Evidence of meeting #61 for Finance in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was transfer.
A recording is available from Parliament.
7:15 p.m.
Director, Task Force, Special Projects, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development
In the 1970s there were about seven working-aged Canadians for every senior. Today, there are about four working-aged Canadians for every senior and by 2030 that will be half, or about two working-aged Canadians per senior.
7:20 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
So in essence we have a choice based on that. We either quadruple or multiply by seven the premiums that Canadians pay into this program.... That's in essence what we have to do: we either have to multiply it by seven or we have to find some other way to soften the impact on the Canadian worker and seniors generally.
Is that fair? Is it a balance?
7:20 p.m.
Director, Task Force, Special Projects, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development
The demographics speak for themselves. It's clear that the demographics are putting pressure on the OAS program.
7:20 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
Yes.
In essence, whoever supports that program has to pay more, which is Canadian taxpayers.
7:20 p.m.
Director, Task Force, Special Projects, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development
It's completely funded through the general tax revenues.
7:20 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
Exactly.
So they're going to have to take the money from somewhere in order put into that program, either from health care or whatever it may be. Is that fair to say?
7:20 p.m.
Conservative
7:20 p.m.
Director General, Seniors and Pensions Policy Secretariat, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development
It's paid for by taxes.
7:20 p.m.
Conservative
7:20 p.m.
Liberal
Scott Brison Liberal Kings—Hants, NS
Thank you very much.
Mr. Rodrigue, I would like to clarify something. You said it is very difficult to provide us with the information prepared in briefings for the budget. But the information has been prepared, of course.
7:20 p.m.
Chief, Social policy, Income Security, Department of Finance
I can't comment on that. It's a cabinet confidence.
7:20 p.m.
Liberal
Scott Brison Liberal Kings—Hants, NS
Section 69 of the Access to Information Act specifically states that the following is not covered by cabinet confidence. In fact, in the previous Parliament, the Speaker ruled that the government was in contempt of Parliament. Section 69 refers to,
discussion papers the purpose of which is to present background explanations, analyses of problems or policy options to Council
—meaning cabinet—
for consideration by Council in making decisions.
If the decisions to which the discussion papers relate have been made public, that is, once a decision has been rendered publicly, those discussion papers are no longer covered by cabinet confidence.
Has the cabinet made a public decision to raise the qualifying age of OAS from 65 to 67? I would like to confirm this.
7:20 p.m.
Chief, Social policy, Income Security, Department of Finance
It was announced in the budget plan.
7:20 p.m.
Liberal
Scott Brison Liberal Kings—Hants, NS
Okay.
So you would agree, then, that background explanations and analyses of problems or policy options for cabinet are no longer covered by cabinet confidence once the cabinet decision has been made, based on section 69 of the Access to Information Act?
7:20 p.m.
Chief, Social policy, Income Security, Department of Finance
I have no expertise in that area.
7:20 p.m.
Liberal
7:20 p.m.
Chief, Social policy, Income Security, Department of Finance
As I explained before, we're here to answer questions on the proposed amendments in this bill.
7:20 p.m.
Liberal
Scott Brison Liberal Kings—Hants, NS
Okay.
Were cabinet ministers provided with any background explanation or analysis of the cost savings to the government as a result of this?
7:20 p.m.
Chief, Social policy, Income Security, Department of Finance
The Minister of Finance has already answered that question.
I have no further comment.
7:20 p.m.
Liberal
Scott Brison Liberal Kings—Hants, NS
The minister didn't answer that question actually.
I'm asking whether cabinet has been provided with the information and the background analysis of the savings to the government from this decision?
7:20 p.m.
Chief, Social policy, Income Security, Department of Finance
My role is to answer questions related to the proposed legislative amendments in this bill and how they're going to work.
I have no further comments on the estimated savings if there are any.
