House of Commons Hansard #109 of the 37th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was wto.

Topics

PetitionsRoutine Proceedings

3:05 p.m.

Liberal

Peter Adams Liberal Peterborough, ON

Mr. Speaker, I rise to present two quite different petitions on the same subject. These are petitions from citizens in the Peterborough area who are concerned about end stage kidney disease.

The first petition is in support of research to develop the bioartificial kidney. This is an experimental implant that will replace transplantation and dialysis. This is a project that is close to human trials.

The citizens of Peterborough call upon parliament to work to support the bioartificial kidney which eventually will eliminate the need for both dialysis and transplantation for those suffering from kidney disease.

The second petition is also about kidney research. The citizens of the Peterborough area greatly support the work of our national institute which does kidney research but it is called the Institute of Nutrition, Metabolism and Diabetes. The citizens of Peterborough believe that the institute would be even more effective if the word kidney was included in the title. It would then engage the public more in the very fine work it does.

The petitioners call upon parliament to encourage the Canadian Institutes of Health Research to explicitly include kidney research as one of the institutes in its system, to be named the institute of kidney and urinary tract diseases.

PetitionsRoutine Proceedings

3:10 p.m.

Canadian Alliance

Roy H. Bailey Canadian Alliance Souris—Moose Mountain, SK

Mr. Speaker, I am very pleased and honoured this afternoon to bring to the House, pursuant to Standing Order 36, a petition from some of my favourite people. They are elderly people who are having a great deal of difficulty financially, much more now than ever before.

The petitioners are asking the government to explore the possibility of lowering the income tax on benefits to senior citizens so they can afford the high cost of modern day living and the expenses they must face.

PetitionsRoutine Proceedings

3:10 p.m.

Liberal

Anita Neville Liberal Winnipeg South Centre, MB

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to present a petition on behalf of many members of Winnipeg South Centre regarding the Canadian involvement in the U.S. national missile defence program.

The petitioners call upon parliament to declare that Canada objects to the national missile defence program of the United States, and to play a leadership role in banning nuclear weapons in missile flight tests.

Questions on the Order PaperRoutine Proceedings

3:10 p.m.

Halifax West Nova Scotia

Liberal

Geoff Regan LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

Mr. Speaker, Question No. 65 will be answered today.

Question No. 65—Routine Proceedings

3:10 p.m.

Progressive Conservative

John Herron Progressive Conservative Fundy Royal, NB

With regard to the current round of World Trade Organization agriculture negotiations: ( a ) does the government have a precise plan to ensure that the fundamental principles necessary for the maintenance of supply management in Canada—namely, border protection through the maintenance of over-quota tariffs at their current levels and a pricing mechanism or the right of producers to act collectively in establishing the price of their milk—are protected during this round; and ( b ) if so, what are the main elements of that plan?

Question No. 65—Routine Proceedings

3:10 p.m.

Papineau—Saint-Denis Québec

Liberal

Pierre Pettigrew LiberalMinister for International Trade

Since the development of Canada’s initial negotiating position on agriculture for the World Trade Organization negotiations announced in 1999 Canada has had a very clear strategy with respect to supply management, in particular, the commitment to preserving the ability of Canadians to operate the orderly marketing systems necessary for stability and profitability. How countries choose to market their products domestically is a domestic policy choice, and Canada remains committed to maintaining the ability of Canadians to choose how to market agricultural products. This strategy is built into all aspects of Canada’s initial negotiating position from market access issues such as the treatment of tariffs and tariff quota access to domestic support and export competition issues. The supply management agencies supported Canada’s initial negotiating position and continue to support that position. Canada has and will continue to pursue the objectives set out in the position in the negotiation.

Question No. 65—Routine Proceedings

3:10 p.m.

Liberal

Geoff Regan Liberal Halifax West, NS

Mr. Speaker, I ask that the remaining questions be allowed to stand.

Question No. 65—Routine Proceedings

3:10 p.m.

The Speaker

Is that agreed?

Question No. 65—Routine Proceedings

3:10 p.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

Business of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

3:10 p.m.

Glengarry—Prescott—Russell Ontario

Liberal

Don Boudria LiberalMinister of State and Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

Mr. Speaker, since the question was put on the bill that was before the House earlier, I believe the Chair would find unanimous consent to commence consideration of the take note debate scheduled for later this day for a period not to exceed four hours.

Business of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

3:10 p.m.

The Speaker

Is that agreed?

Business of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

3:10 p.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

Business of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

3:10 p.m.

The Speaker

Pursuant to Standing Order 53.1, to orders made Thursday, November 1 and now this day, the House shall now resolve itself into committee of the whole for a take note debate on the upcoming World Trade Organization meeting in Doha, Qatar.

I do now leave the chair for the House to go into committee of the whole.

(House in committee on Government Business No. 19--Mr. Kilger in the chair)

World Trade OrganizationGovernment Orders

3:10 p.m.

Glengarry—Prescott—Russell Ontario

Liberal

Don Boudria LiberalMinister of State and Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

moved:

That this committee take note of the upcoming World Trade Organization meeting in Doha, Qatar.

World Trade OrganizationGovernment Orders

3:10 p.m.

Papineau—Saint-Denis Québec

Liberal

Pierre Pettigrew LiberalMinister for International Trade

Mr. Chairman, I thank the government House leader for giving all parliamentarians the opportunity to take part in this take note debate on the upcoming ministerial conference of the World Trade Organization in Doha.

We are leaving on Wednesday for Qatar. I have the honour of leading a Canadian delegation of over 65 people representing parliament and the Senate, non-government organizations and industry.

All countries and all regions, from east to west and north to south, will be represented and will be able to speak during this negotiation. It will be very useful for us, who hope to truly launch a new round of negotiations, to be able to consult Canadians who have myriad opinions and who will have different viewpoints to express to us.

I tabled our government's objectives before the Standing Committee on Foreign Affairs and International Trade on October 24. Our government's objectives and mandate to negotiate are clear. Obviously, our basic objective is to launch a new round of multilateral negotiations.

Two years ago in Seattle, we were unfortunately unable to launch a new round of negotiations. I think the primary victims of this failure were the developing countries, the poorest countries, the very countries trying to gain better market access to ensure their development because trade and development are intrinsically bound.

Canada therefore is totally committed to launching this new round of negotiations. I hope we will achieve success by the end of this week and next week in Doha.

We are in a difficult environment worldwide. Of course, since September 11, the world has changed significantly. With the economic slowdown, which we were experiencing prior to September 11 and which has deepened since then, regrettably, it is vital we send a positive signal to the world economy, one that expresses our hope and belief that trade will lead to development and will help our economy to recover. I think the timing of this meeting is extremely important.

We have a number of problems in Canada. We have a bilateral disagreement on the softwood lumber issue which we talked about during question period.

People sometimes wonder about the relevance of the WTO. The WTO is a rules based system used to conduct our trade. It helps our bilateral relationship with the United States. People ask what the relevance is because Canada has a free trade agreement with the United States.

The answer is that it helps us in situations like the one we have with softwood lumber and the producer problem with tomato growers in British Columbia and Ontario trying to export to the United States.

Sometimes our major trade partner makes life more difficult for us. It is very important to be able to go to the WTO and its objective body of international panels that can apply the rules we believe in. The WTO is very useful even though we have a bilateral free trade agreement with the United States. Trade is very important because it improves the lives of Canadians.

It is remarkable to see how much public support we have in Canada for our efforts in the area of trade. Over 70% of Canadians are in favour of freer trade.

Trade is absolutely necessary to our economic growth, prosperity and social well-being. Without more trade, we are very much curtailing our potential growth. We are a trading country. We are the most trade dependent country, but dependency is a positive thing. Often, the term “dependency” has a pejorative ring to it.

The fact that 46% of our GDP is made up of exported goods and services means that we export far more than Germany, France or Japan, whose exports are proportionally far less than Canada's. This means that we need to have a round of negotiations.

We are leaving with a very important objective in agriculture. The minister of agriculture will also be in the delegation. The top priority of the government is to make sure that we can negotiate a major agricultural trade system for the world. That would be good for developing countries.

That is what our farmers need. We need to do away with export subsidies that are a folly. They distort international markets and penalize our farmers from east to west. We intend to make that a very top priority. I am delighted that the minister of agriculture will be joining me in Qatar to pursue the interests of our farmers.

We will be negotiating goods and services which are very important. We need to make progress in this area. More of our exports are in services, engineers, architects, environmental technologies and all sorts of products that are an important part of our economy.

We have held extensive consultations on the World Trade Organization and other agreements such as the free trade area of the Americas. We have, of course, met with business organizations directly affected by the negotiations in which we are involved. We have also met with groups of consumers, who are always interested in freer trade in order to have access to quality products from all over the world. We have met with interest groups and NGOs in order to ensure that we understood their point of view as well. They have some very pertinent questions for us. It is vital to have a dialogue that will keep Canada in the remarkable trade position it enjoys throughout the planet.

I believe that this next round of negotiations will focus on development. I do not think another round is possible unless we do far more for the poorest countries on the planet. I think it is vital for us to give them more access to our markets. There is nothing better for development than trade. Trade leads to development.

We must also enhance, and we are doing so through CIDA, the Canadian International Development Agency, the ability of southern countries so that they fully benefit from their joining the World Trade Organization. This is why Canada has worked so hard to solve several implementation issues that we experienced with previous agreements.

However, in order to settle all implementation issues, we need a new round of negotiations because some of the changes asked by southern countries involve a rebalancing of rights and obligations. This makes it necessary to begin a new round to find solutions to some of their demands.

I will conclude by saying that health and education are top priorities for Canada when we discuss trade and services. Our country will not negotiate public health and education. As far as we are concerned, these are not negotiable. They are areas which we have absolutely no intention of negotiating in Doha. They are not part of the Canadian objectives of our mandate. We want to be at the table to define these rules so Canadian businesses that want to export goods and services in the areas of health and education can benefit from these rules. A number of countries may decide to import. This is why we want to be at the table, but it is out of the question for us to go in that direction.

I wish to add a few words regarding the cultural industry. Members will hear many of my colleagues on this side of the House speak about our position on agriculture services investment, but I wish to speak about our cultural industry for a moment.

The Canadian government is committed to maintaining the flexibility we need to achieve our cultural goals. The government will not make any commitment that restricts our ability to achieve our cultural policy objectives. This is why we are pursuing the creation of an international instrument that would safeguard the right of countries like Canada to promote and preserve a diversity of cultural expression.

We are enthusiastic as we leave for the Doha meeting. The Canadian delegation is representative of the whole country. I hope the world will hear this signal that the international economy will get better because we will have better and sounder rules to deal with international trade and to promote liberalization to allow southern countries to further develop.

World Trade OrganizationGovernment Orders

3:25 p.m.

NDP

Dick Proctor NDP Palliser, SK

Mr. Chairman, I appreciated the minister's comments about how important the agriculture file is in Qatar. What does the government plan to do in the event the changes he is talking about do not come to fruition?

He will know that Canadian farmers in some sectors in particular have been hurt over several years as a result of high subsidies in Europe and the United States. Obviously the government's intent is to reduce or at least to begin to reduce those subsidies at Qatar. What happens if the Europeans, the Americans and others put their feet down and say no, they will not do that?

World Trade OrganizationGovernment Orders

3:25 p.m.

Liberal

Pierre Pettigrew Liberal Papineau—Saint-Denis, QC

Mr. Chairman, I can tell the hon. member that this is a top priority for us. We have allies such as the Cairns Group and we have the strong voice of developing countries that want market access in agriculture.

It is not possible to have a new round of negotiations that does not include serious agricultural negotiations. It will really improve the lot of our farmers from all over the country. The subsidies that the European Union is committing to agriculture are a folly. The domestic support in the United States is far too high. It is insensitive to developing countries and unrealistic for our farmers. We will be making progress next week in Doha for the benefit of our farmers.

World Trade OrganizationGovernment Orders

November 5th, 2001 / 3:25 p.m.

Canadian Alliance

Preston Manning Canadian Alliance Calgary Southwest, AB

Mr. Chairman, would the minister consider the following comments and perhaps respond to a question? As he knows, the public generally accepts the benefits of trade liberalization in terms of its contributions to economic growth, jobs and a higher standard of living.

However the main players in globalization that negotiate these big trade agreements have been the executive levels of government and multinational corporations. There is little opportunity for ordinary people, either themselves or through their democratic representatives in parliaments or legislatures, to have a say on either the terms and conditions of international trade agreements or on how to handle the social and environmental effects.

It is increasingly important to bring democratic governance and accountability to globalization and international organizations like the WTO. There must be some kind of democratic middle ground between high level executive meetings and riots in the streets of Seattle or Quebec City. Does the government have anything to propose on how to bring some sort of democratic governance to the WTO either in the present or in the immediate future?

World Trade OrganizationGovernment Orders

3:25 p.m.

Liberal

Pierre Pettigrew Liberal Papineau—Saint-Denis, QC

Mr. Chairman, the question by the member for Calgary Southwest is very pertinent. We absolutely need more transparency. Too many people want to know now what is going on in WTO circles, which was not the case a few years ago. We cannot blame trade ministers of the past for not having opened this up more. The constituency for international trade ministers was very narrow. We were negotiating down tariffs on goods and it did not affect that many citizens in such a direct way.

Now that citizens want in, I believe this is an opportunity to open the books and have more transparency. We should be sharing more information. I am very pleased that the draft ministerial, which has not been officially released, is at least now public and people know the 45 paragraphs that will be negotiated in Doha. It is public and we can receive contributions from Canadian citizens.

My department has a website as well which is open precisely for Canadians to tell us what they think on every angle of that. We pay a lot of attention to what citizens tell us.

I and members of my team have spent a lot of time in the last few months meeting with special interest groups along with business groups to look into the impact on the environment and labour. We have had better dialogue in the last few years than we ever had before.

I believe the progress made at the free trade area of the Americas and at the Buenos Aires meeting where we released the draft text of the negotiations, has been an extraordinary development on that front.

World Trade OrganizationGovernment Orders

3:30 p.m.

Bloc

Antoine Dubé Bloc Lévis-Et-Chutes-De-La-Chaudière, QC

Mr. Chairman, the Minister for International Trade said that he did not want to negotiate on issues related to health and education. I was less impressed when, instead of giving as his reason the fact that health and education are under provincial jurisdiction, he said that we had to remain open to the possibility of importing when it comes to health and education.

I would like him to assure me that, for the right reason, he does not intend on negotiating on behalf of Quebec, particularly on matters of education and health.

World Trade OrganizationGovernment Orders

3:30 p.m.

Liberal

Pierre Pettigrew Liberal Papineau—Saint-Denis, QC

Mr. Chairman, first, I must say that there have been very thorough consultations with all of the provinces, Quebec in particular, prior to these negotiations. We are apprised of their priorities. We are aware of their interests and their objectives. We are leaving as a true team Canada that is very united.

Indeed, the Canadian delegation includes representatives of the Quebec government. I can assure the member that we are on the same wavelength across the country when it comes to issues such as health and education.

What I meant to say, and I would like to correct the member, because I did not infer any openness to exporting—

World Trade OrganizationGovernment Orders

3:30 p.m.

Bloc

Antoine Dubé Bloc Lévis-Et-Chutes-De-La-Chaudière, QC

No, to importing.

World Trade OrganizationGovernment Orders

3:30 p.m.

Liberal

Pierre Pettigrew Liberal Papineau—Saint-Denis, QC

I meant to say importing. I am open to exporting. The member will remember that team Canada visited China last year. The delegation was led by the Prime Minister of Canada. The former premier of Quebec, Lucien Bouchard, took part in the mission.

There were 400 businesses that took part in the team Canada mission, including a hundred or so representatives from universities and colleges who wanted to see what they could contribute specifically to the development of China, which welcomed this input.

This is why we are staying at the table. We would like to negotiate the rules in the field of education and health to represent the interests of Canadian businesses that wish to export, without having to open up our market. We are working on this very closely with, among others, the government of Quebec.

World Trade OrganizationGovernment Orders

3:30 p.m.

The Chairman

I would like to finish the original round of time left to the minister. I understand the member for Kootenay--Columbia might be making a request to extend the period of time for questions and comments to the minister. We will deal with that in a moment.

World Trade OrganizationGovernment Orders

3:30 p.m.

Progressive Conservative

Rick Borotsik Progressive Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

Mr. Chairman, I thank the minister for his appearance and would like to congratulate him for his enthusiasm and his optimism going into these rounds of WTO talks.

However I was at the talks in 1999 in Seattle. Since 1999 until 2001, almost 2002, virtually nothing has been achieved with respect to agriculture. We know that agriculture will be on the front burner and I know the minister has a lot of optimism. Even if some agreements are negotiated, how long will it take for those agreements to be implemented?

If we are talking five, seven or ten years, the subsidies that are being paid by the Europeans and the Americans will continue and our farmers will be impacted.

Therefore, what does the minister expect to do if it is a five to seven year term before these are implemented, and that is the very best case scenario? What happens to our farmers in the meantime?