Canadian Heritage Committee on Oct. 25th, 2016

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you, Mr. Maguire.

We'll go to Mr. Nantel for the Democrats.

[Pierre Nantel, NDP, Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I thank all three of you for being with us today. You know how much of a Radio-Canada fan I am, and how happy I am to see that the current government has decided to give you some breathing room so you can continue fulfilling your important mandate. I want to note that when I arrived here earlier today, I congratulated Ms. Conway for her imitative on The Secret Path, which aired Sunday evening on the CBC, and for the efforts you made to bring us the last Tragically Hip performance in Kingston. That was an example of turning on a dime for events that are meaningful for Canadian culture.

You've shown us this morning that you're on board for new technologies like virtual reality, and you should be proud of that. It has indeed been an overwhelming change. It was wise to showcase the CBC as a brand that brings new technologies to communities so we can understand Canadian realities better.

Branding is also about credibility. Bernard Derome continues to say that journalism at the CBC is a proud tradition that will never go out of style. You've established credibility. Members of my staff reminded me that, curiously, one of the most credible sources for the Société Générale in Paris is the Radio-Canada news site, because of its objectivity, and the serious work that is done there.

I think your work, and your ability to renew yourselves, are very inspiring. What you have just told us about your consultations with the Canadian public is exemplary. I hope your efforts will eventually be compatible with the efforts the government has undertaken in relation to the's consultations. I have mentioned many times that I find they lack collegiality, are very discreet and, frankly, very selective as to what ends up being heard. I find that unfortunate, and I hope you will get the opportunity to participate.

You've been talking to us about Strategy 2020, which, if my memory serves, was developed around 2013-2014. A lot of things have changed in that regard. The reinvestments are probably the most positive thing for you.

With respect to your real estate strategy, are there any changes to mention? For example, could you please update us about the Front Street headquarters in Toronto?

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

Well, sir, as part of our overall operations at CBC/Radio-Canada, each of our properties in Canada is constantly reassessed to determine whether we're as efficient as possible, whether we have too many square feet, and whether we can make the environment more collegial and geared more toward a multi-platform approach for the crews who work there.

As for Toronto, several years ago, we examined what we could do with the building, and how the financing was carried out. At the moment, there would be no benefit to trying to sell the building or generate profits from it.

Our continued strategy for the Toronto building is to add tenants in an effort to lower the costs per square foot.

[Pierre Nantel, NDP, Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC]

For Montreal, all kinds of scenarios were discussed. I have two questions for you on the subject, and Mr. Lalande will undoubtedly be able to answer the first.

There has been talk of bringing Radio-Canada closer to the Quartier des spectacles, the performing arts district, if only via a window. Should this be seen as an expression of interest in more frequent live performances?

Also, could you update us about the issue of the Maison de Radio-Canada headquarters in Montreal?

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

With respect to the Maison de Radio-Canada—and Mr. Lalande should be able to complete my remarks in a moment—our expectations about the process are as follows. In the last phase, two consortia were retained for the Maison de Radio-Canada. We've announced that we'll be moving roughly 800 metres east, to the intersection of Papineau Street and René-Lévesque Boulevard, and that we're seeking to sell the remaining land in order to improve the cost of the project. We await the conclusion of these proposals by the end of the year, and, at this stage, we have no reason to doubt that we will finally achieve a resolution in this matter, which has been with us for more than 15 years.

Would you like to add anything on the subject, Mr. Lalande?

[Louis Lalande]

I can just specify that the two proposals currently under study are really captivating. They truly meet our wish to be a stimulating place that strengthens the creativity of the future, not the creativity of the past. Naturally, this will encompass all the live performance dynamics. That's important to us. As you mentioned, my colleague's initiative in relation to The Tragically Hip concert is really inspirational, and we can see how attached Canadians are to their icons. Our role is to ensure we can offer every opportunity for such events to take place. The projects for the new Maison de Radio-Canada will respond to all this in a remarkable way.

[Pierre Nantel, NDP, Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC]

I will be somewhat bold, and ask you the following question.

You've stressed the search for tenants for the Front Street property. I realize that real estate markets differ a great deal, and Montreal's is quite different as well. Do your plans include a wish for the purchaser of the building to look for tenants tied to the telecommunications sector? I have in mind the Centre de l'information, which cost a fortune and was built fairly recently. I understand that certain investments were made 20 years ago, when it was felt this would be sure to guarantee sustainability. Can the Centre de l'information be recuperated in some way?

[Louis Lalande]

As Mr. Lacroix said, there are two processes under way: the development of the new Maison de Radio-Canada, and the transfer of the building and land. When the transaction with the purchaser is completed—there are finalists for this part as well—we will see what the purchaser's plans are. For the moment, however, we must not intervene in the proponent's plans.

[Pierre Nantel, NDP, Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Very well.

In the process that began in 2014, there was talk of a potential loss of 1,500 jobs. Has the horizon changed for CBC employees?

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

You're referring to the number of people affected under our 2020 transformation plan. The cuts and the choices we made for the English network are now complete. Right now, we're trying to improve our knowledge, people and technologies, and the rest of it, to achieve the objectives we set in our 2020 transformation plan. On the Radio-Canada side, the choices made to achieve the budget-balancing objectives are nearly finished. All the people and divisions that need to contribute have been identified.

Mr. Lalande, do you have anything to add on the subject?

[Louis Lalande]

No. All of it is ongoing.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you.

Sorry, Mr. Nantel. We've gone a little over time there.

Now we'll hear from the Liberals again. Mr. Vandal, go ahead.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I thank the witnesses for their remarks.

I think this is an exciting time. Congratulations for your fine work on the Olympics and The Tragically Hip's Secret Path show. It was very impressive. I'm proud to be a supporter of the $675 million, I believe, in new money that will be going to CBC/Radio-Canada in the next five years.

But I have one problem.

There is a problem involving French radio. Last summer, in the very year that your funding was increased by $75 million annually, we learned the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation would be eliminating all regional programming broadcast in the noon hour in Western Canada. For many years, in my riding, the Midi Plus program aired local content out of Saint-Boniface. Now, the broadcast is from Montreal.

Moreover, in Manitoba, a radio program called L'heure de pointe, which airs when people are on their way home, was cut short by an hour. As for television, we used to have 90 minutes of local programming, but that was reduced to 60.

How does the current situation for French-language programming in Manitoba constitute greater openness toward local news for our communities?

[Louis Lalande]

There have indeed been changes to the noon hour radio schedules, for a very simple reason. In francophone markets, particularly regional ones, the number of people listening to radio shows during the noon hour declined considerably. I must specify that there have been no job losses. The plan developed in collaboration with all the regional stations was intended to identify the best ways to increase the value of our news and our existing programming where the listener base is improving.

Morning shows are experiencing growth in all the francophone markets. Afternoon programs have been strengthened as well, and our digital presence has been significantly enhanced. In the case of Winnipeg, it's quite remarkable. It's during the consultations in Winnipeg that Franco-Manitobans expressed the strongest desire for a Radio-Canada local presence in the digital media arena. We developed that component right after that.

This did have impacts. As the situation improved on the digital side, audience levels for the noon-hour radio shows predictably decreased. Let me however assure you that, as I was saying earlier, we intend to increase Radio-Canada's profile on many kinds of content other than news bulletins, in order to better reflect the interests of all Western communities.

I should also remind you that an important cultural program continues to be produced in Winnipeg. These initiatives will ensure Westerners a significant presence on all our platforms.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

If I understand correctly, surveys have shown that people who listened to noon-hour radio programs no longer do so.

[Louis Lalande]

Yes, there's been a major decline in the number of listeners during the noon hour.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

When did you do these surveys?

[Louis Lalande]

The use of digital platforms has grown, especially during the noon slot. It's constantly being said that media consumption is evolving. We can clearly see what's declining and what's increasing. Therefore, we continue to adjust so we can offer the best service possible.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Could you talk to us about the reduction of airtime for the L'heure de pointe radio program, and the fact that local television programming has been reduced by 30 minutes per week?

[Louis Lalande]

It's the same principle. People said they prefer having more resources to create a half-hour of cohesive content, rather than having spread-out resources which result in the need to transplant reports from Montreal and several other places. They said they wanted the focus to be on a solid half-hour of news that better reflects the interests of each of the communities we serve, including Winnipeg, and that does it well.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Franco-Manitoban communities are spread out almost throughout the province. Several people have no access to Internet service or a reliable cellular connection that would enable them to listen to Internet programming. You're putting more of your eggs in the digital basket, but how will you ensure that minority francophone communities are well served?

[Louis Lalande]

Each time we have the opportunity to send this message to other decision-makers, we do it. I'm very much aware of this situation. I travel enough to realize certain communities don't have access to the most optimal Internet service. We remind the various decision-makers of this, because it's a very important communication method nowadays.

Digital infrastructure is not within the CBC's purview, but we take advantage of each opportunity to emphasize the situation. For example, a few years ago, we told the CRTC that developments involving digital technology need to take the access issue into account.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Okay.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Do I have more time?