Agriculture Committee on Feb. 7th, 2019

[Francis Drouin, Liberal, Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON]

Do you feel that harvest knowledge has been lost within the youth population? I'm assuming that's why you have these education programs.

[Natan Obed]

It is harder and harder for us to transmit harvesting knowledge among generations, whether it's the effects of climate change and the changing patterns of wildlife or sea ice because of that, or whether it's the cost of being able to go off and harvest because we are now more dependent on skidoos and boats and gas and those sorts of things.

We still have an incredibly resilient culture and society. We are still very proud of the fact that it is almost universal that in our communities, there is that connection with the land and the push for us to continue to pass on the knowledge that we have to our younger generations.

[Francis Drouin, Liberal, Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON]

That's great. Thank you.

Just for the folks in New Brunswick, you have this new program, Lettuce Turnip the Beets. I'm not asking if you're growing beets or not but....

[Chad Duplessie]

We're growing a lot of beets.

[Francis Drouin, Liberal, Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON]

So it's combining beats and beets. The community gardens are working well. Will you be doing that again next year and will you be expanding next year?

[Chad Duplessie]

They work well when we have the labour. The labour is the biggest.... You need to ask people to volunteer, the people who are passionate about it. There's enough land that they're doing it in the backyards on a serviceable level, which is unique in a small community. We have a school that could be a purchaser. There's the ability to create a microeconomy to grow. That's a big part of it.

You need to have enough financing to be able to pay people to work and build those skills. Last year, the big difference-maker was that we hired a consultant to give us the techniques to do it in a no-till process. We treated the soil well and we saw the fruits of that labour at the end of the year, but we made a lot of mistakes getting there. Last year was the first year we had a garden and agriculture that could serve us.

[Francis Drouin, Liberal, Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON]

The chair is about to cut me off but I want to ask you about processing foods. Do you have access to flash freezers and whatnot after the harvest is done, or are you still not there yet?

[Chad Duplessie]

We do through partnerships. We do a lot of preserving and we use a lot of that in the programming, obviously with schools especially.

[Francis Drouin, Liberal, Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON]

Thank you.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Luc Berthold]

Thank you, Mr. Drouin. You kept to your speaking time.

I also thank Mr. Duplessie for providing a short answer to Mr. Drouin’s question. This helped us to stay within the allotted time.

You have all noticed that we have not heard from the representatives of two groups. There was a communication problem because of the time difference, and they will join us later in the meeting. If you don’t mind, we will listen to their presentation later and then continue with the questions.

Mr. MacGregor, the floor is yours for six minutes.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

Before I get to questioning our witnesses and to respect my Liberal colleague's time, I want to reintroduce the motion that I proposed on Tuesday for which the debate was adjourned. For the record, I will just read it out.

The motion reads as follows:

That, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), the Standing Committee on Agriculture and Agri-food undertake a study on the current regulations prohibiting the commercialization of raw (unpasteurized) milk in Canada; that this study include hearing from witnesses regarding the current consumption of raw milk in Canada, how other jurisdictions regulate the sale of raw milk; and that the committee report its findings with recommendations back to the House of Commons.

You may recall, Mr. Chair and other members of the committee, that at the time I felt the justification for this study was that, first, it is an agricultural product, and second, we have most of the United States that lives under a jurisdiction where they do allow sale or distribution of raw milk, as do some of our biggest trading partners in Europe. These are France, Germany, Denmark, Italy and the U.K. The other reason too is that we all know that across Canada there are people currently consuming, buying and sharing raw milk in an illegal manner. I don't believe it's in our interest or the federal government's interest to shove this under the rug anymore.

In the interest of time and with respect to my Liberal colleague, if no one has any further to say on this motion, perhaps we could go directly to a vote so that this committee can express its will on the motion.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Luc Berthold]

After consulting with the clerk, I would like to point out that we must first obtain the permission of the members of the committee before resuming debate. If they allow, we can proceed to the vote on the motion.

Mr. MacGregor, you are asking to resume debate and to have unanimous consent to vote on your motion. We will proceed in the order of your requests, that is, we will first consider reopening the debate.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

My understanding is that the debate was adjourned last time. Since I now have the floor, it is up to me as to whether I want to reintroduce the motion. I have done so. I've laid out my reasons. It's now open to other committee members as to whether they want to participate in the debate. If there are no further debates perhaps then the committee could voice whether it wants to move ahead with it or not.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Luc Berthold]

Do the members of the committee agree that we should resume debate on Mr. MacGregor's motion?

(Motion agreed to)

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Luc Berthold]

Mr. MacGregor, you have the floor.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

I think I've expressed my reasons. I don't want to hold up any more of the committee's time. If no one else wants to speak to this motion, perhaps then we could proceed directly to a vote.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Luc Berthold]

Mr. MacGregor's motion reads as follows:

That, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), the Standing Committee on Agriculture and Agri-Food undertake a study on the current regulations prohibiting the commercialization of raw (unpasteurized) milk in Canada; that this study include hearing from witnesses regarding the current consumption of raw milk in Canada, how other jurisdictions regulate the sale of raw milk; and that the committee report its findings with recommendations back to the House of Commons.

We will now call the question, if no one else wishes to speak.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Can I have a recorded vote, please?

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Luc Berthold]

Mr. MacGregor is requesting a recorded vote.

(Motion negatived: nays 6; yeas 3)

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Luc Berthold]

Mr. MacGregor, we are back to you.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

I'll be brief, with respect to my Liberal colleagues.

Mr. Obed, I appreciate your opening statement, and I think when you talk about 35% of Canada, it's just an incredibly vast land mass.

I was just wondering if you've looked at other northern indigenous populations: Alaska, Greenland, Norway, Siberia. Are there any examples, best practices and so forth, from those jurisdictions that you can learn from?

[Natan Obed]

In Greenland, there is readily available country food in supermarkets in a way that we've never seen in Canada. I think part of that is the regulatory barriers of sale of country food in this country. The Canadian Food Inspection Agency licensing is mandatory, especially when any food is crossing interjurisdictional lines. There are only four licensed fish and meat processing facilities in the entirety of Inuit Nunangat. They are all in Nunavut.

The expense of that process then creates prohibitively high price points for country food when it enters into any sort of secondary store. What we have is an informal structure of food sharing or food sale of country food, when I think that we could do more to ensure there is a way to incorporate the intent of food inspection regulations, but also the knowledge and expertise of Inuit who, for over a millennia, have been eating country food and can understand safety in that process.

There is still that disconnect between the respect for us as people now, but also the respect for our society and our practices, in the way these mechanisms of governance work.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Thank you.

Mr. Chair, I'll yield the rest of my time out of respect for my colleagues.

I'll just tell our witnesses that we would welcome a more fulsome briefing on this subject with your points of view, so that we can incorporate it into our study and our recommendations. Thank you.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Luc Berthold]

Thank you very much, Mr. MacGregor.

I now give the floor to Mr. Peschisolido for six minutes.

[Joe Peschisolido, Liberal, Steveston—Richmond East, BC]

Mr. Chair, thank you.

I would like to thank the witnesses for appearing here and also appearing on teleconference—