Government Operations Committee on April 14th, 2026

[Sharon DeSousa]

Twenty seconds...? Oh, boy.

The short answer is, first of all, that old age security is funded through the Canada Revenue Agency, and if you cut the people at the Canada Revenue Agency who bring the money into the government, that means there's less funding.

The people who actually work at ESDC.... Currently, there are 1,793 notices plus 800 terms that were not renewed. That means slower benefits. I can also tell you, having been a Canada pension plan benefit officer—that was my actual work—without a doubt that when you introduce new technologies there are problems. That's one of the issues that you have. There's no guarantee, as the people who received the old age security found out—85,000 of them. There's no guaranteed employment. It's based on the funding to the department, and the department decides.

[Iqra Khalid, Liberal, Mississauga—Erin Mills, ON]

Thank you for that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thanks.

Mr. Boulerice, welcome back, sir. The floor is yours for five minutes.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to the representatives who are with us today. They bring perspectives that are really important, not only for their members, but also for Canadians.

We're in a bit of an unusual situation. We have a Liberal government that, seriously, refuses to take on the web giants that are not paying their share and refuses to take on the billionaires and the super-rich who are not paying their share. This government is spending really recklessly on the military. It's an all-you-can-eat buffet, and meanwhile, 40,000 public service jobs are going to disappear along with services provided to Quebeckers and Canadians. We have a Liberal government that wants us to believe that abolishing 40,000 public service jobs has no impact on the services provided to the public.

Ms. DeSousa, I'd like you to give us a few examples of what people can expect as a result of the significant 15% budget cuts made virtually everywhere.

[Sharon DeSousa]

What you're going to experience...and we've seen this before. This is our history. We know, without a doubt, that when you have those kinds of cuts it means slower wait times. You will not get the services you need and there will be people falling through the cracks: veterans, seniors, those who are the most vulnerable, those who are looking for employment insurance or passports. There is going to be a halting of service that will take months and months to get back on track, which means that the government will have to spend more money or contract that work out. We know that every time they contract the work out, it, in fact, costs the government more money because they then have to hire federal public sector workers or use existing workers to clean up the mess.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

What I understand is that even the prospects or hopes for saving public money will inevitably be mostly cancelled out by the need to pay consultants or subcontractors.

I am the member for Rosemont—Lafontaine‑Patrie, a riding that receives a lot of immigration applications. Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada, or IRCC, is racking up completely unreasonable delays. That leaves entire families in limbo. It causes a lot of angst. The department is not getting back to them.

What do you think abolishing hundreds, if not thousands, of jobs will mean in the lives of people who are waiting for updates on their cases?

[Sharon DeSousa]

Right now I can tell you that the wait time is going to get larger. There's nothing we can do. The cuts to IRCC have been unbelievable, and the wait times have now increased. There are 1,231 notifications, and they're increasing. Here we are. We know the wait times are there, and there's not much we're going to do.

If you look at the training it takes to actually get someone fully trained, we're talking about a year or two. The question is, can those in Canada wait a year or two?

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

It's easy to say that public service positions will be eliminated. It looks good in the media. Since no one really knows what these people do, it always feels like there will be no consequences. I want very specific information.

Representatives of the Professional Institute of the Public Service of Canada, or PIPSC, came to talk to us about this a few weeks ago.

I don't want to scare people, but what effects can job cuts at the Canadian Food Inspection Agency have on public health and safety?

[Sharon DeSousa]

After the last round of cuts under Harper, we have not seen an increase to the number of inspectors. This agency is flailing right now. There are not enough people to do the work. If we cut 20% off the top, I can tell you it puts Canada's food security at risk. The government does not work in isolation via department. It works as a whole. It works as a safety net to hold Canadians safe. One little piece is going to impact other pieces.

PSAC has over 8,000 members at Correctional Service Canada. What you don't know is that there are teachers as well as some who are community employment coordinators, who find jobs for these inmates. What happens? People get incarcerated. They look to get their education. Many of them are illiterate. If you cut the educators, what chance do they have in terms of finding employment outside? If you cut those who actually get them employment, guess what: Without a good job, it's a proven fact that they are incarcerated again.

We're talking about the safety of the officers, but we're also talking about how these cuts are going to impact the actual cycle. You are going to be continuously spending, and that makes no sense.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Before you all go, thank you for being with us.

Mr. MacKinnon, I want to ask you a question.

The Edmonton Institution for Women used to be in my riding. There's been a slight border change and now it's right on the border of my riding. If you've ever been there, it's medium, minimum and maximum security all in one. The fences are basically chain-link, backing onto parking lots and car dealerships, so we have an issue where criminals just walk over and push the drugs through the fence or throw them over. There's also the issue of drones.

What was the justification for reducing the foot patrols outside or the canine sniffer units? I'm trying to wrap my head around it. I realize there have to be some changes, and there is only a finite amount of resources, but what was the justification for that? I'm thinking, selfishly, about the institution that's in Edmonton.

[Frédérick Lebeau]

You're right. You're talking about the Edmonton Institution for Women. It's a neighbourhood. It's near a dealership. We had so many incidents at that place. People were going there and trying to introduce contraband.

Reducing the dog handler portion and reducing the mobile patrols will put the institution more at risk. When you have an institution surrounded by a community, it creates a huge challenge for correctional officers. You're creating more criminality around them.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thank you again for being with us.

Colleagues, this Thursday we run into witness issues with cancellations. Our good clerk has slotted in the procurement ombudsman. I figure we can go over his most recent report on indigenous procurement .

On the 30th, as part of the main estimates, we've invited the PCO and Transportation Safety Board.

On May 5, one hour will be with the President of the Treasury Board and the second hour will be with Minister Lightbound. Because they're both appearing in that time, the next meeting after that we'll have the second hour for the officials of each department.

The 28th will be the date of the economic update. I would ask that you all canvass your parties as to whether we will be meeting on that date. Get back to me and, unless it's unanimous, we'll slot in a meeting. If it's unanimous to pass it, then we won't meet that day because of the economic update.

[Iqra Khalid, Liberal, Mississauga—Erin Mills, ON]

My understanding is that TBS is the second hour and PSPC is the first hour.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

I'm just going by what I'm reading as the first name there, but yes. They're both appearing at the same time, so we won't have time with the officials. That would be the next meeting.

Everyone, thank you very much. I appreciate your patience.

Witnesses, again, thank you very much for being with us today. It was a very good, informative meeting.

We are adjourned.