Fisheries Committee on June 16th, 2020

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Mr. Boudreau.

We'll now go to Chief Paul for six minutes or less, please, with an opening statement.

[Chief Terrance Paul, Chief Executive Officer, Membertou Development Corporation]

Thank you, Mr. Chair and members of Parliament on the fisheries panel and, of course, staff.

Kwe. Good afternoon. Thank you for inviting me to speak with you today regarding COVID-19's impact on our community.

Today I am with you from my community of Membertou, where I've been the elected chief for 36 years. I also serve as the lead for fisheries with the Assembly of Nova Scotia Mi'kmaw Chiefs.

In my time leading our community of Membertou, we have been through a great deal of struggle surrounding our rights, but I have also had the opportunity to be part of new opportunities within the fishery. One that I am particularly proud of is how our Membertou fishery has been built and has grown under our community's leadership.

With the sudden threat of COVID-19 forcing closures in many of our operations in Membertou in March, we took action to create emergency operation plans and an emergency COVID-19 budget.

For the Membertou Development Corporation, of which I am the CEO, our revenue last year was $67 million. Our fishery operation accounts for $3 million of that total number. Due to our loss of business we initially projected $13 million to $14 million in lost revenue in our total COVID-19 emergency budget.

Due to low prices and reduced catches imposed by our buyers as well as buyers placing daily limits on our lobster, we anticipate that $900,000 to $1 million of our overall loss will be within our fishery. Shrimp prices, as has been mentioned before, are very low, and we are anticipating a 60% loss of that revenue due to lack of markets.

We were incredibly pleased to see our fishers move forward with the fishery this season, given the magnitude of what has taken place over the last three months in our country and around the world.

When we put our boats in the water this season, we already knew we would come up short, but we knew that for the sustainability of our community and our fishers we needed to go fishing. Our season is still in process and our quotas are being caught; however, we're losing one-third of our annual profit due to the low prices this season and the late season start, as was mentioned before.

Here in Cape Breton, Onamagi, crab is selling for $3.50 a pound when last year it was valued at between $5.75 and six dollars. Our lobsters are selling for $4.35 a pound instead of their usual six dollars and up. These numbers have fluctuated and continue to do so.

Aside from the financial impacts of COVID-19, there have been many social implications as well. Our communities have been deemed higher risk for the virus and, therefore, we've taken great steps to protect our people, especially our elders. Many of our fishers had to make difficult decisions on whether they would go out on the water this season and risk bringing home the virus. If they didn't go, they risked not making a living for their families.

We stepped up to do our very best to protect our fishers and supplied them with PPE like sanitizers, forehead thermometers, gloves and other safety equipment. This was at a cost of more than $5,000 to begin the season.

Our fishery department employs 50 people. We have four crab crews made up of six crew members each and six lobster crews of four fishers each. These are well-paying jobs for our community, and the majority of our fishers are grateful for the opportunity to be working during this pandemic.

Throughout the course of the pandemic we've been in touch with our political representatives on all levels to come to the table with us and understand the significant financial loss that we will be facing this season, nearly $1 million in fisheries loss alone.

Our community of Membertou and the other Mi'kmaq communities across Nova Scotia need support from our government to help alleviate the overall loss to our communities. Revenue generated within our communities supports other aspects of the community, including education, social aspects and health.

I understand that in being here with you today you're looking to compile this information, and I hope that very soon we can come back together to talk about opportunities to support our fishery at the time of our great loss.

Wela'lioq. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Chief Paul.

We'll now go to our rounds of questioning.

We'll go to the Conservative Party, with Mr. Bragdon, please, for six minutes or less.

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to our special guests. We appreciate your taking the time to come before committee to express some very valid concerns that are affecting the industry during this time.

I have a few questions as it relates to export market solutions and if you have been consulted as to how we're looking to break into these new markets, perhaps, as people and nations begin to emerge out of the COVID pandemic. Have you been consulted on some of that as well as domestic opportunities?

To start with, since late February it has been clear that COVID-19 is eliminating a lot of our export markets for Canadian fish and seafood. While other nations, like Australia and the U.K., have taken decisive and timely action to reconnect their fish and seafood sectors with high-value overseas markets, in Canada we are still waiting for government action. Are you aware of any government initiatives that are currently reconnecting our fish and seafood to overseas markets?

I will start with Ms. Sonnenberg.

[Melanie Sonnenberg]

Thanks for the question.

Clearly, the marketing issue is one. As the federation started into COVID, we did a short-, medium- and long-term view of what we thought, if our crystal ball was in its best form, we would need to address.

One of the things we did talk about is marketing. It's not as much our bailiwick, to be very frank, but we put it on the agenda each and every time.

As we go forward, we hope to spend more time on it, to be very honest. Right now, we've spent more time on the relief package and other financial aid, the things that have been put up, but certainly it's something that we're going to need to spend a fair bit of time on to try to sort out where we're headed with this, and how we're going to deal with the diversity in the industry and the different markets that have been so negatively impacted, as we are now into this for a few months.

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Thank you.

I'm not sure if any of the other panellists would like to speak to that as well in regard to whether they have been consulted or made aware of any outreach as it relates to expanding or reconnecting with export markets.

[Duane Boudreau]

We haven't been connected with information on that. Typically, as harvesters, we're kept at arm's length when it comes to the marketing aspect. P.E.I. is a little more involved at the direct marketing level with the fishers, but in Nova Scotia, not so much.

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Thank you.

As it relates to the domestic market solutions, for months now we have been advocating that the Government of Canada take some leadership to promote the demand for Canadian fish and seafood here at home in our domestic market. There are also opportunities to connect our fish and seafood with Canadians in institutions, like local markets and food banks that need it, etc.

Are you aware of any government initiative that is currently promoting Canadian fish and seafood in our domestic markets?

[Melanie Sonnenberg]

I am, Mr. Bragdon.

The Lobster Council of Canada is one example. It has been working on a program that's domestically centred. They've done a couple of different things through social media and they're starting to ramp up their efforts. That's one thing. Certainly, there are a lot of things locally that I've seen people do in some of the smaller organizations to try to highlight the good-quality seafood that we have available to us.

I think these things are starting to evolve as we get further into this discussion, but there are initiatives going on. It's just taking some time to get some legs, to find out where we're going with it and how much seafood we can convince our people in Canada domestically to eat when we've had a very complex marketing system abroad. We need to change the dial a bit and perhaps make it more diverse in terms of a blend between international and domestic markets.

I foresee more activity in that regard, but certainly there are things going on now on the ground.

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Thank you.

I'm wondering, as it relates to the domestic market and expanding there, do you feel there needs to be a more robust response as it relates to that, and that the government could be doing more to expand that? If so, are there any suggestions you folks may have?

[Melanie Sonnenberg]

Certainly, the federation has brought this up time and time again, and we will continue to do that. As I said in the beginning days, it's been about eight packages. We will be looking to government for more focused reactions to this and more help. Going forward, you'll hear more from us on that, but at the present time, no, we have not had much discussion on how we can market our seafood domestically and what that might look like going forward.

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Thank you.

This question is—

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Mr. Bragdon.

We'll now go to Mr. Battiste for six minutes or less, please.

[Jaime Battiste, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

Thank you, Chief Paul, for joining us.

I know you're quite busy, and I can state with confidence that Membertou is one of the fastest-growing areas of economic growth in Cape Breton. I thank you for your leadership in creating a better Cape Breton.

You've shared with us that COVID has had major impacts in all areas of Canada, and I thank you for giving us a sense of the challenges that Mi’kmaq communities are facing. With the estimated loss in own-source revenue from Mi’kmaq communities, do you know whether the communal fisheries are eligible for the programs that the government has announced, like the wage subsidy, or some of the benefits for fish harvesters that we've announced?

[Chief Terrance Paul]

Thank you for that.

No, we were not eligible. That's one of the problems. They have funds for harvesters, but we're not classified as harvesters. We're indigenous communal fishers. We've asked, but we haven't received a response to a number of questions we had for them. One of them was that. If we're not eligible for the programs that have been announced already, could there be something done for the indigenous fishers?

[Jaime Battiste, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

Can you elaborate on some of the barriers that the Mi’kmaq fishermen are facing during the COVID era? Can you give us any examples of some of the challenges that many Mi’kmaq bands and Mi’kmaq people who are trying to get into the fisheries are dealing with due to the recent difficulties and challenges with COVID and beyond?

[Chief Terrance Paul]

Yes. Like many other fishers, we're operating at a great loss to our operation here.

Other MPs may already know, and certainly you do, that we have a treaty right to the fishery, which was decided back in 1999. We're still not exercising that.

I'll give you an example. It's been in the news, so I think it went across the country that when we tried to fish for food, which we have a right to do, our boat was burned. This is some of the stuff that we're facing. We've been talking to the government through DFO for many years, and we're still not able to come up with an agreement yet. It's a very slow process. Governments change, so I feel that all of government needs to take this seriously. There's a Supreme Court decision on our fisheries, and we need DFO's help to implement that fishery.

[Jaime Battiste, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

I'd like to go over to the federation now.

I'd like to get a sense of what the difference is in terms of domestic versus exported. What is the actual percentage of our catch remaining in Canada versus going to other places across international markets? Do you have a percentage breakdown of what that would be?

[Melanie Sonnenberg]

I don't have those numbers at my fingertips, but I can certainly see that the committee gets them.

I think what's important to remember is that we have about 35 million people in Canada, and the domestic markets go to millions and millions. When you look at places like the United States or some of the Asian markets, we're talking about considerable numbers of people. It looks quite different from our own domestic market. That's why I say that a blend of international and domestic markets is really what we need to strive for. We need to find that balance.

I can certainly get you some information, and I'll see that the clerk gets it.

[Jaime Battiste, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

Okay.

This is a question for all the panellists.

Would increased storage and increased capacity.... I know that for lobster and snow crab this is something that's a challenge. Would our government's increasing capacity and increasing the storage ability be something of great assistance during this COVID era?

[Duane Boudreau]

Absolutely. Long-term storage of lobster specifically is something that's greatly needed in this area, especially in northeastern Nova Scotia.

The lobster that we catch early in the spring holds very well in long-term storage, for as much as six to eight months. We have one of the lowest numbers of storage facilities in the Maritimes.

[Jaime Battiste, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

Thank you.

Mr. Chair, I think that's all for me. Those were some very good questions and answers.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, sir.

We'll now go to Madam Gill for six minutes or less, please.

[Marilène Gill, Bloc, Manicouagan, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

First, I would like to thank all the witnesses here today on Zoom. I must admit that I wish everyone could be here. One of the witnesses could not make it because of the format our committee is using. I hope we can accommodate all of the witnesses on subsequent occasions, because it is a matter of democracy.

Having said that, I would like to speak generally about COVID-19. I am sure you will agree that the fishing industry is truly a sector with some unique characteristics. Certain vulnerabilities have, of course, been brought to light by the crisis.

I would like the witnesses to tell me which aspects of the industry are most fragile right now. I would also like them to tell me what we could have done to prevent a crisis like this one. Unfortunately, we have no protection in the event of a future crisis, which could, for example, happen next year.

What should be done right now to make the industry more solid? The question is for all witnesses.

[Melanie Sonnenberg]

I can highlight a couple of things, Madam Gill.

One thing that is really critical right now is the need to get money into the hands of harvesters. You've heard several times this afternoon that this has not been as rapid as we would like to see it.

The need for people to be able to access money so that they can continue their operations is critical. I can't highlight that enough. This is a gap that I mentioned in my presentation to you, and I will continue to. That's been the shortfall, I think. Looking back we'll have much more clarity on what would be better and how we've addressed problems.

The other gap that's very concerning is with regard to people who are new to the industry and who have invested heavily in the industry to get started. There is a real concern that they're going to fall through the cracks due to their inability to access financial assistance due to the lack of history that they have when they're reaching out to get additional credit. That liquidity they require may not be there. That's something we've highlighted.

Those are a couple of really important points that we don't want to leave behind. We have to keep them in the forefront.