Debates of April 21st, 1999

Kosovo

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, we are not confronted with the problem at this moment. We are in the phase of air strikes. If the opposition wanted to have a vote on that, a motion was introduced last Tuesday by them. They could have put the question to the House. They were not interested. The Bloc was not interested on Monday either.

I said that if we have to send ground troops there will be a debate in this House. However, there is no such thing at this moment and I do not want to speculate.

[Bob Mills, Reform, Red Deer, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the war in Kosovo seems to be escalating and new military commitments by Canada seem to be most likely. Does the Prime Minister think he is some sort of king who can simply send his peasants off to war? Does he really think—

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[The Speaker]

Order, please. I would ask the hon. member to be very judicious in his choice of words.

[Bob Mills, Reform, Red Deer, AB]

Mr. Speaker, does the Prime Minister really think that he can make this decision over cocktails in Washington instead of consulting parliament?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, if the member thinks that the President of the United States, the President of France, the Prime Minister of Great Britain, the Prime Ministers of Greece and Italy and the Prime Minister of Canada will be in Washington for three days to have cocktails, he should be ashamed of himself. This person pretends that he is a responsible member of parliament.

[Bob Mills, Reform, Red Deer, AB]

Mr. Speaker, it is easy for the Prime Minister to act this way. He thinks it is some kind of joke. He ruthlessly crushes dissent in his backbench and routinely forces whipped votes.

Why does the Prime Minister think that his opinion is the only one that counts when we consider going to war in Kosovo?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member refuses to recognize that there was a debate last week on this issue. His own leader got up to support the position of the government, as well as the leaders of all the other parties. We had the debate. There was a fourth debate on Monday on the same issue.

If they do not have confidence in the way the government is handling this issue, they can go against what we are doing and tell our soldiers that they are not backed by the Reform Party.

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

Mr. Speaker, yesterday, during a one-hour television broadcast, we learned more about where the Prime Minister stood on the issue of sending ground troops than in two weeks of questioning here in the House.

Yesterday, the Prime Minister surprised everyone by saying that he would not be opposed to sending ground troops.

I want to know why the Prime Minister claimed that this question was too hypothetical to debate and vote on here in the House, when his mind was already made up. How could he have so little respect for parliament?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I answer all the questions put to me every time I am here, in the House of Commons.

I said, and I repeat, that no decision needs to be taken right now because NATO's strategy is to continue the bombing against President Milosevic's regime.

That is the government's position. There will be talks on the weekend. But right now we do not have to take a decision about sending combat troops to Kosovo. The decision has not been taken and does not need to be taken as long as NATO has not made a decision.

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

Mr. Speaker, just because the Prime Minister is speaking does not mean he is answering questions.

Does he realize that, because of his bungling, his stubbornness and his lack of respect for parliament, he will not be able to speak in Washington next Friday with all the moral authority that he himself required of Brian Mulroney in 1991?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, we are assuming our responsibilities. If the hon. member has had a change of heart since rising in this House on Monday ten days ago in support of the government's position, let him come right out and say so.

If he himself is suggesting that we should decide immediately to send combat troops when that is not being considered at this time, let him say so.

I hope we will not need to send combat troops. I hope we will find a diplomatic solution before thinking about sending troops, but if it comes to that, I have said—

[The Speaker]

The hon. member for Laurentides.

[Monique Guay, Bloc, Laurentides, QC]

Mr. Speaker, according to some alarming rumours, a sizeable portion of the humanitarian aid sent to the Kosovar refugees is apparently being diverted to the black market by local gangsters.

According to these sources, this diversion might affect up to 70% of the aid being sent, and apparently certain humanitarian organizations have already moved out of some regions because of this major problem.

Could the Minister for International Co-operation bring us up to date on this extremely worrisome situation?

[Diane Marleau, Liberal, Minister for International Cooperation and Minister responsible for Francophonie]

Mr. Speaker, we have heard these same allegations, and are taking all necessary precautions to ensure that the food goes where it is intended to go.

We have contacted General Maisonneuve, who is on-site, in order to get his impressions on this phenomenon. He believes this may well be an exaggeration, but allow me to assure you that this is of great concern to us and we are going to do everything possible to ensure that the food gets to those who really need it.

[Monique Guay, Bloc, Laurentides, QC]

One more attempt from the government side to reassure us, Mr. Speaker, but we still lack an awful lot of information.

Can the minister commit to including representatives of the NGOs helping the Kosovo refugees in the government briefing sessions, so that we may know to whom the humanitarian aid is really going?

[Diane Marleau, Liberal, Minister for International Cooperation and Minister responsible for Francophonie]

Mr. Speaker, we are going to do everything we can to ensure that the desired information is made available.

It is very important for us to ensure that the people who are suffering get the food that we are paying for. We will do everything to share whatever information we have. I know that the people of the non-governmental operations who are there would also be very willing to speak to anyone about what is happening.

[Alexa McDonough, NDP, Halifax, NS]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister said last night that if NATO decided to send ground troops into Kosovo then Canada would follow along.

Canadians expect a leader, not a follower. The Prime Minister should go to NATO and push for a diplomatic solution to the humanitarian crisis in Kosovo.

Will the Prime Minister advance a specific diplomatic proposal at the NATO summit and, if so, what is it?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, we are working at the United Nations. The Minister of Foreign Affairs has been meeting with his colleagues and has talked with most of the leaders many times about a possible solution.

It is clear to all of us that President Milosevic has to accept that to put a stop to the killing, to the raping and to the ethnic cleansing that has been going on for more than a year is a condition for us to stop bombing.

Of course I have talked with the Russians. Everybody would like a solution, but there will be no solution as long as President Milosevic continues his ethnic cleansing and the rest.

[Alexa McDonough, NDP, Halifax, NS]

Mr. Speaker, Russia will only support a truly international civilian protection force in Kosovo.

NATO on the other hand clings to its demand that any civilian protection force must be NATO dominated. We cannot have it both ways. Do we want Russia's participation or do we want NATO's domination?

We need Canada to take leadership and persuade NATO to support a truly international option. Will Canada lead or blindly follow?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I replied last week to a question of the leader that my government and I wanted to have more than the NATO force.

I said at that time, and I have repeated it in the House many times, that we have to have a force that will include the Russians. I said that last week to one of your questions. You should read what I told you last week.

[The Speaker]

Order, please. I ask hon. members to direct their remarks to the Chair.

Agriculture

[Rick Borotsik, Progressive Conservative, Brandon—Souris, MB]

Mr. Speaker, on December 10, when the Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food made his announcement of the disaster assistance program, he said it would be bankable and he said dollars would be put in producers' pockets.

We know now that the program is not bankable. We know now that very few if any dollars have been going into producers' pockets.

My question is for the Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food. Will he admit that there are problems with the AIDA program right now? Is he prepared to talk to the industry, to talk to the stakeholders and to revamp the program so more of those dollars can flow into the pockets of producers?

[Lyle Vanclief, Liberal, Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food]

Mr. Speaker, I have been continually talking to the producers, to the provinces and to the farm organizations.

What I am prepared to say to the hon. member and everyone else is that even though over 13,000 forms have been sent out to the provinces of Saskatchewan, Manitoba, Newfoundland and Nova Scotia, only 291 have been returned by the producers. When they return those forms then we can work on the forms.

[Rick Borotsik, Progressive Conservative, Brandon—Souris, MB]

Mr. Speaker, I was speaking with the minister of agriculture from Ontario and I find that only 5% of the producers will be eligible for the AIDA program. Mr. Spooker, in Manitoba only 5% of producers will be eligible.