Mr. Speaker, I appreciate your giving me the floor so early. Our proceedings are moving faster and faster, exactly the reverse of what we are used to from the government.
Regarding this bill, before oral question period, I was listening to my colleague, the member for Portneuf, with whom I share the same views on the negative consequences of unemployment insurance. At the end of my speech, I will have the opportunity to be more specific as to its impact on the area I represent, namely the south shore, the area of Bellechasse.
Obviously, when we talk about unemployment insurance, it always brings us back to the history of the Canadian Federation, to
the constitutional background of this whole issue. I will go back to a time when my father had just turned 30, in 1938, and a new session was starting; 10 years later, I had the pleasure to be born, coming into a world of unemployment insurance. I will read something I wrote several years ago.
In 1938, at the start of the new session of Parliament, the government mentioned in the throne speech that it was seeking the co-operation of the provinces to amend the British North America Act to give the Canadian Parliament the necessary power to implement a national unemployment insurance plan.
The governor general added:
"My ministers hope that the proposal may meet with early approval in order that unemployment insurance legislation may be enacted during the present session of Parliament".
That was in 1938. In fact, as early as November 5, 1937, the federal government had contacted the provincial governments and asked them their views on the principle of an amendment to the British North America Act that would give unemployment insurance to the federal authority.
It must be remembered that there was no amending formula at the time. We will see the somewhat twisted and strange way in which the federal government acted to take over control of unemployment insurance.
So, in 1937, a detailed proposal was submitted to the provinces; in March 1938, the provinces of British Columbia, Saskatchewan, Manitoba, Nova Scotia and Prince Edward Island had totally agreed on the amendment proposed by the federal government. As for the Government of Ontario, it had given its agreement in principle without expressing its views on the text submitted by the federal government. Only Alberta, New Brunswick and Quebec had refused to agree to the constitutional amendment.
It must be remembered that in 1938 the Union Nationale government, under Mr. Duplessis, whose favourite theme was respect for provincial autonomy, was certainly not about to agree to such an amendment. The Government of Quebec was undoubtedly willing to assume responsibility for unemployment insurance in due course, according to the wishes of the voters.
However, after the provinces in question rejected its proposal, the federal government did not go ahead with its plan. According to the statements made by the then Prime Minister of Canada, Mackenzie King, especially in 1938-39, although the federal government did not want to enshrine in a constitutional agreement the principle that constitutional amendments should be approved by the provinces, it was not willing to go ahead with its proposal as long as there was provincial opposition to it.
What happened? On June 25, 1940, Prime Minister Mackenzie King made the announcement in the House of Commons that all nine Canadian provinces had finally approved the amendment proposed by the federal government. Quebec had elected a new government, the Godbout government, in 1939. Ernest Lapointe, the minister, got involved in the election campaign, saying that the Liberals were the only guarantee against conscription. As members may recall, they did not keep their promise, giving the green light to conscription for Quebecers and ignoring the results of the 1942 plebiscite. Even today, in 1996, our questions to the government remain unanswered: Would it respect Quebecers' democratic vote on the same issue today? The question remains unanswered, as it was in 1942, when the plebiscite results were ignored.
The Government of Quebec at the time paid dearly, losing the 1944 election, which saw the Union Nationale return to power. The government paid the price, but it was already too late. No amending formula, no public ratification. How did this happen? Through telephone calls-or telegraph messages at the time-or simply through an exchange of letters.
In eight out of the nine provinces-as members may recall, Newfoundland was still a Dominion at the time, a status which Newfoundlanders may or may not regret-only the cabinet had conveyed its approval in a simple letter. A two cent stamp to say they agreed with a constitutional amendment. Only the British Columbia legislature formally approved the amendment. In only one out of the nine provinces was the amendment voted on by members of the legislature.
Then there was a letter most likely signed by the clerk of the executive council that said: "Yes, let us amend the Canadian Constitution". In a strong position because of this letter, the House voted an address to the Imperial Parliament asking for some amendments to the Canadian Constitution. It is important to note however that, following a decision made two years earlier, on June 17, 1936, this was one of the rare occasions where the Supreme Court of Canada stated 1936, that the employment and social insurance act was ultra vires the powers of the federal Parliament, hence recognizing provincial jurisdiction over this area. The decision of the Supreme Court was sanctioned by the Privy Council in 1937, on January 27, 1937, to be specific.
These dates have to be mentioned, because in constitutional matters, as we have often heard and as my grandfather used to say, the Supreme Court is like the leaning tower of Pisa, it always leans the same way. Nothing has changed. It was the same in the 1930s, it was the same at the beginning of the century, and it all started in 1875, when that court was first established.
To come back to what the Minister of Justice said earlier, when he told the House that he wants to intervene in litigation dealing with Quebec issues and with the fundamental right of Quebecers to self-determination, I sure hope that the last word over the future of the people of Quebec will remain in the hands of those, in Quebec, who have the right to vote. The right to self-determination is a question of legitimacy that cannot be restricted by any outside influence.
Following this brief overview-I have many more pages I could read on this, but I will refrain from doing so-of the situation in an area like mine, that goes from the Beauce region to the beautiful riding of Kamouraska-Rivière-du-Loup, from the St. Lawrence River to the Maine border, I can tell the House that the legislation before us will hurt. The same as in all the regions. The regions will be hit hardest. Members who represent other areas have also expressed their point of view.
It will be tough on seasonal workers, and there are a lot of forestry workers in my riding who, because of the production calendar in this industry, work a limited number of months every year and will be hard pressed to work the required number of hours to become eligible for UI benefits. They will then have to resort to welfare. Once workers get a taste of welfare, it is hard to get them all back to work.
In general, people in my area are not very rich. They are poor financially, but their wealth is in their heart, in their fundamental values. These are people who want to work, who like to work, who do not complain for no reason but who want to enjoy the same benefits as other Canadians do. However, these are people who, because of what I would call the unemployment insurance map, are included in regions that are not to their advantage.
When I see that, for unemployment insurance evaluation purposes, the people of Sainte-Apolline, in my riding, a community of less than 1,000 people where unemployment is high, where there is a forest management co-operative, are in the same group as the people of thriving communities such as Saint-Jean-Chrysostome or Saint-Romuald, in the riding of Lévis, I can say there is a problem with human resources development in Canada. We should look at this and draw up a new map that reflects reality.
People who live in the RCM of Montmagny and in the RCM of L'Islet have a lot more in common with people who live in the RCM of Kamouraska than with those who live in the RCM of Desjardins or of Chutes-de-la-Chaudière, which do not have the same dynamic and the same prosperity.
We have to be careful with statistics. What do we do when we want to get statistics? We interview people. We ask them questions about their income, about their employment status, about their employability. We make sure to come by when people are not around, when young people are not around. I have to say that in several parishes in my riding, especially in the southern part, near the state of Maine, the employment rate among young people is extremely low and these people have left that part of the riding in droves. And the ones who come back are almost sure not to find a job.
So we have to look closely at these numbers. I agree with the views expressed by my colleagues in the official opposition and I will vote accordingly on the proposed amendments at report stage.
