Canadian Heritage Committee on May 31st, 2016

[Joseph Volpe]

I don't disagree with what you said. Your observations are bang on.

We divide our market into two parts. First of all, there is the demographic that actually still reads the paper. You have to have something tangible in your hand. That is someone who wants to have something to look at in the morning to give them a summary of what happened the day before and where things are going, to conduct their discussions over the course of the day, and then to recycle it.

The other component is.... I guess I took a leaf out of Mr. Audet's book. You have to update yourself; otherwise, you are going to be lost. We decided to go online. I will give you an indication: we have over 100,000 unique visitors on our site on a monthly basis, and our hit rate is phenomenal for what is essentially a small slice of the Canadian demographic.

We intend to continue to promote that. That is why I said earlier that when the Government of Canada is doing its ad buys—and I see an ad buy, as the lady said, perhaps as a subsidy, too—and you want to reach the people you are going to be representing or that you represent—and I wish you hadn't said “baby boomers” in the same breath as “seniors”, because I am a baby boomer and I didn't like the second part of that definition—we are as good a vehicle as any other, simply because more and more people are becoming more and more accustomed to actually reading things online as opposed to just doing gaming.

[Seamus O'Regan, Liberal, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

Big time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you very much.

I want to thank our witnesses for taking the time to come and present to us. We need to get into business right now, so I will give everyone a minute to say goodbye, and let's get on with our business quickly. Thank you.

Now we need to discuss how we will study Bill C-210 if it passes the House today.

As you well know, Bill C-210 is Mr. Bélanger's bill, and it should pass the House today. If it does, we need to be very quick in dealing with this piece of legislation.

Due to health considerations, the mover or author of that bill is unlikely to be able to attend committee. He is also not going to be able to entertain questions from the committee. As you all know, it is a very small bill. I was hoping that we would be able to deal with this bill on Thursday and then report it to the House on Friday. There is no need to talk about witnesses, because the mover of the bill will not be able to be here.

Mr. Vandal, go ahead.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

I agree, Madam Chair. I move that this committee dedicate one hour at Thursday's meeting to discuss Bill C-210.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you. Is everyone in agreement with that motion?

Mr. Van Loan, go ahead.

[Peter Van Loan, Conservative, York—Simcoe, ON]

Madam Chair, with the greatest of respect, we've actually spoken with individuals who would like to appear as witnesses. I think it is important that we give people an opportunity to speak to this bill.

This is a matter of changing a significant symbol of the country. I recognize that Mr. Bélanger has challenges, and I have no problem with his not appearing as a witness. I would like us to explore the possibility of providing him with some written questions that he could perhaps respond to in writing. I think that might be a reasonable way of accommodating his circumstances.

Certainly I appreciate his circumstances, but this is the national anthem that belongs to all Canadians. We all sing it. People have views on it. I think it's important that they be afforded the opportunity to appear here as witnesses, with at least some who represent a perspective of maintaining the anthem that we have had for many, many years.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Knowing that we have a motion on the floor from Mr. Vandal, I want to give a quick response to you, Mr. Van Loan.

We were in discussion with Mr. Bélanger with regard to how, even if he were not able to be present, he might entertain questions and give us a response in writing. That was about 10 days ago. Since then, I think that things have worsened. I don't believe that Mr. Bélanger will even be able to respond to questions in writing that are sent to him. I think that is becoming an impossibility.

We can add that into whatever we're discussing with regard to this bill, and if you still choose to possibly add an amendment to the one-hour discussion of the bill, we could talk about that. Right now, the motion from Mr. Vandal says that we set aside one hour next Thursday to discuss Bill C-210.

Is there any discussion on this motion?

Mr. Van Loan.

[Peter Van Loan, Conservative, York—Simcoe, ON]

I would certainly move that we afford at least one meeting—one full meeting—for an opportunity for witnesses to appear, both in support or to provide comments on why they wish that the national anthem not be changed, and that we provide names of such witnesses by, say, the end of Thursday.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

We have an amendment here that says that we have one full meeting—

[Peter Van Loan, Conservative, York—Simcoe, ON]

I'd point out that this is extraordinary. We aren't even in possession of this bill yet. It hasn't completed debate in the House. It hasn't been voted on in the House. I don't know if either of these motions is in order, in view of that fact.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Well, it would seem pretty sure—

[Peter Van Loan, Conservative, York—Simcoe, ON]

I'm willing to work on that basis in an accommodating fashion, but certainly—

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Let us imagine that the bill passes, and so we need—

[Peter Van Loan, Conservative, York—Simcoe, ON]

I'm doing it on that basis, but were my amendment not to pass, I would argue that this motion is simply not in order because we don't have carriage of the bill.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Perhaps, but I think given the nature of the mover of the bill, given the situation, we need to prepare for contingencies. This is a contingency motion, so to speak.

[Peter Van Loan, Conservative, York—Simcoe, ON]

Well, this is more than a contingency motion. The motion before us is one of not allowing anybody to speak to it from outside of this committee.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

The motion doesn't say that. The motion just says that the committee will devote one hour to discussing Bill C-210 on Thursday. Now you're suggesting an amendment to the motion. You are suggesting that during that full meeting we have witnesses, and we are discussing your amendment here.

Let us entertain an amendment for one full meeting with witnesses, which will therefore read—

[Peter Van Loan, Conservative, York—Simcoe, ON]

With witnesses' names to be provided by the end of Thursday.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

It certainly means that we will not be discussing this bill on Thursday.

[Peter Van Loan, Conservative, York—Simcoe, ON]

Well, we could discuss it on Thursday if people wish, but I don't see how we can get witnesses here for Thursday. We don't even have a bill in front of us yet.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

All right.

Let us entertain Mr. Van Loan's amendment, which basically says that we will have one full meeting with witnesses to discuss Bill C-210, and that it may not necessarily be on Thursday if we're going to have the list of witnesses on Thursday. We're discussing this amendment now, not the whole motion.

Mr. Nantel.

[Pierre Nantel, NDP, Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC]

I want to speak on the proposition from Mr. Vandal, not Mr. Van Loan's amendment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

All right.

Does anyone wish to speak to Mr. Van Loan's amendment?

Yes, Mr. Vandal.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

I would just call the question.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

I just want you to also be aware that we cannot.... If witnesses wish to come to committee, we cannot force a question; we have to allow them to come, so basically the discussion of whether we have witnesses or not is moot. If people say they wish to come to a committee to discuss a bill, that is part of what the committees are supposed to do.

Being aware of that, we therefore.... The amendment is that there be two hours to discuss Bill C-210, and that the list of witnesses be given by Thursday at the end of the business day.

(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])

The amendment does not carry, so we are back to the original motion by Mr. Vandal, which is for one hour to discuss Bill C-210 on Thursday.