You have 30 seconds, Mr. Adler
Evidence of meeting #63 for Finance in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was changes.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #63 for Finance in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was changes.
A recording is available from Parliament.
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Mark Adler Conservative York Centre, ON
Thank you, Chair.
Mr. Linton, if a party or a group of workers is under a collective agreement and the collective agreement expires and the organization or business they work for has not been able to settle for over a year with those workers, how would you classify that?
12:35 p.m.
Director, Government and Political Affairs, United Food and Commerical Workers Union
I'm not sure what your question is.
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Mark Adler Conservative York Centre, ON
In other words, would you encourage NDP members who have unionized staffers who have not had a collective agreement for over a year—
12:35 p.m.
Voices
Oh, oh!
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Mark Adler Conservative York Centre, ON
—to settle with their workers in a fair and equitable manner?
12:35 p.m.
Director, Government and Political Affairs, United Food and Commerical Workers Union
I can't see the relevance of that question to Bill C-38. I'm sorry.
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Rajotte
Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Adler.
Monsieur Caron, s'il vous plaît.
12:35 p.m.
NDP
Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC
Mr. Sommers, since you have been neglected until now, my first question is for you.
I would like to read you a quote from a column by Andrew Coyne in the National Post about Bill C-38 and the process that is used. This is what he wrote:
Not only does this make a mockery of the confidence convention, shielding bills that would otherwise be defeatable within a money bill, which is not: It makes it impossible to know what Parliament really intended by any of it. We’ve no idea whether MPs supported or opposed any particular bill in the bunch, only that they voted for the legislation that contained them. There is no common thread that runs between them, no overarching principle; they represent not a single act of policy, but a sort of compulsory buffet.
Would you agree with this assessment by Mr. Coyne?
12:35 p.m.
Coordinator, Democracy Watch
Yes, I would agree with it and he's got it spot on. It's impossible for members of Parliament to properly represent their constituency regarding omnibus legislation. It's something that Stephen Harper has said himself, and something that I believe we're hearing from individual MPs on all sides. If not overtly, there are at least rumblings about this. There's just too much to consider.
12:40 p.m.
NDP
Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC
In fact, Mr. Coyne wrote about that. Other journalists, such as John Ibbitson and John Ivison, also wrote about the process related to Bill C-38. And they could not really be considered as progressives, as their analyses are relatively conservative and they are proud of it.
12:40 p.m.
NDP
Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC
I am talking about other columnists who are conservative and who have written in their columns that they are opposed to the process related to Bill C-38. I am talking about columnists like John Ibbitson and John Ivison. Are you also aware of those columns?
12:40 p.m.
Coordinator, Democracy Watch
Not recently that I can think of, but to be honest with you, omnibus legislation isn't necessarily a matter of partisanship. All individuals from all parties can come together and understand the difficulties with omnibus legislation. It really doesn't have anything to do with partisanship; it has to do with representing constituents.
12:40 p.m.
NDP
Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC
Actually, it is not about partisanship. I use the word “conservative” with a small “c”. So these are people opposed to the progressives when it comes to political affiliations.
Can you name one columnist or political commentator who has given their support to the way Bill C-38 was introduced and the fact that it is an omnibus bill that covers 70 pieces of legislation over 435 pages?
12:40 p.m.
Coordinator, Democracy Watch
No, I haven't read anything that expressly says that they support omnibus legislation at all really.
12:40 p.m.
NDP
Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC
Do you see any similarities between the current process that we are using to pass Bill C-38 and some of the processes we can see in the United States, for example, where we often hear about a “rider bill”, as they call it, being used?
12:40 p.m.
Coordinator, Democracy Watch
Yes, there are a lot of similarities with the omnibus legislation and a lot of other legislation that goes on throughout the world in many democracies, the U.S. included. As you said, it tends to encompass a large number of changes into one thing in order to have it all move through at once.
12:40 p.m.
NDP
Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC
We have heard a number of government witnesses testify and talk about the various measures on immigration, the RCMP, and so on. That might affect a number of areas. Quite often, there was nothing in the budget for it, no cost. There were sometimes costs that reached $100,000 or $200,000, which is still very little compared to the size of the budget.
Do you really think that these amendments to various pieces of legislation should be included in a budget implementation bill? If not, should they be referred to other standing committees, such as the one on public safety or citizenship and immigration?
12:40 p.m.
Coordinator, Democracy Watch
For the budget it should only pertain to government spending. Anything else should be removed and included in another piece of legislation. That should be legislatively required so that it doesn't just solve the issue here.
12:40 p.m.
NDP
Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC
Along the same lines, in your view, what might the impact be on our political system if we keep going in this direction?
12:40 p.m.
Coordinator, Democracy Watch
The difficulty, as I mentioned in my opening statement, is that Canadians can't properly understand the ramifications of these things, and neither can members of Parliament in a lot of instances. There's so much going on all at once that it's very difficult to give proper voice to and proper discussion with any stakeholder. That would be the difficulty, if it keeps moving forward. There will be unintended consequences on all sides.
12:40 p.m.
Conservative