Procedure and House Affairs Committee on March 29th, 2012

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

I'm just trying to get straight in my mind what constitutes an election offence. In my example earlier about what happened in Guelph with Mr. Valeriote and the misleading phone calls coming out of his campaign—correct me if I'm wrong, because I don't want to put words in your mouth—I believe you said that if it could be determined that those phone calls constituted advertising, they could be in violation of the Elections Act. Is that correct?

[Marc Mayrand]

That's if they did not carry the proper tag line—

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

Which we know they didn't.

[Marc Mayrand]

—or if the expenses for them were not properly accounted for.

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

Okay. What if they were not determined to be advertising? Would that mean that type of phone call would be acceptable?

[Marc Mayrand]

I think that's an issue we have with the legislation. Yes, if it's not advertising, there is nothing in the legislation that governs telemarketing per se.

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

And the determination of whether or not it is advertising is yours?

[Marc Mayrand]

In this case specifically it will be up to the commissioner, and up to the courts eventually, if charges are laid.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

I know your friend helped you with a little bit of time.

Mr. Christopherson, go ahead for four minutes.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Thank you very much, Chair.

First of all, I would say this in response to Mr. Hawn. He is concerned about the circus effect of this. He also mentioned that Canada is a role model for elections. It is that because when there is any hint of anything untoward, Canadians do react the way they do and they do create a political circus to ensure that it gets looked at. I would say to him, with great respect, that's why we're a model.

Mr. Mayrand, may I ask you to characterize, if you can, how seriously you would take proof, if there were proof, that there was an organized effort by someone to misrepresent themselves as Elections Canada during the election? How seriously would you take that? How serious an attack on our democracy is that, or is it really not a big deal and we really ought not to get upset about it?

[Marc Mayrand]

I think it's absolutely outrageous. Whether it was organized or bigger or whatever, the fact that electors in at least Guelph were misdirected by calls made by those misrepresenting themselves as being from Elections Canada is absolutely outrageous. It should not be tolerated. It should be sanctioned severely, and we need to look at the legislation to see whether we have the right framework there. But again, that is totally unacceptable in a modern democracy.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Thank you, sir. I appreciate your saying that, because it sets the standard that Canadians expect our election process to meet.

Finally, you mentioned, if I'm paraphrasing you correctly, that there are complaints from all across Canada. Can we interpret that to mean that there are investigations, then, in virtually all the provinces across the country?

[Marc Mayrand]

I will not comment on that. That's with the commissioner. I've said as much as I could say on these matters.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

I respect that, sir. I hope you can appreciate that it's our job to push you up to the line as much as we can.

My last comment, Chair, would be a motion. I would move that Mr. Mayrand be invited back and be scheduled to appear before the House rises in June, just to give us an update on what's going on.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Sure. I would ask Mr. Mayrand if he would be happy to do that. I know what the answer is, I think, but....

[Marc Mayrand]

Of course. Yes.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

So can I consider that to be an order of the committee, then, Chair?

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Well, it's a motion, and we know what happens with motions. They get voted on.

Mr. Lukiwski.

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre, SK]

Mr. Chair, the government has absolutely no problem with that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Great.

Monsieur Garneau, to make it unanimous among parties...?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Westmount—Ville-Marie, QC]

I'd be happy to second it.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Then I think we need no motion.

Monsieur Mayrand, you and I will have to discuss this. The committee will ask you back before we rise for the summer, and you can give us another update as to where we've gone.

[Marc Mayrand]

I was hoping to extend an invitation to visit our office to discuss other matters—

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

I think they would rather have you here.