Evidence of meeting #36 for Agriculture and Agri-Food in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was practices.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Matt Parry  Director General, Policy Development and Analysis Directorate, Strategic Policy Branch, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
John Moffet  Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment
Javier Gracia-Garza  Special Advisor, Agriculture and Climate Change, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
Marco Valicenti  Director General, Innovation Programs Directorate, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
Tara Shannon  Assistant Deputy Minister, Canadian Wildlife Services, Department of the Environment
Warren Goodlet  Director General, Research and Analysis Directorate, Strategic Policy Branch, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
Darrin Qualman  Director of Climate Crisis Policy and Action, National Farmers Union
Clerk of the Committee  Ms. Alexie Labelle
David Wiens  Vice-President, Dairy Farmers of Canada
Pierre Lampron  President, Dairy Farmers of Canada

3:30 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Pat Finnigan

I call the meeting to order. Welcome to meeting number 36 of the House of Commons Standing Committee and Agriculture and Agri-Food.

Pursuant to Standing Order 108(2) and the motion adopted by the committee on Thursday, February 4, the committee is resuming its study on the environmental contribution of agriculture.

Today's meeting is taking place in a hybrid format pursuant to the House order of January 25. Therefore, members are attending in person in the room, and remotely using the Zoom application. The proceedings will be made available via the House of Commons website.

Just so that you are aware, the webcast will always show the person speaking rather than the entire committee. I will take this opportunity to remind all participants in this meeting that screenshots or taking a photo of your screen is not permitted.

To ensure an orderly meeting, I would like to outline a few points to follow.

Before speaking, please wait until I recognize you by name. If you are attending the meeting by videoconference, please click on the microphone icon to unmute yourself. For those in the room, your microphone will be controlled as normal by the proceedings and verification officer.

I remind everyone that all comments by members and witnesses should be addressed through the chair.

When you are not speaking, your mic should be on mute.

I will now welcome our witnesses for today's meeting.

For the first panel, we have from the Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food, Mr. Warren Goodlet, director general, research and analysis directorate, strategic policy branch; Matt Parry, director general, policy development and analysis directorate, strategic policy branch; Mr. Marco Valicenti, director general, innovation programs directorate; and Dr. Javier Gracia-Garza, special adviser, agriculture and climate change.

Also, from the Department of the Environment, we have Mr. John Moffet, assistant deputy minister, environmental protection branch; and Tara Shannon, assistant deputy minister, Canadian Wildlife Services.

Welcome, all of you, to our committee.

We'll have opening statements of seven and a half minutes by the Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food. Whoever wants to lead can start. You have seven and a half minutes.

3:30 p.m.

Matt Parry Director General, Policy Development and Analysis Directorate, Strategic Policy Branch, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

As mentioned, I'm Matt Parry. I'm the director general of the policy development and analysis directorate at Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada.

It is a pleasure to see you all again. Thank you for the opportunity to talk about the agriculture sector's contribution as it relates to the environment.

Over the last 20 years, Canada's agriculture sector has taken important steps to reduce its environmental impacts. Efforts to date have improved production efficiency and carbon sequestration, allowing the sector to increase productivity without significant increases in emissions.

Since 2005, total greenhouse gas emissions from Canada's agriculture sector have been relatively stable. According to Canada's national inventory report, greenhouse gas emissions for this sector were roughly 73 million tonnes of carbon dioxide equivalent in 2019, compared with 72 million tonnes of carbon dioxide equivalent in 2005.

However, total emissions are only part of the picture. Over the past two decades, agriculture soils have become an important source of carbon sequestration, removing as much as 11 million tonnes in 2005.

Notwithstanding this progress, further action is needed to reduce greenhouse gas emissions and to continue to sequester carbon in agricultural lands and soils.

As highlighted in the Speech from the Throne, climate action is a cornerstone of the government's plan to support and create a million jobs across the country, and farmers and ranchers are key partners in the fight against climate change. Supporting their efforts to reduce emissions and build resilience is a key priority of the government.

Canada's agriculture sector holds the potential to play an important role in reducing Canada's net greenhouse gas emissions while achieving environmental, social, and economic co-benefits. To this end, Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada is working with the provinces and territories, farmers, and other Canadian agriculture and food stakeholders to develop and implement innovative solutions that protect the environment while supporting farmers and growing the economy.

Under the Canadian Agricultural Partnership, up to $438 million in FPT cost-shared funding is available to farmers for the adoption of beneficial management practices that protect and build resilience in soil, water, air and biodiversity, enhance resilience, and mitigate the impacts of climate change. This funding also helps to build producer awareness of environmental risks through the use of environmental farm plans.

Agriculture and Agri‑Food Canada also has a long history in conducting research on practices and technologies to reduce agriculture's impact on the environment, and transferring this knowledge to producers. This work involves identifying innovative practices that can protect soils from erosion and increase soil carbon, reduce risks to water quality, reduce greenhouse gas emissions, and improve biodiversity on agricultural lands.

This work has contributed to improvements in the quality, yield, safety, and sustainability of the food produced by Canadian farmers.

A number of new measures have been announced over the last six months in Canada's strengthened climate plan and in budget 2021 to expand collaboration with farmers and ranchers and to accelerate progress in the fight against climate change.

First, the government is investing $165.7 million over seven years in an enhanced agricultural clean technology program to support the industry in developing and adopting transformative clean technologies.

Budget 2021 committed $50 million of this program towards supporting farmers in purchasing more efficient grain dryers, and $10 million towards powering farms with clean energy and moving away from diesel fuel. The balance of the funding under this program will support investments in sustainable technologies aimed at reducing greenhouse gas emissions.

Second, in March of this year the government announced a $185-million agricultural climate solutions program. This program will support the development of on-farm implementation of farming practices to tackle climate change through increased carbon sequestration and lower emissions. Projects implemented through this program will also contribute to other environmental co-benefits such as protecting fresh water and biodiversity resources. For example, practices such as use the of shelterbelts or cover crops can store carbon in soils and reduce greenhouse gas emissions. The program aims to establish a Canada-wide network of regional collaboration hubs made up of producers, scientists and other stakeholders that we call living laboratories.

Third, in addition to the $185 million previously announced for the agricultural climate solutions program, budget 2021 provided an additional $200 million over two years to support on-farm climate action to reduce emissions through improved nitrogen management, increased adoption of cover cropping and normalizing rotational grazing. Work is currently under way to develop and launch this program as soon as possible.

Finally, the government is consulting the sector in relation to the announced target to reduce greenhouse gas emissions from fertilizer application to 30% below 2020 levels by 2030.

The department also continues to collaborate with Environment and Climate Change Canada and other partners on initiatives to enhance environmental sustainability, including, for example, through the creation of a Canada water agency to keep Canada's water safe, clean and well managed.

The department is also developing an agriculture sector species-at-risk action plan as part of the pan-Canadian approach to transforming species-at-risk conservation in Canada that aims to identify and prioritize opportunities for the sector to align with positive outcomes for species at risk and biodiversity conservation.

In closing, I would like to reiterate that the agriculture sector has a critical role in the fight against climate change and the transition to a clean economy. Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada is working to support farmers in this goal to ensure that the sector's environmental impact continues to shrink while its economic output continues to grow.

Thank you for your time, and my colleagues and I would be pleased to respond to any questions.

3:40 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Pat Finnigan

Thank you, Mr. Parry.

From the Department of the Environment, there are seven and a half minutes for an opening statement from whoever wants to take it on.

June 1st, 2021 / 3:40 p.m.

John Moffet Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment

That will be me, Mr. Chair.

Good afternoon, everybody. My name is John Moffet and I'm the assistant deputy minister of the environmental protection branch, which is the regulatory branch for environmental protection measures. I'm here this afternoon with my colleague Tara Shannon, who's my counterpart as the ADM of the Canadian Wildlife Service.

As Mr. Parry explained, Canadian farms have an important role to play in reducing greenhouse gas emissions through the implementation of conservation activities or by adopting new management practices or technologies. I'm going to discuss one additional way in which Environment and Climate Change Canada is creating incentives for reducing greenhouse gas emissions, and that is through the development of greenhouse gas offsets.

As we indicated in our strengthened climate plan that was published in December, the government is developing a federal greenhouse gas offset system. This system will encourage cost-effective reductions of greenhouse gas emissions from activities that are not covered by the federal carbon pollution pricing system, including many potential activities in the agricultural sector. Offsets can provide a financial incentive for an activity in the form of a credit that can be sold to offset an equivalent amount of greenhouse gas emissions from another source.

We published draft regulations to establish the offset system in March, a couple of months ago, and we aim to publish the final regulations this fall.

In addition to being used as a form of compliance under the federal pricing system, we expect there will be additional demand for federal offset systems from other sources, including, for example, in helping companies reach carbon-neutral or net-zero commitments, of which we are seeing an increasing number. Because offset credits substitute for a reduction in a regulated sector, we need to establish rules to ensure that offset projects achieve real, additional, verified, quantified and permanent reductions in greenhouse gases. This means that in order for any conservation activity or land management practice to generate credits, it must essentially be above and beyond business-as-usual practices. It can't be for something that is already required by law, it can't be for something that is covered by current pricing, and it can't be for something that is a business-as-usual practice.

In order for a project to generate offset credits, the way we determine that a project is eligible is to ensure that it follows an approved offset protocol. These protocols set out a consistent approach for quantifying emission reductions and removals for eligible activities. By going above and beyond business-as-usual practices on their farms, agricultural land managers will not only benefit from the opportunity to generate offset credits, they will also benefit from enhancements in soil health and productivity.

The specific farming practices that will be able to generate offset credits will be established through the protocol development process. In other words, the activities that will be eligible to generate credits will depend on activities for which we have developed protocols. We've started to work on the first set of protocols, and among the first four is a protocol to support enhanced soil organic carbon. This protocol will create opportunities for farmers to generate offset credits through the adoption of sustainable agricultural land management practices that increase soil organic carbon levels.

As you would expect, this protocol is complex and requires further research and consultation with stakeholders. We've engaged an expert committee to advise us, and we expect to develop the protocol at some point in 2022.

We are also looking at other possible offset protocols relevant to the agricultural sector. These include activities such as livestock feed management, avoided conversion of grasslands, reduced nitrogen oxide emissions from fertilizers, anaerobic digestion and livestock manure management.

That's a quick overview of our federal greenhouse gas offset system and the way in which it might create opportunities for the agricultural sector. I would be happy to answer any further questions you have about this initiative, and my colleague will be happy to describe some of the activities that are under way in support of wildlife and biodiversity protection.

Thank you.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Pat Finnigan

Thank you, Mr. Moffet.

We'll now go to the question round.

Go ahead, Ms. Rood, for six minutes.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Lianne Rood Conservative Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, ON

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to the witnesses appearing today.

Mr. Moffet, you were saying that when you set protocols, you consult with stakeholders. I'm wondering if that's with actual farmers. Do you go out onto the farm, and have you been on a farm to see what farmers do right now?

3:45 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment

John Moffet

Have I been on a farm? Not recently, but I'm not the one doing the work.

Initially, we undertook a survey to identify activities that should be the highest priority for us in developing protocols. That was—

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Lianne Rood Conservative Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, ON

Was it consulting with farmers? I'm sorry to interrupt you. I just want to know, was it with farmers, or who did you mean by stakeholders?

3:45 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment

John Moffet

Yes, it was with farmers, agricultural academics and representatives from all of the major agricultural industry associations. It's particularly important, in the context of agriculture, to ensure that we have input from across the country, because agricultural practices and requirements vary significantly from province to province.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Lianne Rood Conservative Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, ON

The Western Canadian Wheat Growers have calculated that the agriculture sector captures 100 megatonnes of carbon dioxide from the grain farmers grow, which amounts to about 30 megatonnes more than what the national inventory reports as GHGs emitted by the agricultural sector. The Western Canadian Wheat Growers have argued that when grain leaves the farm gate, they are net zero for GHGs. I would argue that they are a net carbon sink for 33 megatonnes of greenhouse gases, according to their report.

Could you comment on the Western Canadian Wheat Growers' calculations and also on giving credit to grain growers and the agricultural sector for constituting a net carbon sink?

3:45 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment

John Moffet

I won't comment on the inventory itself. I'm wondering if my colleagues at Agriculture and Agri-Food might comment on that.

I will comment on the credit issue. The global obligation that we face is to reduce emissions so that nobody's getting a credit for something they're already doing. We have to do more. The goal of our offset system is to give credits for doing something new and additional, over and above what we're already doing.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Lianne Rood Conservative Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, ON

Thank you very much.

Does anybody else want to comment on that?

3:50 p.m.

Director General, Policy Development and Analysis Directorate, Strategic Policy Branch, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food

Matt Parry

I might turn to my colleague, Dr. Gracia-Garza, to see if he has any comments regarding the national inventory report.

3:50 p.m.

Dr. Javier Gracia-Garza Special Advisor, Agriculture and Climate Change, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food

Not necessarily about the national inventory report, but I will provide an observation. During the period when the plant is capturing the carbon for the production of seed and grain, as soon as the grain is used for feed, food, etc., that carbon is released. It's not something that is actually stored.

It's not like a tree that is cut and burned or used, and the carbon stays there. That carbon gets recycled as soon as we actually use it. It's released again into the atmosphere when we use it for food.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Lianne Rood Conservative Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, ON

Thank you very much for that.

I'll go back to the report. The latest national inventory report on greenhouse gas sources and sinks in Canada was submitted to the United Nations in April 2021. I noticed, first of all, that the report indicates that GHG emissions by the agriculture sector as a whole were reported to be down by 0.83 megatonnes, or 1.4%. I have also noticed that the GHG emissions from energy used in agriculture stood at 3.7 megatonnes for 2019. These are well below most other sectors, including residential housing, for example, with GHG emissions of 42 megatonnes.

Given how little GHGs are emitted from agricultural energy use, do you not think that the Government of Canada should extend the carbon tax exemption already available for agricultural use of gasoline and fuel oils to include propane and natural gas? If not, why?

3:50 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment

John Moffet

With respect, that's not a question for our officials. That's a question you need to address to the members of the government.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Lianne Rood Conservative Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, ON

All right. I will ask my next question.

I noticed in the report in the section on land use and land-use change in forestry that in 2019, crop land was a net carbon sink at 4.2 megatonnes of GHG sequestered. In the same section, I noticed that grassland is reported as a net GHG emitter at greater than 0.5 megatonnes emitted. Again, in the same section, I noticed that wetlands are reported as net emitters of GHGs at 2.6 megatonnes.

Are you able to explain these calculations—or at least give a top-level explanation—of how these calculations would be made?

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Pat Finnigan

Give a quick answer, please.

3:50 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment

John Moffet

The short answer is that it's through data collection and modelling associated with changes in the landscape. If we lose wetlands, then we lose the sequestration that previously occurred. If we gain wetlands, we gain sequestration that occurred.

Again, it's always relative to what occurred in the past and what changes are occurring on the land, or in industrial or agricultural practices.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Pat Finnigan

Thank you, Mr. Moffet.

Thank you, Ms. Rood.

Mr. Drouin, you have the floor for the next six minutes.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

Francis Drouin Liberal Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to thank our witnesses for taking the time to come before our committee.

I have a question with regard to identifying carbon emissions on farm and whether or not we plan on moving forward or if we have identified some organizations that can help our farmers identify how to best reduce those emissions. For instance, should I increase my carbon emissions in the barn or should I increase my carbon emissions in the field? We all know that can't be done at the same time.

I know New Zealand has a plan to have these farm consultants reduce carbon emissions on farms, as I'm sure you're already aware.

Perhaps Ag Canada could help me with this. Maybe I can flip it over to Environment, if they have some comments on that.

3:50 p.m.

Director General, Policy Development and Analysis Directorate, Strategic Policy Branch, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food

Matt Parry

Thank you very much for the question.

I will perhaps make a few comments and then see if my colleagues would like to add to this.

It's very much an important part of the new programs that were announced in the strengthened climate plan and budget 2021. These look at ways to work directly with farmers through both the living laboratories program that I mentioned in my opening remarks, as well as through on-farm action through the top of the $200 million additional funding that was announced in budget 2021.

As part of that, officials are certainly looking at options where there are opportunities to work with other groups and experts in the field to support the adoption of climate-smart farming practices.

I will perhaps see if Mr. Valicenti or Dr. Gracia-Garza have anything they would like to add to that.

3:55 p.m.

Marco Valicenti Director General, Innovation Programs Directorate, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair, for the question.

I'll just follow up my colleague, Matt Parry's, comment. Yes, absolutely, I think that one of the elements we are looking at in engaging with stakeholders, industry associations, and other stakeholders on the on-farm side is to look at those agronomic practices and whether there are opportunities to share “best practices”, I will call them, or knowledge transfer. It's looking at it from various perspectives and whether we're thinking, for example, about cover cropping or nutrient management.

There are opportunities to build some of those practices, including best management practices, in the context of the living labs—which is a collaboration between farmers and academia—to look at those practices and use those BMPs to transfer the knowledge through training or agronomic services, etc.

Yes, we are looking at those elements as part of our programming package suite.

3:55 p.m.

Liberal

Francis Drouin Liberal Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON

Great. Thank you for the response.

All of us on this committee have heard about grain drying and the price on pollution, and a fund has been announced through budget 2021. I know that the program is not up and running yet, but I'm wondering about the objectives. Are we going to identify how much carbon we want to reduce through this particular program? Are we going to identify the type of grain dryers that we will prefer? Obviously we're looking at efficient grain dryers, and we know that the price on pollution is going to rise to $170, so I would think we would favour technologies that don't necessarily use heavy carbon technologies.

Can you give us some insight, or should we stay tuned for some news?

3:55 p.m.

Director General, Innovation Programs Directorate, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food

Marco Valicenti

In the context of the agriculture clean-tech program, the details haven't been announced yet. That will be done shortly. We are looking at both an on-farm element and a research component.

To the question about technology, we know there are different types of technologies currently in the market. However, we also know that there are prototypes and other elements that are coming into play. We're seeing it even with some Canadian companies that are looking at different types of technologies. For example, biomass is really going to be pushing the limits. However, who knows? The fund will be for a longer period of time—up to seven years—and we're hoping that we will continue to look at new technologies over that time span.

We are looking, as I said, at biomass. That is one of the newer technologies on the market. We're also hoping that we will continue to see evolution in grain-drying technologies over the coming years.