Evidence of meeting #111 for Government Operations and Estimates in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was company.
A recording is available from Parliament.
11:50 a.m.
Conservative
11:50 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer and General Counsel, Gitpo Storms Corporation, As an Individual
To be really high-level, yes.
11:50 a.m.
Conservative
Kelly McCauley Conservative Edmonton West, AB
We're starting almost from scratch with some of these.
Mr. Willy, did you have something? It looked like you were nodding.
11:50 a.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Des Nedhe Development
Yes. I built the procurement for Rio Tinto and for Cameco. The mining industry and the oil industry have been doing this for years. They go through a phase. They go through “We have to do this because it's legally mandated and we have targets to hit”. Then they realize that this is good corporate responsibility and they start selling it off when they realize that it adds value to their business. They realize they're getting top-quality local construction companies and service companies that are working on their traditional lands, so their retention is much higher, but then they're able to sell this story when they want access to other opportunities around the world. Both Rio Tinto and Cameco, and the oil companies, use these progressive indigenous policies to open up land access around the world. Now it's become value added.
It all starts with giving them a mandate and forcing them to do it.
11:50 a.m.
Conservative
Kelly McCauley Conservative Edmonton West, AB
Thanks very much.
At one of our earlier committee meetings where we started out with people from the government procurement side, the bureaucrats, they were patting themselves on the back, saying “It's all great.” Then the next set of witnesses said the opposite, and you're saying the opposite as well.
Do we have a disconnect? We obviously have to do better. Is there a disconnect where the government thinks...? I don't mean the Liberal government or the Conservative government, but does the bureaucracy think they're doing a good job when we really aren't doing a proper job with PSAB or larger contracts?
It's disconcerting to hear that people are using their interpretation of PSAB not to.... There are always mistakes, but you sound as though it's almost willful misinterpretation.
11:55 a.m.
Conservative
11:55 a.m.
President and Member of Red Sky Metis Independent Nation, K-Sports Marine Inc.
I mentioned in my notes about going to the government meetings. They have procurement meetings to tell aboriginal businesses it's there for them to use. They have a question period at the end, so I stand up and ask questions. I come to a specific set-aside example, and they all look at each other. Then they walk off and discuss it, and then they come back to the mike.
They know about it. It's not that they don't know. They know they have to use it, but they make every excuse not to.
11:55 a.m.
Conservative
Kelly McCauley Conservative Edmonton West, AB
Okay. It sounds as though we have work to do.
We talked about outreach to aboriginal businesses. Tomorrow I'm going back to Edmonton. We're doing an outreach seminar for small businesses and how to procure government contracts. What's the best way to do outreach to the aboriginal businesses, to say this is available and we want to do a seminar, or here's the website? It's not enough to say here's the website, so sign up. What's the best way?
11:55 a.m.
Conservative
11:55 a.m.
Conservative
Kelly McCauley Conservative Edmonton West, AB
Sorry. If someone thinks they can answer that best....
11:55 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer and General Counsel, Gitpo Storms Corporation, As an Individual
Really quickly, I'll note that Imperial, at the Strathcona refinery, is going to start doing a lot of work on the indigenous file. After the Kearl project, they decided it was a good model, so now they're going to use that refinery to get a lot of work going for the surrounding indigenous community.
They're bringing their policies from there, but what they're using is their aboriginal liaison people, who are creating the relationships. You have to create the relationships at the community level, and actually have people go in. They can't be here in Ottawa looking at a cubicle or looking at a PowerPoint presentation. They have to get out there. That's my recommendation.
11:55 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer and General Counsel, Gitpo Storms Corporation, As an Individual
Thank you.
11:55 a.m.
Conservative
11:55 a.m.
NDP
Erin Weir NDP Regina—Lewvan, SK
Mr. Willy, you mentioned your work in the uranium sector, and I'm wondering if you could speak a little about the downturn in the uranium industry and the consequences for your business, as well as for communities in Saskatchewan.
11:55 a.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Des Nedhe Development
The uranium market has been dampened since the Fukushima earthquake. Back then it was 88% of our company's resources, but because of the proactiveness of our elders and our community leaders, we started diversifying. We still probably rely 45% on the uranium industry, and they've been very proactive in talking to us about how we keep things going forward. It's not as big a worry as it once were.
I do worry about the layoffs from the community perspective, but we're going to support the uranium industry. If it weren't for them, Mr. Weir, we wouldn't be alive, so we support them through this downturn. We know it's a tough call with their shutting down two operations, but our goal now is to look at new opportunities.
11:55 a.m.
NDP
Erin Weir NDP Regina—Lewvan, SK
You mentioned the layoffs. Would you have any observations about the employment insurance system and whether it's providing adequate benefits to people who are laid off?
11:55 a.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Des Nedhe Development
Cameco has really stepped up on this one. All the employees over the 10-month period are getting 75% of their pay. We have 30 community members coming home who were really worried, but now we know they're getting 75% of their pay with the employment insurance plus the Cameco top-up. That makes our chief and council very happy.
11:55 a.m.
NDP
Erin Weir NDP Regina—Lewvan, SK
There's no worry about people qualifying for the employment insurance part of that?
11:55 a.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Des Nedhe Development
Not from what I've heard from our community.
11:55 a.m.
NDP
Erin Weir NDP Regina—Lewvan, SK
That's good to hear.
A distinction that we heard from federal government officials that we've also heard a lot about today was between PSAB procurement and procurement directed to first nations based on modern treaties. I'm wondering if any of our witnesses today would like to speak to that second type of aboriginal procurement and whether you've had experience with it.
11:55 a.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Des Nedhe Development
I was with the Tlicho first nation this week, and we had this discussion. We were in Ottawa together. The Tlicho first nation has a self-government land claim, and we've been working with them on a number of projects, including the white paper, and they told us they have seen nothing. They recently started to negotiate an all-weather road, but that's the only procurement they see. Outside their operational mandate, they'll get operational payments based on their land claim, but they've advised us they don't get direct procurement opportunities.
11:55 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer and General Counsel, Gitpo Storms Corporation, As an Individual
I come from a peace and friendship treaty from the 1700s on the east coast. A positive procurement was the cleanup of the Sydney tar ponds from the steel plant; back in those days it was dramatic. It wasn't directly for aboriginals or even our surrounding communities, but nudge, nudge, wink, wink was going on, and it really moved along. The fellow who heads up that procurement now is in charge of the Darlington refurbishment that's going on in Ontario, a federal procurement guy named Ken.... I can't remember his last name, but I'm sure someone could find him and ask him questions about that. It was great.
I want to go back to a question you asked about the layoffs.
