Thank you.
Kathy.
Evidence of meeting #105 for Canadian Heritage in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was artists.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #105 for Canadian Heritage in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was artists.
A recording is available from Parliament.
9:05 a.m.
General Director, Centre Materia
We are a non-profit organization, an artist-run centre. So most of the board of directors is made up of craft artists, as our vocation is related to crafts. We collaborate a lot with the Maison des métiers d'art de Québec. In addition to sharing the same building, we have the same interests and clienteles. As a result, we have many projects, artist residencies, exhibits and conferences in common. We work on that jointly with the Maison des métiers d'art de Québec.
Centre Materia, located in the heart of Saint-Roch, is surrounded by a number of different artist-run centres. We have already met with the representatives of the Méduse organization, which brings together many other artist-run centres. We also have partnerships with private galleries. We are trying to include them in peer juries, for example, to select artists who will have exhibits. We try to select from a group of people who have expertise in the area.
9:05 a.m.
Liberal
9:05 a.m.
Liberal
Gordie Hogg Liberal South Surrey—White Rock, BC
Most of my experience is in social services, and in social services they're looking at more methods by which they can use an economic sort of model. Since the changes in culture, we've seen many fewer dollars flowing to social programs and to cultural programs.
A number of the social programs are looking at trying to quantify what they do in an economic sense, but there are different models coming in place. There's something called a social impact bond. A social impact bond is something whereby the social organization can show the social value they have, but in economic terms, and the state is looking at and compensating that.
Is there some way to quantify? I've heard of studies done and have looked at studies that say that for every dollar government spends on culture there's a $7 to $14 return. Do you have anything that quantifies this in any meaningful way in your experiences?
9:05 a.m.
Co-Executive Director, La Piscine
We don't have anything on hand right now that speaks to the economic impact, but we know that there are many models. Most of them are led by boards of trade and those kinds of things. We know, however, that from an economic point of view, whether for tourism development and/or local economic development, there are up-to-date numbers available.
We think there's an opportunity to establish other key performance indicators around the impact of cultural development both on the economic side, in terms of growth potential such as we're speaking to today, and in the way that actually can contribute to GDP at the local level and beyond. We are talking about the international now more than ever—being rooted very locally but with international potential—for our creative businesses.
We also think, and I'll pass the floor to my colleague around this, because he works a lot in the field of social impact, there are no measures right now for many of the things we're talking about, in terms of social impact. There has been a debate going on for 25 years in the cultural sector around whether we should or shouldn't develop some. Obviously, in fact, culture—cultural participation, cultural engagement, the impact it has on communities—has very soft-impact sorts of measures.
How do we actually capture that in a way that it doesn't confine the opportunity for art and creativity obviously and necessarily transcend, if you will—what's the word I'm looking for?—numeric coding.
9:10 a.m.
Liberal
Gordie Hogg Liberal South Surrey—White Rock, BC
Your application of the word “entrepreneurship” throughout was what brought me back to asking this question.
9:10 a.m.
Co-Executive Director, La Piscine
That's a key thing.
I don't know whether you want to speak to social—
9:10 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Julie Dabrusin
Unfortunately, that brings you to the end of your time. I will flag that you can always put in written submissions as well, if you have extra things that you want to talk about.
We are now going to Mr. Shields for seven minutes.
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
Martin Shields Conservative Bow River, AB
Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you to the witnesses today. There are some interesting topics and information.
One phrase really got me, and it was from Prince Edward Island. I'm glad to know it's going to open a little longer than usual. I've been to Prince Edward Island.
Other than the three months—and you're talking about three tight months, because I'll tell you, if you get there early in June and late in September, the doors close too often, so expanding that.... I wonder who's left on Prince Edward Island outside of those months.
You said “library”. This is a world I've been involved in. In moving libraries into cultural centres or hubs, the synergy that happens is incredible, both for the library world and in the synergy that happens around it.
For example, we rebuilt in one community a recreation centre for $20 million, and without the library knowing it we added $5 million to the budget for a new library. Their lowest attendance day is triple what they had in the previous location. There are numerous examples of this kind of synergy that happens when you include a library. They're natural programmers. They're natural networkers.
Would you like to talk about the library world?
9:10 a.m.
Executive Director, Creative PEI
Yes, I'll expand on that.
For me, the obvious inspiration is the Halifax Central Library, which is just a brilliant example of expanding the notion of what a library is. I think anybody who has been there will notice that it's packed all the time. It functions, really, as a very public space, in the sense that people are as welcome there as they are on the sidewalk out on the street. People come in sometimes just to snooze or play a video game or something like that. It's already creating the opportunity for people to come together.
The big point I want to make about the Halifax public library, though, is that it programs its space. If you look at its website, you see that all of the rooms are booked, with programming going on all day long. There's always something to do. Sometimes you manage your own time, but at other times there are things for you to do. They're also very open to partnerships with other community organizations. I just look at that and ask, how can we build on that success?
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
Martin Shields Conservative Bow River, AB
Even in a community of 15,000, this library is only closed three days of the year. The library is the most open centre in your community. They run the most hours. That connection I really like, and I think in a sense, if we're talking about libraries, finding a way to get them into your cultural hubs and centres is a critical piece. It works both ways.
Let's go to you in Montreal. You're having troubles getting funding: 18 years and they don't look at funding you. What's with 18 years' work and your not being able to match the criteria?
9:10 a.m.
General Director, Centre Materia
We receive funding from the Canada Council for the Arts for some projects, but the funding is not focused on the centre's mission. We also receive funding from SODEC and the City of Quebec, mainly for the centre's operation.
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
9:10 a.m.
Conservative
Martin Shields Conservative Bow River, AB
All right. Good.
Operational funding you've talked about. I think all three of you talked about operational funding. We hear that from everybody. You get the money for projects, you get the money for infrastructure, but how are you going to be ongoing now that you're open?
How are you going to deal with operating yours?
9:10 a.m.
Co-Executive Director, La Piscine
It's an excellent question. I'll speak a little bit also to Mr. Hogg's question, because the two questions align.
We're a non-profit organization, but we're also partners with a real estate developer who specializes in restoring heritage buildings and managing them, so we have an excellent partner. It's already a hybrid model to start with, and we have a real estate company created in which we have representation. We're the service partner for that relationship to bring this project to life.
We have a number of different tracks to build the business model. First of all, we have some initial seed funding for the programs and to build the business model for the building, which we're actually doing right now. I'll even say business models, because we don't think that there is one business model by which to operate this building. We think there are hybrid models to look at, with a real estate partner and other partners within the sector. Many are interested in exploring the ways we could exploit them.
We run on a principle and will continue to run on a principle of being a lean start-up. We're not going to be a big institution. We're going to be a number of people in an ecosystem who come together around a governance model that is non-profit in order to activate this community and support it and bring in the right people and organizations to partner in growing its potential.
We also have an opportunity, which is in the constitution of the organization, to become an eventual co-owner of the building, which would also activate an opportunity to generate revenue for the non-profit through rental income. There will be a restaurant in it, as I was saying, that will also have an opportunity to service all these things.
We're not looking at a major operating cost. We're really looking at some key activators, if you will, within the organization that can speak in an organic way to what building this community and ecosystem means from the building's point of view.
9:15 a.m.
Conservative
9:15 a.m.
Co-Executive Director, La Piscine
My third recommendation was to support cultural hubs in their operation and programming.
9:15 a.m.
Co-Executive Director, La Piscine
We hope there will be a hybrid model, that there will be some business revenue, but we also think there's a private-public partnership here as well, that the governments will help us generate both economic and—
9:15 a.m.
Conservative
Martin Shields Conservative Bow River, AB
So you are looking for a piece of public funding for operating.
9:15 a.m.
Conservative
Martin Shields Conservative Bow River, AB
Okay. Most of what you just said had nothing to do with that.