Finance Committee on Nov. 6th, 2017

[Neil Saravanamuttoo]

Singapore is a member, and they would in theory be able to come forward. Obviously, we have a very short track record to look at, but the emphasis has been on promoting sustainable development, as you mentioned, so the focus has been geared more towards the middle- and lower-income countries.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Will the bank fund projects like wind and solar electricity?

[Neil Saravanamuttoo]

Yes.

[Nicole Giles]

Potentially.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Is there any desire to learn from the experience in Ontario, where such public investments have, for example, increased poverty among people whose electricity costs have gone up by 100%?

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Pierre, I don't think you can expect our witnesses to answer that question.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Carleton, ON]

Okay. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Mr. Kmiec.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

At one point you mentioned human rights and the approval process. The bank supposedly does a review of these things. Is it the case that government will do a separate review as well? You seemed to be intimating that at one point, that there's a review done by the AIIB on an individual project and then the Government of Canada would do its own as well. Is that correct?

[Nicole Giles]

That's correct.

Perhaps I could take a few minutes to describe the project process, if that would be helpful for members.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

That's on the website. I'm just interested in that human rights component.

[Nicole Giles]

Yes, the project process, as it relates to Canada, is that, when a project is presented, the bank itself will do an assessment against all of the safeguards, including human rights safeguards. That project is then presented to members of the bank.

In Canada, as part of our project assessment, we would do our own review of those pieces. We would look at the documentation provided by the bank. We would look at information coming from our posts and our missions abroad. We would consult with like-minded partners, and we would provide our own assessment.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

If the Government of Canada finds a particular country project wanting in its human rights record and then decides it is opposed, what would the Government of Canada do? Within the process of AIIB, could you just vote against a project? Is that all you can do?

[Nicole Giles]

Correct. You can vote against the project. You can abstain, and then as always in international multilateral forums, we work with partners to try to influence in terms of Canadians' interest.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

We have 1% of the votes, though. How would that work?

[Neil Saravanamuttoo]

Right. It's true that we have 1% of the vote, but I think it's important to understand also that, in a context like this, there's a lot that shareholders can do before projects even come to the board for a vote. We absolutely would do our own scrutiny of each project, and if we see concerns, we would want to bring those forward to the bank and to bank management, before they even come forward for a vote, in the hope that we can address them before they reach the table.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

You raised a good point about senior management.

Are there any Canadians working in senior management at the AIIB?

[Neil Saravanamuttoo]

Anchela, do you want to take this?

[Anchela Nadarajah]

Yes. There are in certain aspects.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

I mean Canadians working for the AIIB.

[Anchela Nadarajah]

Yes, exactly. Within the bank, there are five or so.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

In senior management positions...?

[Anchela Nadarajah]

I know of one who is in senior management, in communications. There are a few who are higher up, but perhaps not in senior management.

[Tom Kmiec, Conservative, Calgary Shepard, AB]

You mentioned that the government has done a review of these 21 projects that were approved in March 2017 and earlier, before the government decided to join.

If the government had done these human rights checks.... I mean, Bangladesh is a recipient. Bangladesh has a horrible human rights record. Bloggers have been murdered for the past few years. Gay rights activists have been murdered. Pakistan continues to oppress Sindhis, Baluchs, and other minorities.

Egypt is also receiving money. Actually, 11 solar power projects are being financed. There are private companies that are co-signers on the project, so they're the ones that have been de-risked. The risk is all taken on by taxpayers of other countries. Egypt has been pursuing a crackdown on civil society.

Did the Government of Canada say that those were okay, that the human rights records are fine and to just proceed with participating in the AIIB?

[Nicole Giles]

As we weren't members of the bank, and as we're still not officially a member of the bank, we didn't have a voice in those projects. We did not provide our advice to the bank in terms of voting because we were not members. We're still not members.