Evidence of meeting #70 for Finance in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site.) The winning word was clauses.
A video is available from Parliament.
10:05 p.m.
NDP
Peggy Nash NDP Parkdale—High Park, ON
I believe it's directly relevant. I am talking about poverty. We're talking about the elimination of the National Council of Welfare, Mr. Chair.
10:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Rajotte
As members well know, relevance is a pretty broad theme as applied by the Speakers in the House, and I apply it the same way here in the committee.
On this point of order, Mr. Jean.
10:05 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
Mr. Chair, speaking of relevance and disturbing trends, I was just wondering if the members had a chance to look at their binder tab 51—part 4, division 51—which states that all powers, duties, and functions of the former Minister of Social Development are being added to the Department of Human Resources and Skills Development. Additionally, the National Council of Welfare continued under the Department of Social Development Act is being abolished because it's no longer necessary, because of course everything they had is now transferred to a different department, which is going to continue.
Really, that's the disturbing trend I see, Mr. Chair.
10:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Rajotte
That's a point of debate, Mr. Jean. You are next on the list, so you can make that up in your time.
10:05 p.m.
Conservative
10:05 p.m.
Conservative
10:05 p.m.
NDP
Peggy Nash NDP Parkdale—High Park, ON
Thank you for that additional information.
As I was saying, those of us who have lived in Canada for some time or people who have grown up in Canada see a marked difference in the level of inequality today that didn't exist years back. Certainly to go out on the streets of any major city in Canada and see the number of homeless people, especially young homeless people, is quite disturbing.
The National Council of Welfare is a body dedicated to providing research and information not only on poverty but on anti-poverty strategies. To fold that requirement into the general responsibilities of HRSDC is a little rich at a time when the government is cutting back. Through this budget they've announced 19,200 jobs overall added to several more thousand jobs that will be cut that had previously been announced.
Part of the problem is—I raise this for Mr. Jean's benefit—that of course the Parliamentary Budget Officer and others have raised concerns that we can't even find out where many of these cuts are taking place because we can't get access to the information.
To that point, will HRSDC have the resources to be able to take on this added function when we know there were and are dedicated staff focused on the issue of poverty, doing research, focused on strategies? I think this is a big loss to the people of Canada. And to say it's a bureaucratic duplication, I don't buy that. I think it's a huge step backwards at a time when we need this organization more than ever.
We're opposed to it.
10:10 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Rajotte
Did you want Mr. Johnson of the department handling those responsibilities to answer the question?
10:10 p.m.
NDP
Peggy Nash NDP Parkdale—High Park, ON
I could ask, maybe you could provide information the Parliamentary Budget Officer has been unable to get on the impact of budget cuts on HRSDC and how many jobs will be eliminated.
10:10 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Rajotte
The clause deals with the National Council of Welfare. I thought your question was can the department handle the research that's now being done by the National Council of Welfare?
10:10 p.m.
NDP
Peggy Nash NDP Parkdale—High Park, ON
But my point is if they are faced with layoffs and positions are being cut, I'm sure the officials will say yes, they can handle it, but we don't even know yet all the positions that are going to be eliminated.
10:10 p.m.
Conservative
10:10 p.m.
NDP
Peggy Nash NDP Parkdale—High Park, ON
No, unless he knows the numbers of people who are being cut in HRSDC. That would be my question.
10:10 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
Mr. Chair, I'd just like to quote out of the book provided to us by the department, in relation to the comments made by the opposition: “All the powers, duties and functions of the former Minister of Social Development are being added to the Department of Human Resources and Skills Development Act.” That's all duties, functions, and powers, so it continues to be dealt with.
10:10 p.m.
NDP
Peggy Nash NDP Parkdale—High Park, ON
Just to follow up on that, then I guess I could ask if HRSDC will be given additional resources and funds to take on the work of the National Council of Welfare. Are additional resources being transferred?
10:10 p.m.
Stephen Johnson Director General, Evaluation Directorate, Strategic Policy and Research Branch, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development
The Department of Human Resources and Skills Development, and in particular the branch in which I work, the Strategic Policy and Research Branch, has the capacity to undertake research and analysis in the area of poverty, including other areas. There are no plans right now to increase the resources of the branch, but this would certainly be part of the core mandate that the Strategic Policy and Research Branch sees.
10:10 p.m.
NDP
Peggy Nash NDP Parkdale—High Park, ON
Do you know if there are any cuts planned to staff at HRSDC in the policy research branch?
10:10 p.m.
Director General, Evaluation Directorate, Strategic Policy and Research Branch, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development
Yes, there are.