House of Commons Hansard #31 of the 36th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was criminal.

Topics

SupplyGovernment Orders

4:50 p.m.

Bloc

Suzanne Tremblay Bloc Rimouski—Mitis, QC

Judging by the performance of the Minister of Foreign Affairs in the drafting of the treaty on anti-personnel mines, the crusade on which he set out in order to get the other countries on side, I feel he ought to again pick up his pilgrim's staff and set off on another crusade in connection with organized crime. This would lead to the ratification of a treaty that would, in a way, make the legislation more flexible.

It would enable the countries that were signatories of such a treaty to really deal with criminals, drug dealers for instance, without our having to resort to extradition because our country had sanctions against this crime and the other did not.

All the signatory states would have to be able to try these criminals and to impose upon them the penalties set out by a kind of international tribunal or the treaty itself.

SupplyGovernment Orders

4:55 p.m.

Bloc

Michel Bellehumeur Bloc Berthier—Montcalm, QC

Mr. Speaker, my comment will be along the lines of those I have made in the course of the day. It must be understood that the motion tabled by the Bloc Quebecois today, which will get hopefully a unanimous vote in the House of Commons this evening, is the product of considerable work.

The Bloc Quebecois has long been discussing and working on it. I take this opportunity to thank the members for Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, Hochelaga—Maisonneuve, Lévis-et-Chutes-de-la-Chaudière, Québec and Drummond, and, for their support, the members for Roberval and Rimouski—Mitis, who, in the past few hours, have been negotiating with the other opposition parties to come up with a motion that would receive the unanimous approval of the House. Once and for all, we will study this issue seriously and with all assumptions on the table.

It is common knowledge that drug dollars are a huge problem. The Bloc Quebecois has already tabled a bill on money laundering. Could we not in our study also look at the issue of money laundering and take the avenue proposed by the Bloc concerning, among other things, $1,000 bills and the deposit of large sums of money? Could the member respond to this question?

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4:55 p.m.

Bloc

Suzanne Tremblay Bloc Rimouski—Mitis, QC

Mr. Speaker, I will respond quickly.

Indeed, I think we must study this issue. Our colleague from Charlesbourg has already introduced a bill to remove $1,000 bills from circulation. We are probably the only major industrialized country to have such a large bill. It is easier to carry ten $1000 bills in one's pockets than five hundred $5 bills or two hundred $10 bills, and so on. It makes for not such a thick wad with ten $1,000 bills, and it is easier to launder them, in the casino, for example, some evening.

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4:55 p.m.

Liberal

Sophia Leung Liberal Vancouver Kingsway, BC

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to express my support for the motion currently before the House. I will share my time with the hon. member for Wentworth—Burlington.

Organized crime is a serious national and international problem that threatens public safety. It is now a multibillion dollar enterprise in Canada. It has a negative impact upon all Canadians.

Many of the problems Canadians see every day are linked to organized crime. Whether it be a drug related burglary, a carton of smuggled cigarettes, a telemarketing scam or juvenile prostitution, it is usually part of the larger problem of organized crime. That is why fighting organized crime is a major task for the government and a key priority of the RCMP.

The federal government has done much so far to hit hard at those criminals. The government is proud of what it has accomplished, but we all know there is more work to do. The government has undertaken a number of initiatives in its fight against organized crime. This government also recognizes that in the global war on organized crime, no one country or government can win by acting alone. Take the example of human smuggling and trafficking.

The government shares the concerns and frustrations of many Canadians in relation to the challenges posed by the arrival of illegal migrants. Canadians are proud of and deeply committed to our humanitarian traditions, but it is equally true that we have no tolerance for those who would abuse this generosity. Today criminally organized smuggling and trafficking operations are conducting an extensive international trade in lives and in the forced labour of human beings.

The United Nations estimates that international smuggling and trafficking operations have grown to a $10 billion a year industry. Organized criminals are demanding as much as $50,000 from their naive or misguided victims, exploiting their simple desire for a better life. We know that this debt is typically repaid over a short and brutal lifetime of illicit activity, sexual exploitation and forced labour.

This is a truly despicable set of circumstances but we must be clear about its source and direct our rightful anger and outrage toward the criminals who seek profit in human suffering rather than toward those victims who in search for a better life allow themselves to be put into such slavery.

Let us be clear about what has been happening with respect to our recent boatloads of arrivals from China. The boats were identified, intercepted, boarded and apprehended. Nine crew members have been charged. Their passengers have been detained. Organized crime has been denied access to the source of its profit. The economic incentive has been cut off. Those who have claimed refugee status are being given a fair hearing on an accelerated basis and in accordance with our charter, our international obligations and our proud humanitarian traditions.

Canadian government officials from the coast guard and national defence, the RCMP and Citizenship and Immigration Canada have all responded admirably under extremely stressful conditions, but the integrity of the system is something we take very seriously. Simply put, if we allow the rules to be abused and the rules are not respected, they cease to have meaning.

People smuggling and human trafficking are serious international problems. That is why we have initiated a serious international response. Canada has assumed a leading role in the development of United Nations protocols on transnational organized crime and migrant smuggling.

We have been working closely with our partners in the United States to improve our crime databases and on joint efforts to track and apprehend international criminals and terrorists. We are working along similar lines with law enforcement agencies in Australia, New Zealand and the European Union. It is worth noting that other countries are confronting similar problems, often on a significantly greater scale. This month alone Australia has seen the arrival of 10 migrant vessels carrying almost 900 people.

We are working with the People's Republic of China. Senior immigration officers along with members of the RCMP have recently returned from Beijing and the Fujian province where they met with representatives of the Chinese government, its enforcement officers and local police.

Last September I and two colleagues from the House went to China. We had discussions and negotiations with Chinese officials to work jointly to solve the human smuggling problem. This visit has helped us to advance our working relationship on human trafficking, people smuggling and the repatriation of Chinese nationals. The Chinese government has reported the recent seizure of six migrant vessels, including up to four which are thought to have been destined for Canada.

Smuggling has been around for a while. It is a fee for service operation where smugglers are paid for simple passage across international borders. They provide this service through various means which include such things as false travel documents and undetected border crossings. Their customers are sometimes economic migrants, but sometimes they are legitimate refugees who resort to smugglers as the only way to escape the source of their persecution.

Human trafficking is more akin to human slavery. The goal of traffickers is to profit from indentured human slaves. Once their debts have been imposed, the victims of human trafficking are bound to a long term repayment plan involving forced labour, prostitution and other illicit activities. These victims often have reason to fear for their lives and the lives of their family members back home.

For human traffickers, the goal is not legal status. In the first instance it is to evade detection at our ports of entry in order to enter unnoticed and force their passengers underground and into slavery as soon as possible. We are opposed to both smuggling and trafficking. But above all, Canada will not tolerate the abuse of our system by organized criminals engaged in such deplorable human exploitation.

The Minister of Citizenship and Immigration has travelled across the country speaking with her provincial counterparts, representatives of various non-governmental organizations and other concerned citizens. She has listened to a wide range of views on the matter in order to come up with a solution to this problem.

There is no easy solution to this problem. That is why I am pleased to support the motion that is before the House. I urge all members to do so.

SupplyGovernment Orders

5:05 p.m.

Liberal

John Bryden Liberal Wentworth—Burlington, ON

Mr. Speaker, it is really a pleasure to rise in this debate because just yesterday I was saying that I felt that the Bloc Quebecois, despite their agenda of sovereignty, contributes mightily to this parliament. I think this motion today is an example of a very positive contribution of the Bloc Quebecois.

I do not have a lot of time, but I would like to take this debate in a particular direction. I would like to draw the Bloc's attention and this parliament's attention to the fact that organized crime has also entered the field of charities. I think this is something that should be of concern to the justice committee when it comes to act on the motion proposed by the Bloc Quebecois.

Mr. Speaker, organized crime enters the field of voluntary service in a number of ways. One way is the proliferation of various telemarketing and direct mail scams. The commercial crime squad of the RCMP has recently reported, in Montreal in fact, that there have been links to the biker gangs. They have established links to biker gangs of organizations that are engaged in soliciting funds by telemarketing.

These are the people, Mr. Speaker, who phone and chiefly prey on the senior citizens in our society, both in French and in English, I have to say. It very much is a Canadian thing because this type of activity occurs and all we Canadians, our elderly parents, actually are very vulnerable to it.

So this kind of thing is going on, Mr. Speaker. The other thing that is occurring that again I believe is the effect of organized crime, and this is the case of international organized crime where organizations take advantage of the ethnic makeup of Canada and perpetrate scams that basically involve making contact with individuals from whatever ethnic group and saying that a long lost relative has died in Africa, or Europe, or the former Yugoslavia, or the far east, and that they have been left an inheritance.

A lot of people have lost a lot of money through these scams which, again according to sources in the RCMP commercial crime squads, often are linked to international organized crime. Canada's ethnic community is very vulnerable to this kind of thing.

But, Mr. Speaker, probably the most significant penetration of organized crime into the charity field has to do with the fact that as the law stands now with respect to non-profit organizations, and especially charities, because there is so little scrutiny on the way charities operate, and so little scrutiny on the financial affairs of charities, I suggest to you, Mr. Speaker, that charities have become a major conduit for the laundering of money.

Now, Mr. Speaker, I am not going to give you chapter and verse on which charities are engaged in this or which organizations are actually involved in it because, frankly, I do not know. I am not a policeman. I am not somebody who is involved in ferreting out criminal activity. I can tell you though, Mr. Speaker, based on my research, and you know, Mr. Speaker, I am very active in examining the charity sector, I can tell you that there is a lot of evidence, and recorded evidence, that charities have been used as fronts to finance overseas ethnic conflicts and terrorism.

That stands to reason, Mr. Speaker, because a charity can collect money. Under the current rules a charity can collect in loose change, shall we say, at bingos and lotteries and all that kind of thing, more than a million dollars and there is absolutely no way that that money can be audited as it stands now. On the other side with charitable organizations that have overseas branches, again there is no mechanism, Mr. Speaker, to be sure that when that money of that charity is transferred out of this country to its parent organization in another country, that that parent organization is not using it to finance ethnic conflict or some very non-charitable activity.

Well, Mr. Speaker, what is good for international terrorism, I suggest to you, is good for international organized crime and I will say that the government has shown some interest in this area and we can hope that perhaps we will move with some kind of legislation, or some better regulations at the very least, to control charities which I point out to you, Mr. Speaker, is a $90 billion industry that has run for years and years without any kind of meaningful oversight.

And so, Mr. Speaker, I conclude my remarks. I am glad to put that on the record so that that can be part of what the justice committee considers when it follows through on the motion by the Bloc Quebecois, but I will end my remarks by saying that I think it is an excellent motion. I think it is the credit to my colleagues opposite and sometimes, Mr. Speaker, quite frankly, you know they do so well, that sometimes I wish that they were the official opposition but then, what can I say, Mr. Speaker. They would have to change their politics for me to really believe that. Thank you so much, Mr. Speaker, and I thank them as well.

SupplyGovernment Orders

5:10 p.m.

The Acting Speaker (Mr. McClelland)

It being 5.15 p.m., it is my duty to interrupt proceedings and put forthwith any question necessary to dispose of the business of supply.

The question is on the amendment. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the amendment?

SupplyGovernment Orders

5:15 p.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

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5:15 p.m.

The Acting Speaker (Mr. McClelland)

I declare the amendment carried.

The next question is on the main motion, as amended. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

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5:15 p.m.

Bloc

Suzanne Tremblay Bloc Rimouski—Mitis, QC

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order. In view of the importance of this motion we ask for a recorded division on the motion.

SupplyGovernment Orders

5:15 p.m.

The Acting Speaker (Mr. McClelland)

I must put the question first and then see if more than five members rise.

Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

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5:15 p.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

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5:15 p.m.

Some hon. members

No.

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5:15 p.m.

The Acting Speaker (Mr. McClelland)

All those in favour of the motion will please say yea.

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5:15 p.m.

Some hon. members

Yea.

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5:15 p.m.

The Acting Speaker (Mr. McClelland)

All those opposed will please say nay.

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5:15 p.m.

Some hon. members

Nay.

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5:15 p.m.

The Acting Speaker (Mr. McClelland)

In my opinion the yeas have it.

And more than five members having risen:

SupplyGovernment Orders

5:15 p.m.

The Acting Speaker (Mr. McClelland)

Call in the members.

(The House divided on the motion, as amended, which was agreed to on the following division:)

Division No. 59Government Orders

5:45 p.m.

The Speaker

I declare the motion carried.

The House resumed from November 25 consideration of the motion that Bill C-10, an act to amend the Municipal Grants Act, be read a second time and referred to a committee.

Municipal Grants ActGovernment Orders

November 30th, 1999 / 5:45 p.m.

The Speaker

Pursuant to the order made on Thursday, November 25, 1999, the House will now proceed to the taking of the deferred recorded division on the motion at second reading stage of Bill C-10.

Municipal Grants ActGovernment Orders

5:45 p.m.

Liberal

Bob Kilger Liberal Stormont—Dundas, ON

Mr. Speaker, I think you will find unanimous consent that those members who voted on the previous motion be recorded as having voted on the motion now before the House. Liberal members will vote yes.

Municipal Grants ActGovernment Orders

5:50 p.m.

The Speaker

Is there agreement to proceed in such a fashion?

Municipal Grants ActGovernment Orders

5:50 p.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

Municipal Grants ActGovernment Orders

5:50 p.m.

Reform

Chuck Strahl Reform Fraser Valley, BC

Mr. Speaker, Reform Party members present vote no to this motion, unless instructed otherwise by their constituents.