from a 1:50 to 1:40 flight attendant ratio, the savings, the costs, the negligibility, whatever it might be. Through you, could we ask the witnesses whether they are prepared to deliver that up?

[The Chair, Conservative, Larry Miller]

Okay, I'll leave that with them. If they're....

[Marc-André O'Rourke]

I'll leave here and we'll discuss it. We'll get back to you. We'll undertake to consider that request.

[The Chair, Conservative, Larry Miller]

Two minutes for any closing comments. I'll allow that.

[Marc-André O'Rourke]

I really just want to thank you again. We do sincerely appreciate the opportunity to be here. Hopefully, we were able to clarify some of the misconceptions of SMS. Our airlines are incredibly passionate about this. Safety is the most important thing for an airline, and SMS is a great tool to enhance that.

Thank you again for having us.

[The Chair, Conservative, Larry Miller]

Thank you very much, gentlemen, all of you, for being here.

The meeting is adjourned.