Evidence of meeting #13 for Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was agents.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Michael Ferguson  Auditor General of Canada, Office of the Auditor General of Canada
Marc Mayrand  Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada
Mary Dawson  Conflict of Interest and Ethics Commissioner, Office of the Conflict of Interest and Ethics Commissioner

12:55 p.m.

Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada

Marc Mayrand

It may discourage people from seeking employment with our agencies, knowing that they could be subject to an examination that would be the topic of a report to Parliament, without knowing very precisely from the legislation what the parameters would be of any such examination and what would be the extent of confidentiality in looking at those matters. I think that would be a concern for employees.

12:55 p.m.

Auditor General of Canada, Office of the Auditor General of Canada

Michael Ferguson

I don't think it would affect our independence, but I think the way it is drafted now, there are some irritants in it that really aren't necessary and wouldn't help our independence.

12:55 p.m.

NDP

Mathieu Ravignat NDP Pontiac, QC

I have a second, very simple question.

Could it potentially weaken existing rules in place, codes, acts, with regard to definitions of partisan activity within your different offices?

12:55 p.m.

Auditor General of Canada, Office of the Auditor General of Canada

Michael Ferguson

It won't affect the way we define these types of activities or the way we manage conflict of interest. But I think, as I've said before, it raises some questions based on some things that are defined in other acts versus the way they're defined in this act. I think what it can do is just cause some confusion.

12:55 p.m.

Conflict of Interest and Ethics Commissioner, Office of the Conflict of Interest and Ethics Commissioner

Mary Dawson

It's actually not defined in this bill, so I think it would have minimal impact on the other instances where there was a more fulsome definition.

12:55 p.m.

NDP

Mathieu Ravignat NDP Pontiac, QC

Were your offices contacted prior to the drafting of this bill for advice? Was there any form of consultation?

12:55 p.m.

Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada

12:55 p.m.

Conflict of Interest and Ethics Commissioner, Office of the Conflict of Interest and Ethics Commissioner

12:55 p.m.

Auditor General of Canada, Office of the Auditor General of Canada

12:55 p.m.

NDP

Mathieu Ravignat NDP Pontiac, QC

I have a few other questions to ask. They deal more specifically with the content of the bill.

12:55 p.m.

NDP

The Chair NDP Pat Martin

You only have one minute.

12:55 p.m.

NDP

Mathieu Ravignat NDP Pontiac, QC

Okay. I will therefore move quickly.

Do you know which criteria would be used to determine whether a person occupying a position at the office of an agent of Parliament has behaved in a partisan manner in carrying out their duties and responsibilities? In fact, is there even one single criterion that has been set out?

1 p.m.

Chief Electoral Officer, Elections Canada

Marc Mayrand

In my opinion, that is a question that the committee must consider. As we have pointed out in our letter and in our remarks today, the bill does not contain a definition or any criteria concerning what partisan conduct is. Currently, we rely on the statements of the Public Service Commission and on our experience. Generally, it is based on political activities.

As for determining whether non-political activity could be partisan in nature, I think that that is one of the issues raised by clause 9 of the bill.

1 p.m.

NDP

The Chair NDP Pat Martin

That concludes your time, Mr. Ravignat.

That concludes the time we have for testimony and questioning.

Thank you very much to the three agents of Parliament who made themselves available to us today.

I remind committee members that submissions for future witnesses are to be in by the end of business day today.

Also, I remind committee members that the meeting on Thursday is cancelled because of the address to Parliament by the Aga Khan.

This meeting is adjourned.