Environment Committee on Dec. 1st, 2011

[Dr. Terry Quinney]

First, may I emphasize that the top priority, in my opinion, with reference to investments from government, would be on the implementation side of the existing action plans that have been authored. They clearly identify the most effective means of successfully addressing this very large problem.

Yes, continued research is an important component, and we should be reminded that there are several federal government agencies that have a very strong research component to their mandate. Off the top of my head, the Canadian Forest Service of Natural Resources Canada with reference to forest pests comes to mind.

[The Chair, Conservative, Mark Warawa]

I'm sorry, time has expired.

Ms. Ambler, you have five minutes.

[Stella Ambler, Conservative, Mississauga South, ON]

Thank you.

Thank you to all of you for coming today, and for preparing such interesting and informative presentations for us.

My question is for Mr. Vanstone. Please know that you didn't actually mention this issue. I'm hoping, though, because this is of personal interest to me and to a couple of dozen of my constituents, that you know something about it, and can shed some light for me, as well as for this study. If not, it's okay, I have another entire line of questioning, so feel free to just tell me that it's not something you want to talk about.

The invasive species I'm talking about, which has a personal impact on ordinary, everyday Canadians in some urban areas, is termites. Does your industry deal with that on a fairly regular basis, or occasionally? No?

[Owen Vanstone]

I would have to confess to a great deal of ignorance about termites.

[Stella Ambler, Conservative, Mississauga South, ON]

Okay. I wasn't trying to ask a trick question. I honestly just thought I'd try to get some information while you were here. Having made a significant investment into your industry in my 50-foot backyard a couple of years ago, I thought I'd ask you that. I am interested in how the government can help out with that sort of thing, so I'll move on.

I'm wondering specifically about the economic impact of invasive land species. Dr. Quinney, may I ask you, from your viewpoint in particular, what the economic impacts of harmful invasive species in Canada are?

[Dr. Terry Quinney]

If I may, I would actually use an illustration from the aquatic side, just to further illustrate.

[Stella Ambler, Conservative, Mississauga South, ON]

Okay, sure.

[Dr. Terry Quinney]

As I've mentioned, on the terrestrial side, you will see, when you get a chance to read a hard copy of my presentation, some statistics specifically with reference to economic impacts on the terrestrial side. They are large.

The reason I wanted to use an aquatic example is that, to the federal government's credit, there are many federal government agencies now helping to address this overall problem. One of them is the Department of Fisheries and Oceans. Just one aquatic invader in the Great Lakes basin—sea lamprey—has cost the taxpayers of Canada and the United States over $1 billion so far since 1960. It continues to cost the taxpayers of both countries $25 million per year to successfully manage the sea lamprey at a level that still allows us to have some healthy fisheries throughout the Great Lakes.

That's just one illustration. I don't think I need to go further. Time permitting, for example, I would talk about the impacts of zebra mussels alone on the Great Lakes. For example, the scientists are referring to Lake Huron as almost a biological desert as a result of the destructive impacts of zebra mussels alone.

[Stella Ambler, Conservative, Mississauga South, ON]

Thank you for that. That is a great example. In fact, the beautiful riding of Mississauga South is on Lake Ontario. The Great Lakes cleanup initiative is something our government is very proud of and is a high priority.

Let me just switch to the hunting industry. In particular, do you depend on tourists in Ontario? If so, how do harmful invasive species affect the tourism hunting industry?

[The Chair, Conservative, Mark Warawa]

You have 20 seconds.

[Dr. Terry Quinney]

That's a great question. I referred to the Environment Canada mandate to finish off that action plan associated with terrestrial animals. Let me give you just one example: the harmful effects of mute swans on other native migratory birds. Migratory bird hunting across the country for recreational, subsistence, and heritage purposes still remains a huge activity. I mentioned more than one million hunters in the country. When it comes to wetlands and wetland-related bird species, mute swans are an invasive species that has to be better addressed than it has been to date.

[The Chair, Conservative, Mark Warawa]

Dr. Quinney, I'm going to have to cut you off. I'm sorry. This is all good, but time has expired.

Madame St-Denis.

[Lise St-Denis, NDP, Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC]

My question is for Mr. Quinney, Ms. Gagnon and Mr. Vanstone.

Ms. Duncan asked Ms. Wallin earlier what she would like to see happen. As she did not answer that question, I will ask you the following.

Mr. Quinney, could you provide us with an overview of the legislative and regulatory amendments your federation proposed to the Ontario Ministry of Natural Resources? Mr. Vanstone, you may keep your answer more general.

[Dr. Terry Quinney]

Thank you for the question. My answer will be a general one rather than a specific one. By that I mean there absolutely is a need for the federal government of Canada to be taking better advantage of its regulatory and legislative abilities in this regard.

We know, for example, that on the aquatic side, the Department of Fisheries and Oceans is actively working on regulations to prevent the introduction of aquatic invasive species to the country. We trust that Environment Canada, for example, given its mandates, and the likes of the Canadian Food Inspection Agency are doing the same.

[Owen Vanstone]

I would say one of the challenges we see is adequate funding for the CFIA. I know that's not Environment Canada's responsibility. But they are facing tremendous cutbacks, as is everybody. When we see inspectors come out from there to try to prevent the sort of thing we're talking about—to look at imports and make sure everything's all right—we find them being cut back, so they can't get out on time. We find staff being cut, so they can't have expertise to actually know what they're looking for. That's a big challenge, which our industry is very aware of when it comes to preventing the spread and the import of problems.

[Lise St-Denis, NDP, Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC]

Mr. Quinney, if we were to compare the impact of terrestrial and aquatic invasive species on biodiversity, how would you describe the impact of aquatic invasive species on terrestrial fauna?

[Dr. Terry Quinney]

I will permit Ms. Gagnon to respond also, with your approval, but my short answer is that in both ecosystems, whether we're talking terrestrial or aquatic and whether on the marine side or the freshwater side, we have the documented proof over decades that these invasives can be extremely harmful to the ecosystems, and therefore benefits are being lost to people and our Canadian society as a result.

[Rachel Gagnon]

The only thing I would add is that the problem we face is that the invasive plants that are affecting biodiversity are falling through the gaps in legislation. When something like a dog-strangling vine or a giant hogweed affects an area, we are simply left to watch it grow because we're missing a little bit of legislation to help us get moving on these invasive plants.

[Lise St-Denis, NDP, Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC]

My last question is for all three witnesses. It's about pesticides.

Some observers, including CropLife, seem to think that pesticide control needlessly complicates the fight against invasive species.

What do you think about that?

[The Chair, Conservative, Mark Warawa]

Thirty seconds.

[Gail Wallin]

Pesticides is an important tool in the toolbox, and we need it for specific plants in the right location.

[Dr. Terry Quinney]

Absolutely. As an example, again from the water side, without a specific pesticide we would not be effectively controlling the sea lamprey throughout the Great Lakes.

[Owen Vanstone]

A blanket ban of any sort of pesticide, herbicides in particular, would really be devastating from our perspective, not only economically but for the ecosystem.

[The Chair, Conservative, Mark Warawa]

Three answers in 20 seconds--that was great.

Mr. Lunney, you have five minutes.

[James Lunney, Conservative, Nanaimo—Alberni, BC]

Thank you very much.

It's a fascinating discussion, and we all wish we had more time.

Being from British Columbia, the west coast, I'll start with a west coast and Vancouver Island perspective. Scotch broom is a big problem on the island. We have teams of volunteers going out, and I am sure engaging volunteers is an important part of your work, Gail.

We have public education campaigns, like Cut Broom in Bloom, because people need to know the best way to get rid of the suckers. Those things are hard to pull out once they get a root.