Evidence of meeting #8 for Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was cbc.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Konrad W. von Finckenstein  Chairman, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
Graham Sheppard  Senior Annual Returns Auditor, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
Christianne Laizner  General Counsel , Telecommunications, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
Gregory Thomas  Federal and Ontario Director, Canadian Taxpayers Federation

10:15 a.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Patricia Davidson

Thanks, Mr. Del Mastro.

We will now move to Mr. Andrews.

10:15 a.m.

Liberal

Scott Andrews Liberal Avalon, NL

Welcome, Gregory.

How many requests to the CBC has the Canadian Taxpayers Federation made using freedom of information?

10:15 a.m.

Federal and Ontario Director, Canadian Taxpayers Federation

Gregory Thomas

About half a dozen.

10:15 a.m.

Liberal

Scott Andrews Liberal Avalon, NL

Over what time period?

10:15 a.m.

Federal and Ontario Director, Canadian Taxpayers Federation

Gregory Thomas

The last two or three years, I'd say.

10:15 a.m.

Liberal

Scott Andrews Liberal Avalon, NL

We've been told that in 2007-08, there were no requests from organizations; in 2008-09 there were only four requests from organizations to the CBC; and then in 2009-10 there were seven requests from organizations, all representing less than 3% of the requests that have come in.

You said half a dozen?

10:15 a.m.

Federal and Ontario Director, Canadian Taxpayers Federation

10:15 a.m.

Liberal

Scott Andrews Liberal Avalon, NL

How many of those requests have not been fulfilled?

10:15 a.m.

Federal and Ontario Director, Canadian Taxpayers Federation

Gregory Thomas

I don't believe any of them have been fulfilled.

10:15 a.m.

Liberal

Scott Andrews Liberal Avalon, NL

In those half a dozen requests, what information were you requesting?

10:15 a.m.

Federal and Ontario Director, Canadian Taxpayers Federation

Gregory Thomas

Well, for example, we sent them the roster of executive members of the Friends of Canadian Broadcasting and asked CBC if any of those people were on the CBC's payroll or had received public contracts, or if they were in any way beholden to the CBC. And they refused to answer. We appealed to the Information Commissioner. The Information Commissioner ordered them to answer and they still refused.

10:15 a.m.

Liberal

Scott Andrews Liberal Avalon, NL

That's one request. What were some of the other requests?

10:15 a.m.

Federal and Ontario Director, Canadian Taxpayers Federation

Gregory Thomas

There was a Radio Canada documentary on the Nordiques—and here I should mention that we are actively opposed to the idea of spending public funds for a hockey arena in Quebec City—that coincided with some political activity in Quebec City and we thought the timing was suspicious. We put in a request relating to the costs of that documentary program and they refused to answer it.

10:15 a.m.

Liberal

Scott Andrews Liberal Avalon, NL

In that case, you don't think that goes to journalistic integrity?

10:15 a.m.

Federal and Ontario Director, Canadian Taxpayers Federation

Gregory Thomas

We just want to know what it cost.

10:15 a.m.

Liberal

Scott Andrews Liberal Avalon, NL

Would you have any problem tabling your requests to this committee? I'm finding it frustrating that we hear about all of these requests that have been denied, but I don't think we've seen what exactly we're talking about. I know a lot of the stuff is before the courts, but could you table for the committee the half a dozen requests you've made to the CBC, so that we could look at what exactly has been denied?

10:15 a.m.

Federal and Ontario Director, Canadian Taxpayers Federation

Gregory Thomas

Yes.

We are just like any other research organization or your caucus researchers. After you hit your head against a brick wall and you realize that they're never going to answer any of the requests, you don't bother filing them. We could have filed 100 requests and had all 100 turned down.

10:15 a.m.

Liberal

Scott Andrews Liberal Avalon, NL

In fairness to the CBC, they don't turn down all requests.

10:15 a.m.

Federal and Ontario Director, Canadian Taxpayers Federation

Gregory Thomas

And in fairness to the CBC, we have had very public scraps--very nasty, ugly public scraps--with the government over its access to information. We were invited to appear here. We didn't apply to come here and dump on the CBC today; we were asked to come and share our experience. We haven't made a big point of broadcasting what our experience has been, so whoever invited us couldn't have known what our experience has been.

10:20 a.m.

Liberal

Scott Andrews Liberal Avalon, NL

I think it's important that we be fair and we look at the experiences people have had with the CBC and all of these things we're talking about with regard to the CBC and freedom of information, because if you request x number and they are all turned down, or the CBC gets back to you on four and there are two that are turned down, it's not fair to cast them in the light of their having turned down all requests. I think that's important to know.

10:20 a.m.

Federal and Ontario Director, Canadian Taxpayers Federation

Gregory Thomas

I think when you appeal to the Information Commissioner and you get a positive ruling, and they still refuse to acknowledge it, and it has nothing to do with any of their journalistic integrity or programming or any of their exemptions, then you can draw the conclusion that trying to get information from them is a big waste of time.

10:20 a.m.

Liberal

Scott Andrews Liberal Avalon, NL

Thank you.

10:20 a.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Patricia Davidson

Thank you very much, Mr. Andrews.

Mr. Thomas, I think you indicated that you would be willing to circulate the ATIP request to this committee. It would be appropriate to do that through the clerk, please.

10:20 a.m.

Federal and Ontario Director, Canadian Taxpayers Federation

10:20 a.m.

Conservative

The Vice-Chair Conservative Patricia Davidson

We will now move to Mr. Calkins, for seven minutes, please.