Evidence of meeting #36 for Finance in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was shelters.
A video is available from Parliament.
5:35 p.m.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC
Sorry, Mr. Chair. It is extremely interesting, but the reality is that if the app doesn't work for any one of us, we're actually going to have to log on. That's the problem.
5:35 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter
That's the concern, and it is a confidence vote.
Dr. Kershaw, as Ed Fast said, the punchline is going to come, and what a great way to stop, just before we question....
5:35 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter
We'll suspend until after the vote. That should take about 20 minutes.
6:05 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter
We shall reconvene.
We'll go to Dr. Kershaw to wrap up his presentation. Then we'll go to a fairly strict series of questions, starting with Mr. Fast and then Ms. Dzerowicz. We'll cut them back to four minutes to get more people in.
Go ahead, Dr. Kershaw.
6:05 p.m.
Founder, Generation Squeeze
Thank you very much.
I was in the midst of giving an energized Zoom experience, talking about how government efforts to pick the low-hanging fruit on housing affordability had proven to have limited lasting influence to dampen down home prices or close the frightening gap between home values and what locals are earning in our cities.
That's why the lab you've asked us to come to talk about is aiming to dig deeper, to move beyond the low-hanging fruit to focus on a more disturbing root cause of the problem: the reality that many everyday Canadians, myself included, are entangled in perpetuating our unsustainable, unaffordable housing system because public policies incline us to organize our wealth strategy in ways that count on home prices rising faster than earnings.
We've organized the lab in this way because we observe that the current national housing strategy, as important as it is, suffers a major omission: Never once does this strategy mention the word “wealth”. By failing to acknowledge wealth, the strategy risks overlooking that a primary reason our country is struggling to restore housing affordability is that few Canadians think rising home prices are uniformly bad. It's quite the opposite. Many regular folks benefit.
It's the good and the bad of rising home prices, then, that are the focus of our lab, along with the competing interests or tensions they create. Our lab has aimed to service those tensions and to service in particular the policy drivers that give rise to them, because those policy drivers hold unique potential to redesign the Canadian housing system in search of win-wins wherever possible, or a better balance of competing interests when win-wins are not in reach.
I look forward to your questions.
6:05 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter
Thank you very much, Dr. Kershaw.
What we'll do is go to four minutes for Mr. Fast, Ms. Koutrakis, Mr. Ste-Marie and Mr. Julian, and to three minutes in the second round for Mr. Fast and Mr. Fragiskatos. Then, I'm sorry, we're going to be out of time.
Mr. Fast.
6:05 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter
I'm sorry. It is Ms. Dzerowicz in our stream. I looked at the wrong list.
Go ahead, Ed.
6:05 p.m.
Conservative
Ed Fast Conservative Abbotsford, BC
Thank you.
Dr. Kershaw, thank you for your presentation. I understand you've had chats with my colleague Brad Vis, who is also on this Zoom call.
Generation Squeeze—you're the founder of that organization. This lab is focused on effectively one issue, which is the tax component of intergenerational inequity relating to housing. Is that correct?
6:05 p.m.
Founder, Generation Squeeze
No, that's not accurate. As I just described, we're looking at a range of policy issues that entangle everyday households, mine included, in counting on home prices rising faster than earnings. We actually are focusing on three areas directed by our participants: monetary and lending policy, tax policy issues and something called a protective policy issue.
6:05 p.m.
Conservative
Ed Fast Conservative Abbotsford, BC
I'm looking at the executive summary of the project charter. The first paragraph says, “One key source of this intergenerational inequality is tax policy that privileges home ownership, and shelters housing wealth, especially in principal residences....” It's the only key source that is mentioned in the executive summary. That's why I'm a little bit puzzled that you would say that a whole bunch of other things are being discussed. I've read through the charter, and it seems to be focused primarily on that issue.
6:05 p.m.
Founder, Generation Squeeze
I'm so pleased that you are focused on it. These are important issues and I welcome that. If you look at the text, it's clearly talking about public finance, of which tax policy is one, and that's a very broad category.
I think what you're wanting to get from me is some sort of—pardon the phrase—“I gotcha” moment. So, let me say—
6:05 p.m.
Founder, Generation Squeeze
—I have never had any conversation with any MP, any minister or any senior bureaucrat who has ever asked me to come to consult on the design of a specific tax policy with regard to housing.
6:05 p.m.
Founder, Generation Squeeze
If I can just make sure that's on the record, then I'm delighted to chat more intellectually about—
6:05 p.m.
Conservative
Ed Fast Conservative Abbotsford, BC
This is not about “gotcha”. This is about trying to get to the bottom of the study, which is, I think, very important to Canadians. Obviously CMHC saw it as being important.
You have been quoted in the National Observer as suggesting that you want Canada's tax systems shifted to take more account of property value and other wealth. Is that correct?
6:10 p.m.
Founder, Generation Squeeze
When you're talking about my own research work, yes, I do.
6:10 p.m.
Founder, Generation Squeeze
The evidence does give good reason for us to think about trying to cut taxes for middle and lower earners, which will create efficiencies, and compensate by asking folks like me who are now the 9% of Canadians who have homes worth more than $1 million to contribute slightly more based on our housing wealth. This is part of a conversation about a tax shift.
Yes. That's my research area.
