Evidence of meeting #90 for Environment and Sustainable Development in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was regulations.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Olivier Champagne  Procedural Clerk, Journals Branch, House of Commons
Matt Jones  Assistant Deputy Minister, Pan-Canadian Framework Implementation Office , Department of the Environment
Joyce Henry  Director General, Office of Energy Efficiency, Energy Sector, Department of Natural Resources
Frank DesRosiers  Assistant Deputy Minister, Innovation and Energy Technology Sector, Department of Natural Resources
John Moffet  Acting Associate Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment
Matt Parry  Director General, Strategic Policy Directorate, Department of the Environment

9:30 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte

Go ahead, Linda.

9:30 a.m.

NDP

Linda Duncan NDP Edmonton Strathcona, AB

Frankly, I disagree. I don't see any reason why the analyst has to record the sessions we go to. I trust that my colleagues will take notes of interesting information. I mean, it's not like we're amending legislation. We're going to gather information.

That's going to severely limit us in what we can attend. It may well be that we agree a couple are key. Frankly, what I would like us to do is.... We haven't even had a discussion yet on what is the purpose and focus beyond looking at clean energy.

That will help us to decide—

9:30 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte

Linda, I'm going to stop—

9:30 a.m.

NDP

Linda Duncan NDP Edmonton Strathcona, AB

Let me finish.

9:30 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte

You know what? We'll have it in closed session. We'll do it later.

9:30 a.m.

Liberal

Mark Gerretsen Liberal Kingston and the Islands, ON

That's a great idea.

9:30 a.m.

NDP

Linda Duncan NDP Edmonton Strathcona, AB

When?

9:30 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte

I'm sorry. I thought it was very simple, but it's not. Obviously, it's contentious. We'll deal with it when we come back. We'll have it in a session dedicated to that task. Then we won't keep our guests waiting. We can have a good discussion.

9:30 a.m.

NDP

Linda Duncan NDP Edmonton Strathcona, AB

In the meantime, maybe people can suggest what they think the focus of that study should be—

9:30 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte

Absolutely.

9:30 a.m.

NDP

Linda Duncan NDP Edmonton Strathcona, AB

—at the beginning. It would be very helpful.

9:35 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte

I'm looking forward to that.

Please consider that over the holidays and put your thoughts forward. We'll have a discussion when we come back.

Getting on to the next part of the meeting, we're looking to move to our fourth study. It was to be our third, but we inserted the heritage study in there because it was appropriate. The third study was to look at climate change, and it had a whole suite of things that we could look at. It's a very big subject.

The clerk and I thought maybe it would be helpful, as we work to put our plan together going forward for this next study, to find out where we are with the pan-Canadian framework. The pan-Canadian framework was a lot of work done with provinces, territories, indigenous groups, and other governments to try to come up with an approach to tackle climate change. Before we really delve into where we're going with this study, I thought it would be a good start to get a sense of where we are, so I invited the departments to come and give us an update. That's why they're in front of us today.

I welcome all of them, and I'll turn the floor over to them.

9:35 a.m.

Matt Jones Assistant Deputy Minister, Pan-Canadian Framework Implementation Office , Department of the Environment

Thank you, Madam Chair.

9:35 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte

I should have introduced all of you. That would have been a good thing for me to do. My apologies.

From the Department of the Environment we have Matt Jones, assistant deputy minister in the pan-Canadian framework implementation office. We have John Moffet, acting associate assistant deputy minister in the environmental protection branch. We have Matt Parry, director general of the strategic policy directorate.

From the Department of Finance we have Sean Keenan, director of the sales tax division.

From the Department of Natural Resources we will have Frank DesRosiers, who is still on his way. He's assistant deputy minister in the innovation and energy technology sector, and Joyce Henry is director general in the office of energy efficiency, in the energy sector.

Welcome to all.

Now we can properly start. Thank you.

9:35 a.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Pan-Canadian Framework Implementation Office , Department of the Environment

Matt Jones

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Good morning. We're very pleased to be here today. I'm pleased to be here on behalf of Environment and Climate Change Canada and to be discussing the implementation of the pan-Canadian framework. I'm Matt Jones from Environment and Climate Change Canada.

I understand you're interested in receiving an overview of the status of implementation of the framework. We're happy to provide that. We've provided the committee with a written status report that has been recently released publicly.

I'll begin with a quick overview of the pan-Canadian framework, and I'll be followed by one of my colleagues from the Ministry of Natural Resources, who will provide an update on clean technology programming.

Addressing climate change and supporting clean growth is, as you know, a high-priority issue for the Government of Canada and subnational governments across the country. Through the Vancouver declaration, first ministers agreed to meet or exceed Canada's 2030 targets and to increase that level of ambition over time to drive greater emission reductions and develop a pan-Canadian framework on clean growth and climate change.

For the first time, there was agreement across all provincial and territorial governments on an emission reduction target and a commitment to work together to meet that target. First ministers released the pan-Canadian framework on clean growth and climate change, Canada's plan for implementing its commitments under the Paris Agreement, on December 9, 2016, a year ago last Saturday.

The pan-Canadian framework, as I believe members are aware, has four main pillars: pricing carbon pollution; complimentary actions to further reduce emissions across the economy, including in agriculture and forestry; measures to adapt to the impacts of climate change and build resilience to those impacts; as well as actions to accelerate innovation and support the uptake of clean technology and create jobs.

The Government of Canada is also making major investments in clean growth and climate change to support the implementation of the framework. The government is investing $2.2 billion to support clean technology and innovation, and over $21 billion in green infrastructure, including a $2-billion disaster mitigation and adaptation fund. We've also launched the low-carbon economy leadership fund. Eligible sectors include agriculture, forestry, industry, and residential and commercial buildings.

Turning to carbon pricing, this is a foundational element of the pan-Canadian framework because it provides incentives to reduce emissions while encouraging innovation and sending long-term signals to investors and consumers in order to transform the economy over time. In October 2016 the government published the pan-Canadian approach to pricing carbon pollution. This document outlines the government's intention to have carbon pricing in place throughout Canada in 2018.

Recognizing that Canada's four largest provinces, representing about 80% of our population, already had pricing systems in place, it gives all provinces and territories the flexibility to implement the pricing system of their choice, either a direct price system such as B.C. or Alberta's hybrid mix of carbon tax on fuels plus emissions trading systems for large industry, or cap-and-trade systems such as those adopted in Ontario and Quebec. We refer to this document as the federal pricing benchmark.

Over the past year we have worked with each province and territory that does not already have a pricing system, to help them understand the requirements and assess options. We have undertaken extensive economic modelling on behalf of many provinces and territories, and in some cases have joined provincial and territorial officials in public consultations and information sessions. With the release of climate strategies by Manitoba and Saskatchewan over the last few weeks, every province has issued statements supporting some form of carbon pricing.

We have also worked closely with each of the territories to undertake the analysis committed to in the pan-Canadian framework, to assess the possible impacts of carbon pricing, and to help them identify solutions that account for their special circumstances. The government has also committed to implementing a federal pricing system, which will apply in any province or territory that asks for it and in any jurisdiction that does not implement a carbon pricing system that is aligned with the benchmark. We refer to this federal pricing system as the backstop.

In May of this year we released a document that describes the proposed design of the federal backstop pricing system. It will be quite similar to the system Alberta plans to adopt next year, combining a carbon levy on fuel that will be paid by distributors and importers, with an emissions trading system for large emitters. The latter will be designed to create an incentive for emissions reduction and innovation from exposure to a carbon price, while reducing the total price paid so as to avoid adverse impacts on competitiveness and the risk of carbon leakage.

Under the pan-Canadian framework, federal, provincial, and territorial governments committed to continue making meaningful action to reduce greenhouse gas emissions across all regions and sectors of the economy. The approach complements carbon pricing by expanding and linking clean electricity systems across the country; improving energy efficiency of vehicles, buildings, and industry; putting more zero-emission vehicles on the road; using cleaner fuels to power the economy; reducing reliance on diesel in remote communities; and reducing emissions and increasing carbon storage in the agricultural, forestry, and waste sectors. These actions will help cut emissions, and will also help drive clean growth by spurring development of new clean technologies and creating jobs in many sectors.

In the first year of implementation, significant progress has been made to advance measures across all sectors. Regulations are being designed, drafted, and consulted on. New programs are being established. Many of these processes can take years to complete, but due to focused action and collaboration, this work is being moved forward on accelerated timelines.

Collaborations across jurisdictions have been very strong, with governments working together to coordinate actions to ensure long-term success. Responsibility for reporting on progress is shared across a number of federal and provincial ministerial tables. For example, ministers of the environment are overseeing progress on key regulatory measures. Transportation ministers have been overseeing work on important measures to help the transition of Canada's transportation systems toward a low-carbon future, in collaboration with energy and innovation ministers. Forestry ministers and ministers of agriculture have also been overseeing mitigation actions in those sectors.

Turning quickly to adaptation, in the pan-Canadian framework the federal, provincial, and territorial governments identified five priority areas for collaboration to build resilience to a changing climate across the country. These priorities are ensuring that Canadians have information and expertise to consider climate change in their planning and decision-making; building climate resilience through infrastructure; working to protect the health and well-being of Canadians; supporting, particularly the vulnerable regions and indigenous communities to address climate impacts; and reducing the risk to communities from climate-related hazards and disasters.

This first year of implementation of the pan-Canadian framework provided a solid foundation for this work, including the announcement of significant investments in adaptation and climate resilience. These actions range from measures to improve access to climate science and information that supports adaptation decision-making, to investments in built and natural infrastructure to increase climate resilience in communities, to efforts to help better understand and take action to address climate-related health risks such as extreme heat and infectious diseases.

For example, to ensure that Canadians have the information and expertise they need to consider climate change impacts and adaptation solutions and decision-making, the federal, provincial, and territorial governments are working in partnership, through the design and launch of the new Canadian centre for climate services. In addition to work under the framework, governments have also been working collaboratively on adaptation. They continue to do so through the various working groups under the adaptation platform, and through a concerted program of work and regular meetings under the Canadian Council of Ministers of the Environment and other fora.

In the pan-Canadian framework, first ministers directed federal, provincial, and territorial governments to report annually to Canadians and to first ministers on the progress achieved. We are pleased to have published this report on Saturday, December 9, the one-year anniversary of the first ministers meeting that launched the pan-Canadian framework. It summarizes in some detail the progress that has been made on all of the initiatives within the pan-Canadian framework, as well as additional measures pursued by provincial and territorial governments.

Making progress on climate change will require significant sustained action now and over the long term. Environment and Climate Change Canada has committed to continue to work closely with other government departments, provinces, and territories, indigenous peoples, municipalities, and other sectors of the economy.

Thank you for your time. I will turn to my colleagues from NRCan for their statements on clean technology and clean growth.

9:45 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte

Joyce, I understand that Mr. DesRosiers is still coming and you're okay to present for us.

Thank you very much.

9:45 a.m.

Joyce Henry Director General, Office of Energy Efficiency, Energy Sector, Department of Natural Resources

Sure. Thank you very much.

It's a pleasure to be here on behalf of the Department of Natural Resources. Frank DesRosiers will join us shortly. He apparently is held up in traffic, so I will present the deck. Some of this is in Frank's area more than mine, but I'm happy to at least present. Then we can move forward on questions.

I believe the deck has been distributed. Its purpose is to do three things: illustrate the role of clean technology in Canada's economy and in support of the pan-Canadian framework; provide an update on the implementation of clean technology measures announced in budget 2017; and discuss the Department of Natural Resources' role in developing national building codes.

I'll turn to page 3 in the presentation. Natural Resources Canada leads or supports 30 of the over 50 initiatives in the pan-Canadian framework, so we have a fairly significant role to play in its implementation and success. We lead on initiatives that span key areas, including mitigation, which is clean electricity, electric vehicles, energy efficiency, and forestry; clean technology and innovation; and adaptation.

On page 4, the vision here is to support clean technology and innovation that positions Canada to compete as a global leader as the world transitions to a low-carbon economy. Clean technologies can enable the sustainable development of Canada's resource sectors and generate exports, creating new markets for Canadian businesses. We know that the clean technology market is growing rapidly. Currently within Canada, approximately 850 clean technology firms sustain over 55,000 direct jobs. In 2015, estimated revenues were in the range of $13 billion, of which $6.7 billion were from exports.

Canadians will benefit from our investment in clean technology and innovation in a number of ways. I'll give two examples. One is the building sector, where we're looking to reduce cost to homeowners and building owners. Consumers can also benefit by living in homes that offer greater comfort, durability, air quality, and resale value. Canadians will also have access to more energy-efficient, affordable, lighter, and safer vehicles, and can optimize the efficiency of their vehicle and reduce fuel consumption, in this way saving money.

I think page 5 speaks for itself. It lays out a number of the investments the government is making in this area. I won't go through that.

The next few slides give an overview of what we're doing on mitigation. On this slide the focus is clean electricity. Natural Resources Canada has the energy innovation program fund, which is an early-stage research and development fund that funds programs across the energy sector. As one example, funds are provided to the Offshore Energy Research Association of Nova Scotia to help them address knowledge and technology gaps related to marine renewables, such as tidal energy. So far, the program has allocated $9.5 million to increase penetration of renewables and $4.1 million for northern clean energy.

NRCan is also funding commercial-scale demonstration and deployment of clean technology through national programs under the green infrastructure component of the investing in Canada plan. Clean electricity national programs include money to advance smart grid and storage technologies, funds for emerging renewables not yet in Canada, and, as Matt mentioned, funding to reduce reliance on diesel in remote and rural communities. These programs are expected to be formally launched in early 2018, but some steps have already been taken to ensure prompt program delivery, including a preliminary call for proposals.

Page 7 gives an overview of what we're doing to mitigate in the transportation area. This includes early-stage R and D in targeting advances for lighter materials for more fuel-efficient vehicles and lower-cost batteries for more affordable electric vehicles, and addressing barriers to low-carbon fuels such as biofuels. The vehicle-focused R and D is complemented by $182 million in investments to demonstrate and deploy low-carbon infrastructure, including for electric vehicle charging stations. The Government of Canada is working very closely with provinces and territories and with industry and other key stakeholders on the development of a Canada-wide zero-emission vehicle strategy, which we expect to be finalized in 2018.

On page 8 is an overview of the mitigation we're focused on for industry. NRCan programs are focused on driving the transition to an industry sector that utilizes clean electricity and low-carbon fuels in more efficient processes. I'm going to focus on the energy efficiency components of this. Under the pan-Canadian framework's industry strategy, we have a suite of voluntary programs that industry can access, including energy star for industry and ISO 50001 certification, which can enhance energy efficiency in 21 industrial sectors across Canada.

The industry strategy reflects government's commitments to accelerate the uptake of industrial energy management systems that improve energy efficiency and industrial competitiveness, which can save industry money. Some of these instruments include the energy star for industry program launched in August 2017, which will allow Canadian companies to compare their energy performance with North American competitors, and support for certification under the international ISO 50001 energy management standard.

Page 9 focuses on the built environment and mitigation measures there. I understand there was an interest from the committee in building codes. I would just note that our context in Canada is quite unique because we have five climate zones, so this affects the way we approach building codes. We try to take a flexible approach, which is one of the principles underlined in the pan-Canadian framework, in terms of putting in place a model building code that provinces and territories can then adopt. We're taking a tiered approach to develop net-zero energy-ready codes for new buildings and homes, with the goal being that provincial and territorial governments would adopt these codes by 2030. We're working very closely with provincial and territorial governments, as well as industry partners, in the code development process. This approach will also provide clear signals to the market, for equipment and material manufacturers, as well as provide time for builders and inspectors to develop the skills and knowledge needed to deliver on these new standards, which would be, obviously, highly stringent.

We're also investing in tools and training to help the building industry get ready. This is the reason the target date of 2030 was set. It provides time for a gradual transition to net-zero energy-ready code for new buildings, including adoption of new construction practices and greater availability of high-performance equipment, which will lead to decreased costs in putting these buildings in place.

We're already working with the construction industry through research, development, and demonstration projects to lower the cost of building to higher standards and undertaking energy retrofits in buildings.

On page 10, we highlight briefly clean growth in the natural resource sectors. We're investing $155 million over four years to support clean technology RD and D, research, development, and demonstration, across the mining, forestry, and energy sectors. This program is the first of its kind to promote and require collaboration with provinces and territories. There is science and technology assistance for clean tech through industry-led projects that can access specialized expertise and equipment at federal laboratories. This is expected to be well received by small and medium-sized enterprises, which characterize our clean technology sector in Canada but often lack the capital required for advanced research and development facilities.

On November 20 of this year, the clean growth in the natural resource sector program was launched and information has started to flow on this, including through two webinars attended by more than 1,000 participants. The government expects to select projects for this in the summer of 2018.

Finally, on page 11, we highlight briefly where we're trying to lead and support cost-cutting measures to enhance our clean technology ecosystem. One of these is the work we do with the Privy Council Office to deliver the clean technology stream of the impact Canada initiative, which was announced in budget 2017. It's focused on coming up with innovative policy mechanisms by targeting priority barriers and setting specific outcomes. These outcomes would be identified and defined through co-creation with stakeholders to drive clean technology breakthroughs.

I'll touch briefly on our greening government operations. The government has also committed to leading by example by reducing its own emissions in buildings and fleets. Last year, the President of the Treasury Board announced that the government would reduce its greenhouse gas emissions by 40% by 2030, or earlier, using 2005 as the baseline year.

Natural Resources Canada's office deals with energy efficiency, and through our laboratories has technical expertise which, in conjunction with the National Research Council and Public Services and Procurement Canada, will support our federal partners to reduce their emissions through internal operations. We're looking at 89% for buildings and 11% for fleets.

I'm going to leave it there. Thank you very much for your time.

9:55 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte

I certainly didn't want to cut you off, but we're running over the time. Thank you very much.

We'll start with questions.

Mr. Bossio.

9:55 a.m.

Liberal

Mike Bossio Liberal Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON

Thank you all very much for being here and for this introduction to an area of study we want to pursue.

My own interests are based on the building codes. I have a number of questions.

On building codes, are we looking at best practices around the world as well as other jurisdictions around energy efficiency technology that's being utilized, energy generation or creation that can be realized in the building code sector?

9:55 a.m.

Director General, Office of Energy Efficiency, Energy Sector, Department of Natural Resources

Joyce Henry

Yes, we are. What I can do is describe a little bit of the process that is used for building codes.

There's a very structured and consensus-based process that exists. The National Research Council is actually the secretariat for that. It supports a number of technical committees that look at all aspects of this. It has a broad expertise from across the building sector. Architects, designers, inspectors, construction specialists, equipment specialists, all come together on a consensus basis to work out the new building codes that can be adopted. Certainly, analyses of best practices in other jurisdictions, cost-benefit analyses, and public consultations are all part of that process.

From there, the process goes to the Canadian commission on building and fire codes for approval. There are also technical policy committees from the provinces and territories that weigh in on that process as well, so it's quite a broad-based process.

10 a.m.

Liberal

Mike Bossio Liberal Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON

When we're looking at building codes, does that encompass residential, retail, and industry?

10 a.m.

Director General, Office of Energy Efficiency, Energy Sector, Department of Natural Resources

Joyce Henry

It does, yes. The building code has a housing component to it, and it also covers commercial and institutional buildings.

10 a.m.

Liberal

Mike Bossio Liberal Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON

When we're looking at GHG emissions, do we know the GHG emissions around each one of those sectors? Through new building codes, do we know where we want to get to? I know we talk about net-zero energy ready, but does net-zero energy ready only apply to residential or does it also apply to retail and industrial?

10 a.m.

Director General, Office of Energy Efficiency, Energy Sector, Department of Natural Resources

Joyce Henry

I'd say two things. Building codes have obviously been advancing for several years now. My understanding is that there's a new code expected to come out this spring. There's also 2011 and 2015. The codes work on a five-year cycle.

Under the pan-Canadian framework, what's being asked is that the cycle be accelerated and we adopt a much more stringent code, which would be published, and it would be tiered, so it would be advancing over a number of years, which would then be adopted by the provinces and territories by 2030. That's for new buildings, and that would be commercial, institutional, and houses. Then there would also be a retrofit code, which won't be net-zero energy ready for existing buildings. That would also be ready by 2022. For the net-zero energy ready codes, we're supposed to see the first tranche of that by 2020.

10 a.m.

Liberal

Mike Bossio Liberal Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON

Once again, do we know what the GHG emission levels are right now for those sectors?