Evidence of meeting #8 for Canadian Heritage in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was media.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Walter Duszara  Board Secretary, Quebec Community Groups Network
Hugh Maynard  Past President, Quebec Community Groups Network
Ian Morrison  Spokesperson, Friends of Canadian Broadcasting
Peter Miller  Expert on Local Broadcasting, Friends of Canadian Broadcasting
Ann Mainville-Neeson  Vice President, Broadcasting Policy and Regulatory Affairs, TELUS
Frédéric April  Manager, maCommunauté, TELUS Télé Optik, TELUS

10:20 a.m.

NDP

Pierre Nantel NDP Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC

Fine.

Thank you.

10:20 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Monsieur Breton for the Liberals....

10:20 a.m.

Liberal

Pierre Breton Liberal Shefford, QC

I thank the witnesses for their presence here today. We appreciate it greatly.

I am particularly interested in broadband Internet access in rural communities and areas. We are discussing access to local and community news. I am speaking on behalf of my community, but I am also probably speaking for several regions in Canada where access is not available currently. We are pleased about the investments you intend to make. As Mr. Nantel was saying, you will invest $2 billion dollars in Quebec. Perhaps you will be able to tell us in what sector that amount will be invested. Will it be in broadband services? That is my first question.

I have a second one. In the last budget, our government spoke about a $500-million investment in digital infrastructure to help communities access broadband Internet. How will this amount help you to better connect the population?

10:25 a.m.

Vice President, Broadcasting Policy and Regulatory Affairs, TELUS

Ann Mainville-Neeson

Your first question was about the investments we will make in Quebec. You asked whether they will go to broadband services. Yes, for the most part, probably. There are enormous needs in that area. The demand for more bandwidth is becoming increasingly intense. The more applications we have, the better, whether we are talking about media or other services. The investment will certainly be made in fibre optics and wireless particularly, so that we can obtain good bandwidth in all the areas we serve.

What was your second question?

10:25 a.m.

Liberal

Pierre Breton Liberal Shefford, QC

It was about the half-a-billion-dollar investment the government announced in its last budget.

10:25 a.m.

Vice President, Broadcasting Policy and Regulatory Affairs, TELUS

Ann Mainville-Neeson

There is no doubt that that investment will help us greatly to continue to expand the network. The infrastructure in several communities clearly needs to be improved, and that investment is very welcome. It will bolster the private sector investment. However, in our opinion it still is not enough.

10:25 a.m.

Liberal

Pierre Breton Liberal Shefford, QC

Fine.

Of course there is also the whole issue of the cost of access to broadband Internet. It is a problem. The cost still remains quite high everywhere in Canada, in comparison with costs elsewhere.

We of course want to see the best possible prices for our citizens, but the investments you are planning will undoubtedly increase your expenses. However, it is possible to obtain government subsidies.

I would like to know what the impact of your projects may be on costs for the citizens.

10:25 a.m.

Vice President, Broadcasting Policy and Regulatory Affairs, TELUS

Ann Mainville-Neeson

One of the ways of offering different costs is to offer different packages. This is the case throughout the industry. There are packages for the biggest users and others for the smallest ones. Most people only need a certain number of services. And so we offer special services to those who use Netflix, which has an enormous effect on downloads. Other packages offer fewer services, which still give people access to news, and to YouTube services, but does not necessarily provide a 4K download capacity on Netflix.

10:25 a.m.

Liberal

Pierre Breton Liberal Shefford, QC

Fine, excellent.

I have one last question. In your presentation, you mentioned that you had some reservations regarding the subsidies the CRTC suggested for local news broadcasters. Could you tell us a bit more about that?

10:25 a.m.

Vice President, Broadcasting Policy and Regulatory Affairs, TELUS

Ann Mainville-Neeson

Yes, absolutely.

The CRTC is considering drawing upon a fund that supports community programming. This would be added to the amounts we spend ourselves to improve this programming. This money would be allocated to traditional local broadcasters.

First, you need to know that these broadcasters are vertically integrated for the most part, and so they own the networks and the media services. For instance, Bell Media, which belongs to CTV, and other conglomerates, have the means to invest in their own businesses and to put incentives in place so as to obtain subsidies for specific services, even though they already make enormous profits from their other services.

Secondly, we fear that such subsidies will have an adverse effect on the independence of the information produced by our own services, for instance Optik Local.

Thirdly, the subsidies that may be given to traditional television services and news services will not ultimately encourage change, even though some changes may be necessary. Continuing to proceed in the same way as in the past may not be beneficial for the future.

So we feel that granting subsidies is not necessarily the right path to follow at this time.

10:25 a.m.

Liberal

Pierre Breton Liberal Shefford, QC

Thank you very much.

That is all.

10:25 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

That's all?

10:30 a.m.

Liberal

Pierre Breton Liberal Shefford, QC

Yes.

10:30 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Thank you. We're going to the second round, which is a five-minute round.

We begin again with Mr. Maguire for the Conservatives.

10:30 a.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

Thank you very much for your presentation.

The funds that have been made available previously, and now by the new government as well, for Internet expansion into rural communities and into more remote areas is probably best described.... I'll let you describe it, but my analogy would be that this helps you simply because you can reach more people in a faster way. Can you expand on that?

10:30 a.m.

Vice President, Broadcasting Policy and Regulatory Affairs, TELUS

Ann Mainville-Neeson

I'm sorry, I couldn't hear your question. I think I'd better put the earphones on.

10:30 a.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

I'm speaking about the expansion of the Internet throughout Canada. Basically it helps you folks because you can reach more people. Is that accurate that you can reach more folks with it?

10:30 a.m.

Vice President, Broadcasting Policy and Regulatory Affairs, TELUS

Ann Mainville-Neeson

Certainly it's reaching more people. It's also increasing the speed and the capacity in certain areas.

10:30 a.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

Yes, I think it's the speed that is the bigger one. You want people to not only be able to have access here, but to do business at a faster speed as well.

You mentioned that increasing affordable broadband accessibility was important and keeping private broadband investments in mind. Can you expand on how important that is? I know you've put a lot of money into Quebec, as well. You've mentioned the provinces out west that you're putting money into. Can you expand on other areas where you've done the same?

10:30 a.m.

Vice President, Broadcasting Policy and Regulatory Affairs, TELUS

Ann Mainville-Neeson

For broadband expansion, those are obviously areas where we offer consumer Internet. Otherwise we are a national wireless company, and we have made significant investments to increase the capacity of our wireless network for both telephony services and data services, which are increasing. Canadians are huge adopters of wireless data, and lots of investments have gone into our networks to improve the speed and capacity of our wireless networks across the country.

10:30 a.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

In your final comments, you mentioned the positive social change that could come from your recommendations. In regard to examining all forms of transmission and broadcasting, can you expand a little on that as well? I'll give you an opportunity to finalize some of your thoughts on that.

10:30 a.m.

Vice President, Broadcasting Policy and Regulatory Affairs, TELUS

Ann Mainville-Neeson

Yes, one of the points that we wanted to make is that traditional journalism is not the only way to convey information; in fact, it's not just the means of distribution, but the many formats, from comedy, to short-form documentaries, to opinion pieces, all of which serve to inform people and create the locally informed citizen. We shouldn't dismiss those types of programming from our review of local news because, ultimately, it's not just about local news, but all the ways in which our communities are being informed.

If people aren't watching the news anymore and watching TV news—and certainly Statistics Canada is telling us that there has been a significant decline over the last 10 years—but we know that TV viewership is up, then they're watching other forms.

A significant part is entertainment, but I think there's also a significant part in the rise of documentaries and the rise of all kinds of other ways of getting informed.

When you look at these new technologies, like VR—and I do encourage you all to watch the TED Talks by Chris Milk—the importance of getting information and not only having facts told to us, which may or may not resonate with us as people, but also getting an emotional connection with the information and the way it's presented can ultimately lead to better outcomes.

Should we be focusing from a public policy perspective on creating programming that merely provides facts, or on the presentation of facts that may create that emotional connection that will ultimately lead to positive social change?

Ultimately what is the public policy goal of providing news? Is it to create local, informed citizens who will take their responsibilities for better communities in hand?

10:35 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Thank you very much.

I think we should move now to Mr. O'Regan for the Liberals.

10:35 a.m.

Liberal

Seamus O'Regan Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL

Let me ask you, as an Internet service provider that's different from your colleagues, I guess, in terms of actually producing content, what sort of responsibilities weigh on you to provide prescient local information to your customers?

10:35 a.m.

Vice President, Broadcasting Policy and Regulatory Affairs, TELUS

Ann Mainville-Neeson

As a community programming service provider, all of our information is locally relevant. We're looking, obviously, to have issues that resonate more broadly than the community, but we're also seeking the producers who will best address issues they perceive in the community.

It's not a top-down approach where Telus, from our corporate offices, is telling producers to create a story on this or that, but rather a grassroots-up approach of producers. Our attitude is that we're here, and we have funding to give you. What do you think is important for you to tell your communities? What would you like to talk about?

I think it's important to have that as a counterweight to so many other top-down media that we have in this country.