Fisheries Committee on March 14th, 2012

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

Thank you very much.

Obviously, then, we're probably in the critical area with the stock, but still we're allowing different types of nets and vessels for midshore, for the Barry Group. Was the same type of...? What happened off the coast of British Columbia when you changed the halibut quota from 88% and 12% to 15% and 85%? Was there consultation with the commercial fishermen? Did they agree with what you did?

[Keith Ashfield, Conservative, Fredericton, NB]

Well, certainly there was consultation with all interested parties on the west coast in terms of the halibut fishery. It was a move from an 88% and 12% split to an 85% and 15% split. There was significant consultation by my parliamentary secretary over the course of the last year. We looked at all of the original processes that were put in play to determine that number and we felt that it required an adjustment. So there was consultation leading up to it to get people's feedback—absolutely.

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

All parties are happy—

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Thank you, Mr. MacAulay. Your time has expired.

We'll move to a three-minute round at this point.

Mr. Leef, you'll lead off.

[Ryan Leef, Conservative, Yukon, YT]

I get another turn: look at that.

I'll finish off with the line of questions you were going to ask.

Thank you, again, Mr. Minister.

Let's switch to the safe and secure waters portion, one of your three strategic outcomes. In the presentation we received before you got here, the final statement was “In times of restraint we strive to achieve these objectives by streamlining and increasing our efficiency in all areas”. We also heard, though, that the program services where it may be cut are still going to be designed to meet the needs of Canadians.

Now, sometimes in the House we hear the opposition doing some fearmongering on this. I won't mention names, because it might turn out to be the exact same as my name—

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Ryan Leef, Conservative, Yukon, YT]

They talk about government putting lives in danger by moving the resources for the marine rescue sub-centres. Can you maybe talk about how the reallocation of resources in the marine rescue sub-centres is going to serve Canadians' needs and how it's going to meet the objectives of finding the efficiencies that we need to find?

[Keith Ashfield, Conservative, Fredericton, NB]

Yes. We did considerable analysis of our overall network. We felt that we could consolidate our sub-centres into working more closely with search and rescue. At the same time as saving money, we felt that we could also provide an enhancer, actually, because people would be working side by side, together.

With today's technology, there is absolutely no reason this would impact at all, in any way, shape, or form. And certainly I would never have made that decision if I thought if we were going to be putting mariners at risk. I think it's fully feasible and doable.

[Ryan Leef, Conservative, Yukon, YT]

And there certainly are other operations that exist outside of your department where call centres and dispatch services are provided in other fields.

I think Mr. Sopuck alluded to a point. It's not quite related, but if we're able to centralize and focus our attention with efficiencies, that's going to translate into some savings for us and allow the department to put their resources—both financial and human—into the areas that are I guess of greatest importance. Maybe you could give us a quick comment on that point.

[Keith Ashfield, Conservative, Fredericton, NB]

Certainly.

You made the same mistake I did when I first addressed this question and used the words “call centre”. It's not a call centre, by the way. I apologize for that. They are sub-centres, and provide a great service.

In terms of the consolidation with the joint rescue centres, again, I believe it is a positive step. We can not only gain efficiencies, but I think we can gain a better, safer service because of the fact that we have people working jointly together side by side. The consolidation process is under way. We believe it will be a better service once they are up and fully going. We're going to have language capabilities for ensuring that we have both French and English centres that will provide the necessary languages to provide a safe service for mariners. We believe overall that this process is a good one. We stand by it.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Thank you very much, Mr. Leef.

Mr. Cleary.

[Ryan Cleary, NDP, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Minister, the biggest concern on the east coast of Canada, and off Newfoundland and Labrador specifically right now, is the idea that the Conservative government would remove the fleet separation or owner-operator policy. I understand from your answer to Mr. Donnelly that it is hypothetical and a final decision hasn't been made. But it's still a major concern. It's out there.

The big concern that's been expressed is that if you remove those policies and we move towards an individual, transferrable quota system, as has been in place in British Columbia now for years, the small-boat fishermen are pushed out of the industry. The individual transferrable quotas are accumulated by fishermen and processors, and the small-boat fisherman, as I say, is pushed out.

Let me ask you the question Mr. Donnelly asked another way. Do you have any problem with the ITQ system that currently exists in British Columbia?

[Keith Ashfield, Conservative, Fredericton, NB]

Let's go back a bit to the previous part of your question when you talked about the consultation process, or me trying to get information back from fishers.

I didn't think it was the right thing to do to limit debate. I wanted to open debate on fisheries in general. If I went into this process and said you can talk about this, but you can't talk about this, this, and this, that's not fulsome, wholesome debate. I wanted to hear back from everybody and to get their views. I'm hearing all types of views, and that's fair.

I was at the International Boston Seafood Show over this past weekend, and believe me, I heard lots of views. Some were fairly positive views, but mostly people, even people who are inshore fishers, admitted to me during that process that they felt there had to be some modernization of the fishery. I don't think anybody would argue with that. I don't think anyone would argue that there has to be change made. But what the change is, that's what I'm trying to gather information to understand.

In terms of the west coast, my understanding is—and Mr. Donnelly may be able to provide different information, I don't know—that the ITQ system on the west coast, after getting over the initial problems at the start, has worked fairly well. They seem to be functioning quite well there.

[Ryan Cleary, NDP, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

One of the main problems that I see from my research is that what fishermen say is that more than 70% of individual transferrable quota leases are leased out to fishermen. By the time the fishermen pay their resource rent, there is very little left over in terms of a profit for the fishermen or for their crew. You haven't heard those similar concerns?

[Keith Ashfield, Conservative, Fredericton, NB]

From the west coast I have not, and I have been out there a few times.

[Ryan Cleary, NDP, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

I have one more quick question.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Very quickly, Mr. Cleary.

[Ryan Cleary, NDP, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

Did I hear you, Mr. Minister, in your opening statement say that the biggest problem right now with the fishery is the price of products? I didn't hear that right?

[Keith Ashfield, Conservative, Fredericton, NB]

I was referring specifically to the lobster industry.

[Ryan Cleary, NDP, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

Okay, not to the fishery in general?

[Keith Ashfield, Conservative, Fredericton, NB]

No.

[Ryan Cleary, NDP, St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL]

For your information, the biggest problem on the east coast is a lack of fish.

[Keith Ashfield, Conservative, Fredericton, NB]

Exactly. Seals could be part of that reason too.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Allen.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Minister and staff, welcome.

I have just a few questions, and the first one is about aquaculture. It's a two-part question. The first is just a little bit of a transition now from the B.C. situation. How's that going at this point in time?

We're hearing a lot of testimony as we're doing our study, and I'm looking forward to actually getting the study done, but when we actually produce that.... We're hearing a lot of testimony with respect to a transition and what closed containment would look like. People have projected that it could be 10 to 20 years before you could ever move onshore and that type of thing.

What are the department's plans with respect to investment in future research with respect to aquaculture and closed containment, and aquaculture on land—over and above some of the investments that are put in facilities out in B.C., for example?