Veterans Affairs Committee on Oct. 24th, 2012

[The Chair, Conservative, Greg Kerr]

I call the meeting to order.

I want to remind the committee that we want to take the last 20 minutes or so for business. We should have lots of time, with one panel and two witnesses.

I want to welcome the co-chairs. Rear-Admiral Andrew Smith, chief of military personnel and co-chair of the DND/VAC joint steering committee, has certainly been very active in veterans' activities.

From the department, we've seen as a witness once or twice before Keith Hillier, assistant deputy minister of service delivery, and also co-chair of the DND/VAC joint steering committee.

Gentlemen, as you know, you will have your opening statements, and then we will go to the panel members here for questions. We certainly look forward to your information this afternoon, and again welcome.

We will start with Admiral Smith.

[Rear-Admiral Andrew Smith, Chief of Military Personnel, Co-Chair of the DND/VAC Joint Steering Committee, Department of National Defence]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Ladies and gentlemen, the last time I appeared before this committee was in February of this year. My preparation for today's exchange brought to mind the study you are undertaking with respect to the red tape initiative. I find this encouraging because in my area of endeavour, system efficiency means system responsiveness, something I care about. I gather from your focus on responsiveness that we are very much on the same page.

There is no doubt in my mind that a reduction in red tape and in the number of levels of approval will enable us to get faster results for the clients we all care about. This streamlining for a more timely provision of support and services to our ill and injured personnel is great news and a welcome sign of progress.

As Chief of Military Personnel, I set the priorities that orient the personnel strategies of the Canadian Forces and their related operations. This year, my priorities are the following: the ill and the injured; mental health; and the modernization of individual training and education.

Over the last four years, I have been increasingly reminded of the need for the Canadian Forces and Veterans Affairs Canada not only to understand each other's culture, but also to enhance their capacity to jointly serve veterans and military personnel.

It is up to us to ensure that all initiatives and policies for the ill and injured, and in support of mental health, are jointly developed by our two institutions so as to provide Canada's men and women in uniform with a seamless transition to their new pursuits and their new lives. The Canadian Forces and Veterans Affairs Canada serve the same group of great men and women. They just do it at different times in their careers and in their lives.

It is clear that the Canadian Forces and Veterans Affairs form a family. Our commitment to Canadian Forces personnel, to the Government of Canada, and to Canadians who care about their military compatriots holds strong.

Since 1997, the Canadian Forces and Veterans Affairs Canada organizations have variously strengthened their working relationship. So it was that each embedded a liaison officer with the other's organization. From 1998 on, those officers have represented their home organization and served as advisors on programs, services, legislation, and on a range of challenges that Canadian Forces personnel and veterans must contend with. The liaison officer concept is a most effective channel of communication between the Canadian Forces and Veterans Affairs Canada.

In 1999 the CF-VAC steering committee was established in response to the recommendations of the Standing Committee on National Defence and Veterans Affairs report, released in October 1998. This report would in fact guide the implementation of the steering committee for the next two years, according to its initial goal of improving the quality of life of Canadian Forces personnel and Canadian veterans.

The committee achieved its goal by providing an overarching governance structure for the deployment of CF and VAC initiatives along with strategic direction and guidance for all CF-VAC committees and working groups. It was on February 1, 1999, that the first steering committee would take place.

The original objectives of the steering committee were to support the Government of Canada's vision for the Canadian Forces, which consists in recognizing the contributions, sacrifices and achievements of Canadian Forces personnel, veterans and their families, by meeting their evolving needs through harmonized programs and services to enable their seamless transition.

Our programs for the ill and injured military members who require assistance during reintegration are part of this objective. Our provision of continuous support during the sometimes demanding release process, which leads from military to civilian life, is also part of it.

In December 2010, our collective drive for continuous business improvements in the service of military personnel brought us to revise the steering committee's terms of reference so that we would more effectively follow the principles of governance. The new terms of reference focused more closely on decision-making and the setting of goals and priorities with concrete deliverables and clearly defined responsibilities. The aim of this revision was to channel the work of the steering committee members along the lines of their areas of responsibility and thus generate concrete outcomes for programs and services while strengthening the joint CF-VAC capacity to serve the constituencies that they oversee.

We took care to commit to an ongoing review protocol that would include the revision of the terms of reference. In this manner, as the needs of our clients changed, the steering committee was able to remain responsive to them.

In November 2011, Veterans Affairs Canada witnessed a significant shift take place, in that it now has a client base preponderantly made up of serving personnel and modern-day veterans rather than World War II and Korean War veterans. The steering committee discussed this change, so that in September 2012, we undertook another review of the steering committee's terms of reference. The resulting document will be completed, approved and signed for the next steering committee meeting in December 2012.

The CF-VAC steering committee reports directly to the VAC deputy minister and to the Chief of the Defence Staff through their respective co-chairs, those being VAC's ADM for service delivery and me as the chief of military personnel.

As a decision-making body that was established to strengthen the working relationship between VAC and the CF, the steering committee continues to provide strategic direction and oversee VAC and CF initiatives that affect their clienteles of VAC and the Canadian Forces.

The committee consists of two co-chairs and a forum of 12 senior leaders who come from both organizations and the Royal Canadian Mounted Police.

These institutions are represented by senior leaders and directors whose mandates includes the care of veterans, ill and injured and deceased CF personnel, and their families.

The committee members are constantly seeking ways to improve services and to ensure that the committee's decisions are relevant and support Canadian Forces personnel and veterans who are ill or injured, or who require assistance during their transition period.

The steering committee meets twice a year—once in Charlottetown and once in Ottawa. The agenda we establish is reflective of the progress that has been made, and the program and service developments of our respective organizations.

I submit to you that the CF-VAC steering committee is indeed a successful partnership and a model of collaboration that benefits our diverse and deserving clientele of military personnel and veterans.

My colleague, and someone who I often refer to as my “professional cousin”, Mr. Hillier of Veterans Affairs, will speak to the joint priorities established between the Canadian Forces and Veterans Affairs and some of the other accomplishments that stem from the exchanges of the steering committee.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Greg Kerr]

Thank you, Admiral Smith.

I'm not sure how Mr. Hillier is going to react to you two being related, but we look forward to his comments.

Go ahead, Mr. Hillier, please.

[Keith Hillier, Assistant Deputy Minister, Service Delivery, Co-Chair of the DND/VAC Joint Steering Committee, Department of Veterans Affairs]

Thank you, Admiral Smith and Mr. Chair.

My name is Keith Hillier, and I am the assistant deputy minister of service delivery at Veterans Affairs Canada. It's my pleasure to be here with my colleague to discuss the DND/VAC joint steering committee that I co-chair on behalf of Veterans Affairs Canada.

Admiral Smith has explained the terms of reference, mandate, membership, and overall governance regarding the steering committee. My role this afternoon will be twofold.

First, I wish to speak a bit more about the steering committee and explain why and how we arrived at the designated joint priorities, because this list of initiatives makes up the main efforts of the committee on an annual basis.

Second, I wish to speak about significant activities in both organizations that can be traced back to the work done by the steering committee.

Mr. Chair, when it comes to addressing all the issues and concerns brought before the joint steering committee, it is an unfortunate reality that neither organization is sufficiently resourced to action each and every idea and every initiative. We must carefully weigh all potential initiatives against the current commitments. As well, both organizations have individual mandates and priorities and, although highly related, the fact is that VAC and the CF both have different jobs to do and different missions in support of the people of Canada.

That being said, it makes a great deal of sense, as the admiral has already stated, to coordinate the efforts of VAC and the CF wherever possible. Doing so helps to avoid duplication and ensures that we care for and support our men and women in uniform, our veterans, and their families to the highest standards possible.

It was necessary to prioritize the work in order to maximize the steering committee's ability to shape and influence the coordinated efforts of the two organizations.

In 2010, the steering committee took a close look at what we were doing and identified some key initiatives, such as continuity of care, electronic health records, family support, mental health, and research. These eventually became the joint priorities as established and agreed upon by all members of the committee and under the authority of the two chairs. It is important to understand that this was not a checklist in the sense that we would finish the first item before we started the second item. Rather, it is a list of concurrent initiatives that involve the cooperative efforts of both organizations.

Similarly, there is no set number of priorities. The list is as long as it needs to be. That said, not everything can be a priority, or the list becomes meaningless. Therefore, some general thoughts were expressed in terms of how to ensure that the chosen priorities are of sufficient significance.

Generally, there must be an impact upon the members of the Canadian Forces and the veteran population. They must be major initiatives in the sense that the oversight of the steering committee is required to provide guidance and direction. They must be realistic, achievable, and identifiable initiatives, with measurable and defined goals.

Both organizations will be required to allocate resources to managing the priority.

Once we establish the list of priorities, the admiral and l, as co-chairs, assign each priority to one of our directors general to ensure it is coordinated and staffed. The committee is updated on the progress of every priority at every committee meeting, and no item is removed from the list until it has been satisfactorily completed. In this way, each and every priority is moved forward in an accountable and transparent manner, and both organizations have complete visibility on its progress.

Mr. Chair, I would now like to speak about the significant activities that have resulted from the hard work and discussions of the steering committee.

The new Veterans Charter provided Veterans Affairs Canada with a full package of benefits and services that can be tailored to the individual needs of each transitioning veteran and his or her family. This care and support includes rehabilitation services, mental health supports, case management services, disability compensation, monthly financial benefits, practical help finding a job, and health care benefits.

The department has also established a range of programs and services to complement the help available through the new Veterans Charter. It is important to note that all these, while released under the Veterans Affairs Canada banner, were discussed and coordinated at length with our partners at the Canadian Forces.

I will now highlight some more recent measures adopted to improve and increase support for our men and women in uniform, our veterans, and their families.

Through cutting red tape initiatives, we are streamlining the department to eliminate unnecessary layers of bureaucracy. We're reducing paperwork and we are introducing new technologies.

As well, the benefit browser is now available to help veterans more quickly and easily find online information on the benefits, services and programs suited for them.

We have also simplified our forms, which is making it easier for veterans and transitioning CF men and women in uniform to understand, apply for, and access benefits, services, and programs. There is better and earlier coordination between the Canadian Forces and VAC, particularly at the joint personnel support unit and the occupational stress injury support clinics across Canada.

Finally, “My VAC book” now provides veterans with quicker and more convenient access to information on the available programs and services.

We are also making improvements to the way we deliver services. For example, VAC and DND have worked together to continue the switch to electronic records, which allow us to share more accurate information in a secure and timely manner. In partnership with Service Canada, more than 600 new points of service are available to veterans across Canada.

In order to enhance case management services, we have launched an integrated action plan for case management, rehabilitation, and mental health. We are updating our offices to make them more inclusive and reflective of the CF veteran population—in other words, to make them veteran-friendly.

Another area of activity is the creation of new career opportunities. For example, Helmets to Hardhats Canada is bringing union, private sector, and public sector resources together to match veterans with employment opportunities in the construction industry. Priority access to the public service is intended to be extended to allow veterans more time to seek employment opportunities in the federal public service.

We will also continue to conduct the research that informs our efforts. This includes the life after service study, which has provided both organizations and our study partners with a much greater understanding of how to design, implement, and deliver policies, programs, and business processes that best meet the needs of ill and injured personnel. The next step in this research is a study specific to reservists to further enhance our understanding of the experience and needs of veterans transitioning to civilian life.

We have also recognized the importance of building cultural awareness. We started this by providing VAC employees with “CF-101 for Civilians”, a course designed by DND to raise awareness about the military ethos, military life, and chain of command. To date, more than 92% of all VAC employees have completed this course.

Base visits have been another important part of our ongoing and ambitious outreach strategy. Various cultural awareness projects are increasing VAC's employees' awareness of and sensitivity to the Canadian Forces and its traditions. Just last week, 25 Canadian Forces personnel were in Charlottetown for a three-day interactive exchange with VAC program and policy directors.

In closing, Mr. Chair, a main objective of the CF-VAC steering committee is to strengthen VAC and CF capacity to serve veterans, ill and injured CF personnel, and their families. The accomplishments we've noted today, with many more to come, will get us to our goal of a clear and timely and consistent service experience for veterans and their families.

Thank you again for this opportunity to address the committee.

Merci beaucoup.

[The Chair, Conservative, Greg Kerr]

Thank you very much, Mr. Hillier, and to both witnesses again.

We'll now turn to committee members for questions. We'll start with Mr. Stoffer. You have five minutes.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thanks to all of you—to you, Admiral, and to the folks you brought as well, for your service to our country and to our veterans here.

Sir, on page 4 of your presentation, you indicated in the fourth paragraph that the committee would consist of the two chairs and 12 senior leaders from VAC, CF, and the RCMP, institutions represented by senior leaders, directors, etc., but I didn't notice anyone there from any veterans organizations like the Legion, the Army, Navy and Air Force Veterans in Canada, etc.

The reason I ask is that in today's Quorum Wayne Johnston, who's a current soldier and founder of Wounded Warriors, says “Veterans Affairs continues to be eyed with deep distrust by soldiers”.

Would it not be advisable, if the intent is to help the injured and ill and their families, not to necessarily have a government and military-backed type of organization?

I'm very pleased, by the way, about the coordination that's taking place between the two, and I think it's a very good start, but would it not be helpful to have members of the veterans committee on that committee as well?

[RAdm Andrew Smith]

Thanks for your question. I'll give you an answer, and I'll invite Mr. Hillier to respond as well.

In the first instance, I would say we do gain lots of feedback from veterans organizations. I have a very close working relationship with the Royal Canadian Legion. I meet with the Legion on a regular basis. We hear back from folks like Wayne Johnston from Wounded Warriors, True Patriot Love Foundation, Canada Company, other organizations that are plugged into the veterans community, and all of the other veterans advocacy groups in various parts of the country.

We've also done outreach to bases. We've visited 20 bases across the country in the last year and a half. We've done presentations to over 6,200 Canadian forces personnel, with a view to both getting the services and support available to them through Veterans Affairs to themselves and their families and to hear back on their concerns. We do have a very regular and constant pipeline of feedback to us.

With respect to whether they should be part of the steering committee per se, my sense is no. It's really there to guide the program and policy development, the harmonization, and the ongoing synergy between the departments, which is really the business of ensuring we have a seamless handshake between the two organizations. In view of everything I've said, I do not see a requirement for them to be part of that committee.

Mr. Chair, I'd invite Mr. Hillier to comment.

[Keith Hillier]

I would share to the admiral's the view that in terms of getting feedback from veterans, there are various consultation methods with veterans organizations. As the admiral noted, we visited about 20 bases and wings last year. This committee is really about how to get things in government done, how to get things accomplished, as opposed to responding to particular concerns of veterans groups.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

Minister Blaney says, in response to the Auditor General's report, that his department accepts all the recommendations and will implement and table an action plan to ensure a seamless transition for veterans. I assume that the reason Mr. Blaney said that is because Colonel Pat Stogran indicated—I'm just quoting him in the paper here—that lives are “being ruined because of our tolerance of ineptitude and cover-up”.

Have you been advised by the Minister regarding the recommendations, and how soon will your committee be able to adapt to the recommendations given by the Auditor General?

[Keith Hillier]

First of all, you're correct in that the minister has committed to an action plan. It will go over and above what has been suggested by the Auditor General. We will surpass what the Auditor General has suggested for recommendations. We have been working on this for some time, and it has no relationship to any comments alleged to Mr. Stogran.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Greg Kerr]

Thank you very much.

Go ahead, Ms. Adams, for five minutes, please.

[Eve Adams, Conservative, Mississauga—Brampton South, ON]

Thank you very much, to both gentlemen, for coming here today.

It certainly sounds like quite an impressive model. Can you tell me if there are similar boards across other government departments?

[RAdm Andrew Smith]

Mr. Chair, I can't speak definitively on that. I do know that this committee has been viewed favourably by the government's Chief Information Officer. In looking at what we're doing in electronic health records transfer between the two departments, she observed that this is a model of intergovernmental collaboration.

Beyond that, I'm not sure. I would note that the invitation to the RCMP to sit on this committee—and they are active members of the committee—is just another example of how we've expanded beyond the two obvious choices of Canadian Forces and Veterans Affairs.

[Eve Adams, Conservative, Mississauga—Brampton South, ON]

That certainly is high praise.

Could you give me some concrete illustrative examples of the type of work you are doing?

[RAdm Andrew Smith]

Certainly.

The priorities that we established for this year really speak to several areas. The primary one, I would submit, would be the continuity of care. We're looking to ensure that as people transition from the Canadian Forces to other pursuits in their lives, there is as seamless a handshake as possible as they go from an organization that they have served for the better part of their lives, in many cases, to other pursuits.

That continuity of care—whether it be attendant care post-release, travel assistance, dental services, the spectrum of care from a health care perspective, vocational rehabilitation, or transition services—and trying to make sure that those areas are well understood from a policy and program perspective, while acknowledging that they won't ever be identical, are key aspects. Certainly from my four and a half years associated with the committee, I would submit that they're the most enduring and significant of examples.

However, we also collaborate on, as I mentioned, the exchange of electronic health records while respecting the Privacy Act. That's not always self-evident. You'd think it would be relatively easy between government departments, but for the right reasons, there are stringent regulations in place that make sure we have to do that properly.

We've collaborated extensively on the issue of mental health. That's in terms of both clinical treatment and non-clinical treatment, through the operational stress injury clinics and our own equivalent inside the forces, which are referred to as the operational trauma stress and support clinics.

I'll just mention that I was at an OSI clinic in London, Ontario, last week in the Parkwood Hospital. They're doing great work in terms of reaching out to veterans.

We do that at the strategic level, and then we follow it up and watch what happens at the tactical level. We've also had agreement in mental health in terms of common service providers.

I would close my part of this response by saying that we collaborate extensively on research as well. Mr. Hillier mentioned the life after service study and the mortality study, as well as the joint priorities that we provide to the Canadian Institute for Military and Veteran Health Research.

We also, as another priority, collaborate extensively on commemoration and remembrance. I have a department of heritage and history that works for me, and Veterans Affairs has a commemoration cell. We work very closely on, but not limited to, Remembrance Week, on how we might celebrate the service of military people.

[Keith Hillier]

Mr. Chair, I would respond to the question regarding the committee from an international perspective.

Certainly after speaking with my colleagues, particularly in the U.S. and Australia and some other of the allied countries, I know they're very jealous of the Canadian model. Generally senior officials, with their equivalent of Veterans Affairs Canada, have to deal with many branches of the service. They have to deal with the army, the navy, but in this model, when we sit down at the table, Admiral Smith speaks for the Canadian Forces and all branches of the Canadian Forces, and I speak for Veterans Affairs Canada. In terms of a method of communication, a way of getting business done, certainly internationally my colleagues say they wish they had that kind of model in their countries.

[The Chair, Conservative, Greg Kerr]

Thank you very much.

You're right at five minutes, Ms. Adams, unless you're real quick.

[Eve Adams, Conservative, Mississauga—Brampton South, ON]

Just very briefly, could you give me an overview of the mandate you have?

[Keith Hillier]

Well, you can read the mandate, but it's basically to ensure that we coordinate the policy and coordinate the transition for the men and women in uniform to Veterans Affairs Canada. That's really when you cut through it. We're trying to make sure that the transition is as seamless as possible.

Some of them are difficult. Let's not kid ourselves. There are people who are seriously ill, who are seriously wounded, so let's not kid ourselves. It's to try to do it as seamlessly as possible, and then to make sure that both organizations are aligned: if we're going west, we're all going west. That way, we don't have one organization going east and the other west.

Will we ever be perfectly aligned? Probably not. As I noted in my speaking comments, we have different missions on behalf of the people of Canada. However, we have a joint responsibility for those who are injured or who become ill in the service of Canada.

[The Chair, Conservative, Greg Kerr]

Thank you very much, Mr. Hillier.

We'll now move to Mr. Casey for five minutes, please.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and welcome back, gentlemen.

The first question is for Rear Admiral Smith. In answer to one of the parliamentary secretary's questions, you referred to the Canadian Institute for Military and Veteran Health Research. What's the Government of Canada's financial commitment to that organization?

[RAdm Andrew Smith]

The Government of Canada has no funding construct associated with that body. It is a body, to the best of my knowledge, unique in this country. In it, universities have often put the promotion of their own interests aside to come together and collaborate in the interests of military and veterans health research. It's run out of Queen's University in collaboration with the Royal Military College of Canada. At my last count, something in the order of 20 universities had signed on to that body in the pursuit of research, and they have done some very exciting work to date.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Mr. Hillier, in your prepared comment you indicated that in order to enhance case management services, you've launched an integrated action plan for case management, rehabilitation, and mental health. When did you launch that integrated action plan?

[Keith Hillier]

The action plan is actually ongoing as part of our transformation process. As I've testified, and as I think some of my staff have testified at this committee, our transformation agenda is five years. Improvement of case management is one of the pillars of it. We have taken ongoing steps and we will continue to move forward. We are actually in year two now of the five-year transition program.