Finance Committee on Oct. 15th, 2018

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Thank you.

I have a few questions. I'll see what I can get to in the time I have.

Chief Smith, you gave a very clear budget ask around language revitalization. You spoke also about the community needs in terms of housing and infrastructure. On your third point, on energy, I was struck by the way you put the need to be a “partner” in energy development. Many non-indigenous people in the south continually assert that indigenous leaders oppose energy development projects. Some indigenous leaders indeed do oppose some specific projects, but in general, partnership is something that I think most leaders would desire. Energy needs for northern residents are vital. A key to reducing poverty is having access to affordable and reliable energy.

I'd invite you to speak more on that, if you'd like.

[Chief Steve Smith]

Thank you.

First I'll start off with Aishihik Lake.

Champagne and Aishihik basically has been a forced partner in energy production for 40-odd years. We have seen a massive erosion in our environment with regard to Aishihik Lake. The Aishihik Lake hydro facility has enabled growth within the Yukon. The Faro mine, the Minto mine, any mine that was built within the grid, draws energy, especially in the winter months, from Aishihik Lake.

We've been a forced partner, and what we look at is what our elders have said. Going into the future, we want to see the lake stabilize so that we're not seeing these huge swings in the lake levels that really affect our water and the fish and animals that utilize the lake and that we utilize.

How do we do that? We do that in terms of partnerships. We look at other projects that will not have such a great environmental impact on specific areas. The Aishihik Lake is home to one of the listed groups within our name, the Champagne and Aishihik people, so we look at these partnerships as a way to stabilize what has already occurred and been built, and we look to build upon those.

What we're looking for then from the federal government is the ability to take part in these projects, whether they be biomass projects, additional hydro development projects or other energy-producing projects. We need the capacity. Certainly we're stretched, and that's the reason we've come to ask you for what I think, in federal terms, is a paltry sum of a million dollars a year to do language.

What happens if we are able to utilize the resources that are gained from any partnership moving forward to actually turn back and build upon what we have planned for our people?

Our struggle is always about having the financial and human capacity to be able to take part in these projects.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

I'm going to ask Chief Dickson to elaborate on something a little further.

When you spoke, you talked about governance funding and the challenges—if I understood your remarks correctly—around governance.

Could you expand on what some of the very specific needs are and whether you have a very specific ask in that area?

[Chief Robert Dickson]

When we're talking governance, I'm speaking from the experience of a small first nation that has 250 members. Our community, the Kluane First Nation, is the only game in town, if you want to call it that.

I have capacity issues that we have to deal with. We have an annual budget of $6.1 million to run our whole government. With regard to housing and infrastructure, we're trying to attract people. We're trying to build capacity.

Regarding the governance department, Lisa is here with me. She's our governance director. She has two staff working for her, and that's the entire governance department. These three guys plus all of us have to spend a lot of our time dealing with these issues.

All these first nations here can tell you the same story. The money we're getting is not enough to run the complete government department with all of the services we have to provide to our people. We have three people doing the job that YTG could have 500 people doing.

Other first nations, bigger first nations, have more people. Bigger first nations have the capacity. We don't.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Thank you.

I have one last question that I'm going to ask Ms. McInerney.

You said a couple of things, and I'm not sure I even understand why this would be the case. You spoke of the indigenous women needing to provide a band number to access services.

Why is that?

[Barbara McInerney]

It is billing between the territorial government and the federal government.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

So it's for billing purposes...?

[Barbara McInerney]

For billing purposes, they want band numbers, and with those band numbers, YTG bills the feds.

What I was told is that it's $380 a day per first nation woman who gives a band number, which the feds give back to YTG. The indigenous women are not seeing that money.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

It would seem to me there surely must be a better way to protect people's privacy when they are accessing your services.

[Barbara McInerney]

Yes. One of the ways is that we just shorten the band number. We give the number that identifies the band or the government and not the last four digits that identify the person.

[Pat Kelly, Conservative, Calgary Rocky Ridge, AB]

Some of these communities are so small that even identifying oneself presents a—

[Barbara McInerney]

And you don't know if the one doing the billing for YTG is the brother of the abuser.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

While we're on that subject, can you give me the process for the women's rent cheques that are late?

[Barbara McInerney]

The women are required to go into INAC. I'm guessing a date here. I can get you a formal submission with the proper dates, but I'm just guessing off the top of my 60-year-old memory, which is not good. They have to be in the office in between, I believe, the 12th and the 16th. We work with these women every single day. We see them every day, so we know when they go in. They go in at the allotted time and we get the cheque maybe the 16th of the next month, so it's more than two weeks late.

For one of the women who has been staying with us for two months, they sent the cheque to Yukon Housing. After about two weeks, we were trying to find where this cheque went. They had gotten the cheque right for two months in row, so I'm not sure what was going on. I am forwarding all of these cases.... First of all, I have to get consent from the woman, because again we're doing this on the backs of women who are fleeing violence. I have to get her permission and then I forward it to Tammy Bazylinski. I think that's her name. She is the director. We've met with INAC and it seems as though they are hearing us and want to work on it, but something is not working because it's still happening and it contributes to people not wanting to rent to indigenous people.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

If you can send us further information on that, we'd appreciate it. We don't mind talking to whoever we have to, because that's just absolutely unacceptable.

Mr. Julian.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

Thank you to all. It's very compelling testimony.

I will start in French and address the representatives of the Association franco-yukonnaise first.

In my riding of New Westminster—Burnaby, the population is very diverse. The francophone community has grown considerably as a result of immigrants from African and Asian countries, the Caribbean, and even Oceania. This weekend, I attended a meeting for new francophone Canadians in my riding, with hundreds of people from a wide range of professions and talents that are useful for Canada. That is why I think the issue of immigration is important for the entire francophone community in western Canada.

First, Mr. Nolet and Ms. Beaudoin, how important do you think it is to expand the francophone community and bring in all those talented people?

Second, what is your priority? You talked about funding in the arts, media, health care and education. I note that the Aurora Borealis—an excellent newspaper, by the way—is talking about funding for the media, which is minimal compared to what the web giants in Canada receive. So what is your top, most pressing priority for the Yukon francophone community?

[Jeanne Beaudoin]

I would say that it is to obtain access to services in French from governments. We have a number of priorities because we are active in a number of sectors, so I find it difficult to pick one.

We would like to have better funding from our organization that is our voice. The Association franco-yukonnaise is sort of like a federation, because we have chosen to bring together all the associations related to culture, youth, seniors and communications under one roof, in order to avoid the waste that would otherwise result from the duplication of administrative expenses. We think it is smarter to spend the funds in this way.

Our priority is really for both levels of government to provide services in French and listen to what we have to say. As I said earlier when I was talking about agreements between the various levels of government, we want the Official Languages Act to be enforced and those agreements to contain clauses that allow the community to provide services to francophones.

It is difficult to choose one priority in particular because we have them in all our areas for action. So I invite you to go online and see who we are and what we do, because we deliver great results.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

I would be happy to do that.

Thank you very much.

I'd like to go now to Chief Smith, Chief Dickson, Chief Joseph and Chief Sidney.

You have been very eloquent in terms of where investments need to be made by the federal government to push back and eliminate, as you mentioned Chief Dickson, the legacy of colonialism. These are investments in loan forgiveness, indigenous languages, trades training and education, health care, infrastructure and housing.

Are you really not speaking to a sea change in how we conceive the federal budgets? Rather than having relatively small amounts to deal with the legacy of colonialism that requires significant investments, we should be looking at this next budget in 2019 as a budget that is really for reconciliation and that adequately finances some of the needs that indigenous communities have right now.

I'll direct that first to Chief Smith, and then if you have comments down the....

[Chief Steve Smith]

The simple answer is yes. We have been in our FTA negotiations for a number of years. We were just notified again by our federal negotiators that they're looking to extend the FTA negotiations another year. This is several years of us just talking about the actual numbers we have in front of us now.

If the government, as you said, had a sea change in terms of its policy to adequately fund land claims and self-government groups, which the 11 first nations of the Yukon make up, I think it would answer a lot of the questions we have with regard to economic growth and with regard to the social indicator improvements within all of society. We could then become, as I said, a partner within the whole framework, putting forward what we need to put forward to the rest of the make-up of the Yukon and help us all move forward. If we float the large ship, then we should all be doing better.

However, as said before, we are constantly in a battle over getting recognition that our FTA was an actual commitment from Canada to stop or staunch the tide that we were in of this underfunded, chronically marginalized group of society and now become a true partner within the whole framework.

If we can have Canada really look at the pressing issues of each of the first nations.... If you look at some of the smaller first nations, if it's 100% for Champagne and Aishihik, it's 150% for some of the smaller first nations, the more isolated ones. Champagne and Aishihik is in a position where our traditional territory encompasses a chunk of the city of Whitehorse, so we're close to infrastructure. We're close to an urban municipality, but if you look at Kluane First Nation, as he is saying, they're a stand-alone community. There's no sister municipality butted up against it. Their challenges are even greater.

If we have this shift from the federal government to adequately fund the deals that they make.... That's what I spoke about in my opening statement. Implement the land claim. Implement the deal that was made that was signed off by Canada and all of the 11 first nations. Let us do the work. Let us educate our kids. Let us teach our kids the language. Let us deal with the really horrible social indicators that were spoken about with regard to the violence against our women. Let us deal with that.

In 1973 we produced our document “Together Today for our Children Tomorrow”. If we lived up to those ideals, we would see positive growth.

In closing, since Champagne and Aishihik signed its land claim in 1993, our median income on Champagne and Aishihik settlement land has grown at 50% of the rate of the rest, 50% more than the rest of the Yukon. Our self-government agreement is effective. Our land claim is effective in really turning the tide. That's the bottom line. Implement the land claim. Be true to that. Be true to the deal that we have. Then we can take care of our own, in effect.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Does anybody else want in?

Chief Sidney.

[Naa Sháade Háni Richard Sidney]

It's pretty interesting when we hear some of the questions we heard this morning dealing with the modern treaties, for instance, and the whole essence of this fiscal relationship we have with the Government of Canada and the Government of Yukon. The whole essence of the final agreements and the whole notion of our entering into agreements with the Government of Canada was based on what Chief Smith described: our taking full responsibility for our people. The agreements that we entered into actually created the process for how those financial resources will be transferred over to the self-governing first nations.

It's really difficult for me to come here and ask again for recognition, because we're one of the first nations that actually took the issue to court, the issue of the transfers. As Chief Smith described, the current agreement that we have in place with the Government of Canada expired in 2015. The agreement that we've managed to cobble together is essentially an extension of that old agreement, but that agreement really was insufficient.

Teslin Tlingit Council signed the agreement in 1993, and respective first nations have constantly strived to achieve own-source revenue. To that extent, we've made numerous investments elsewhere, but fundamentally once we have the resources that we require to make programs available for education, for adequate infrastructure.... Champagne and Aishihik council enacted its own language act. That's what I spoke to this morning. We understand what we require to ensure that one, two, three, four, five generations from now, we'll be in a better position than we all are right now. That's the objective.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Chief Joseph.

[Chief Roberta Joseph]

I just want to point out that one of our biggest challenges in relation to implementing our agreements for modern-day treaty first nations across Canada is that the Interpretation Act of Canada does not recognize modern-day treaties, and is blanketed to the Indian Act first nations and bands. Today we speak a much different language. Twenty, 30 or 40 years ago, we would be asking to increase our social assistance budget, but today our language speaks to what we do. We contribute greatly to the Yukon economy just by paying our property taxes and income taxes. We pay income tax as well, so that goes back into our Yukon economy.

We are working toward fundamental change for self-determination, being able to provide better services to our citizens, advocating for better education for our children in the public schools here, and the list goes on—land management, collaboration and co-operation management of renewable and non-renewable efforts in our respective traditional territories.

We contribute greatly to the Yukon economy and will continue to do that as long as we can continue to be able to implement our agreements and work toward implementing them effectively. We just want the same fair treatment as other first nations. Canada has budgeted for first nations who have negotiated or are in the negotiation process to not have to repay their loans. We feel it's fair that we have that same treatment so we can put that toward better use.

Thanks.

[The Chair, Liberal, Wayne Easter]

Thank you.

Ms. Rudd.

[Kim Rudd]

Again, thank you very much for coming. I have so many questions and so little time.

I have a quick question for you, Jennifer, on your presentation. I noticed that you had youth engagement through training teachers, and that right now it's at zero but the anticipation is 375,000 hours. Is that correct? For next year...?