Evidence of meeting #68 for Health in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was edibles.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Ryan Vandrey  Associate Professor, Johns Hopkins University, As an Individual
Daniel Vigil  Manager, Marijuana Health Monitoring and Research, Colorado Department of Public Health and Environment
Dana Larsen  Director, Sensible BC
Hilary Black  Founder, BC Compassion Club Society
Marcel Vandebeek  Administrator, BC Compassion Club Society
Jonathan Zaid  Executive Director, Canadians for Fair Access to Medical Marijuana
Daphnée Elisma  Quebec Representative, Canadians for Fair Access to Medical Marijuana
Jacqueline Bogden  Assistant Deputy Minister, Cannabis Legalization and Regulation Branch, Department of Health
David Pellmann  Executive Director, Office of Medical Cannabis, Department of Health
Lisa Holmes  President, Alberta Urban Municipalities Association
Marc Emery  Cannabis Culture
Jodie Emery  Cannabis Culture
Bill Karsten  Second Vice-President, Federation of Canadian Municipalities
Brock Carlton  Chief Executive Officer, Federation of Canadian Municipalities

10 a.m.

Director, Sensible BC

Dana Larsen

It's sort of halfway between those things. We strive for a professional product, but it's very difficult to access mainstream bakeries or places to make products if you're going to be making cannabis products. As a result, we are forced into this kind of area where they're made at home or on a small scale. We use childproof packaging. We do our best to label our products with an accurate level of the cannabinoids that are in there, although that's a challenge, simply because of the testing available and because dispensaries can't fully access that kind of testing.

10 a.m.

Liberal

Ron McKinnon Liberal Coquitlam—Port Coquitlam, BC

What do you think of—

10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Bill Casey

Your time is up.

Dr. Carrie.

10 a.m.

Conservative

Colin Carrie Conservative Oshawa, ON

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'll be sharing my time with my colleague.

Again, Mr. Larsen, I'd like to direct this question to you, and again, thanks for being here. Obviously you're very knowledgeable, and I would think that your input and your knowledge about how things are today in Canada on the ground are very important.

I'm curious. As far as you or anybody involved in the production/distribution field goes, was anyone you know consulted in reference to the rollout of this as a public policy or the drafting of this bill? Was any consultation done by the government with anybody you know?

10 a.m.

Director, Sensible BC

Dana Larsen

No. Do you mean the task force that was initially put together and that kind of thing? Some people were. I wasn't invited to speak to that task force. Some of my allies or friends were, but I found that just regular cannabis users aren't really in part of this discussion so much. I use cannabis every day. I used cannabis this morning before I came here, and I'm going to use some afterwards when we're done. I think that voice of the typical users is perhaps missing.

No, I haven't seen a lot of consultation among the cannabis community in that way.

10 a.m.

Conservative

Marilyn Gladu Conservative Sarnia—Lambton, ON

I'd like to move:

That, pursuant to standing order 108(2), a minimum of 6 meetings be added to the committee's current study of Bill C-45, (An Act respecting cannabis and to amend the Controlled Drugs and Substances Act, the Criminal Code and other Acts), and that these meetings be scheduled following the appearance of the Minister of Health, Justice and Public Safety on the week of September 18th.

10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Bill Casey

Dr. Eyolfson.

10 a.m.

Liberal

Doug Eyolfson Liberal Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB

I move that the debate be now adjourned.

10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Bill Casey

We now have a vote on that issue.

We're going to have a vote on Dr. Eyolfson's motion.

10 a.m.

Conservative

Colin Carrie Conservative Oshawa, ON

I'd like a recorded vote, please.

10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Bill Casey

All those in favour of the motion to adjourn debate?

(Motion agreed to: yeas 5; nays 4)

10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Bill Casey

The motion has succeeded, so we've adjourned the debate on that issue. We'll go back to the regular one.

You have a minute and a half to go.

10 a.m.

Conservative

Marilyn Gladu Conservative Sarnia—Lambton, ON

All right.

Mr. Vigil, will childproof packaging keep 12- to 17-year-olds from being able to open those packages?

10 a.m.

Manager, Marijuana Health Monitoring and Research, Colorado Department of Public Health and Environment

Dr. Daniel Vigil

Absolutely not. No.

10 a.m.

Conservative

Marilyn Gladu Conservative Sarnia—Lambton, ON

So it's absolutely no protection at all.

What kind of recommendations would you have? We're trying with this bill to keep cannabis out of the hands of young children. The concern is that when people bring edibles into the house, they are attractive. They're candies or cookies or suckers, all the things that kids would want to have.

In light of the overdose situations we saw in Colorado, should people be locking them up?

10 a.m.

Manager, Marijuana Health Monitoring and Research, Colorado Department of Public Health and Environment

Dr. Daniel Vigil

Yes, I think they should. As far as regulation is concerned, we don't regulate to that degree for products that people bring home. There is regulation that for home-grows they have to be locked in a locked area if anyone under 21 is in the home. Really, within that age range it becomes much more important to have education for parents and others who care for children, or who have children around, that if they're using these products, they should keep them locked up. Then, of course, there's the education for children about the possible dangers of using them.

10:05 a.m.

Conservative

Marilyn Gladu Conservative Sarnia—Lambton, ON

Very good.

How much time do I have?

10:05 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Bill Casey

You have 28 seconds.

10:05 a.m.

Conservative

Marilyn Gladu Conservative Sarnia—Lambton, ON

I'll just end with a comment then.

Mr. Larsen, with all due respect, I find your lack of respect for the rule of law in this country disturbing. It's clear that it doesn't matter what we come up with in Bill C-45. You're going to do whatever you like and obey whichever laws you like, and I don't personally approve of that.

Thank you.

10:05 a.m.

Director, Sensible BC

Dana Larsen

I believe in the Charter of Rights.

10:05 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Bill Casey

Now we go to Mr. Davies.

10:05 a.m.

NDP

Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC

Thank you.

Mr. Larsen, I want to thank you for being here. You're the only dispensary owner we heard from, out of all the witnesses we heard this week—the only person involved in the actual edible market and familiar with the products on a day-to-day commercial basis. I think it's very valuable to have your perspective here.

First, Mr. Larsen, if we don't legalize edibles, there will be no way to test the THC levels, the CBD levels, and all the other different compounds. Products will still be consumed by Canadians, it appears to me, who will have no real assurance of the content, since, as you said, you can't send these products to accredited Health Canada labs to make sure that these products are what they say they are.

Am I missing something there?

10:05 a.m.

Director, Sensible BC

Dana Larsen

No, that's all accurate.

10:05 a.m.

NDP

Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC

Okay.

You mentioned the issue of decriminalizing now. Have you faced any legal charges, or have people who are patronizing your store faced any criminal enforcement actions against them? If not, how has the current criminalized environment affected you and the customers who come into your store?

10:05 a.m.

Director, Sensible BC

Dana Larsen

Vancouver has had a more progressive attitude towards cannabis for quite awhile. Possession arrests are very, very rare in Vancouver compared with other jurisdictions. You'll be hearing from Hilary Black, who started Vancouver's first dispensary. That was about 20 years ago. We opened ours in 2008. We were the third one in the city. Now there are quite a few.

In Vancouver I've been breaking cannabis laws every day for pretty much all my life. The first time I was ever charged was for giving away low-THC cannabis seeds in Calgary last year. It really varies by jurisdiction. What we enjoy in Vancouver is certainly not the same as the rest of the country. The further north you go in Canada, the rate of possession and trafficking charges increases drastically. I believe that's largely because our first nations population also increases drastically the further north you go.

It really varies across the country how these laws are enforced, which is another example of how it's not just. I can do something in Vancouver that I can get away with, but if someone in another part of the country did the same thing, they'd find themselves in a very serious legal situation.