Procedure and House Affairs Committee on April 23rd, 2013

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC]

It is Témiscouata.

[Guy Caron, NDP, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

If you look at that riding as a whole, it is at the geographic centre, between north and south, that is to say between the river and the border of New Brunswick.

The territory of Kamouraska is more to the west. When I enter the territory of Matapédia, I drive between an hour and a half and two hours. Geographically speaking, it is correct to say "Centre du Bas-Saint-Laurent".

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC]

The people of your electoral district will not be surprised when they learn that their member proposed that it be "Centre du Bas-Saint-Laurent".

[Guy Caron, NDP, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

We looked at a few options. First of all, there was a conference call with the three wardens of Témiscouata, Les Basques and Rimouski-Neigette. We did not want to take a chance. We did not want the name to be just Rimouski if we retained the status quo. The concern would be that the commission members would reject the name and we would go back to the name "Rimouski", the solution that is unacceptable to both Témiscouata and Les Basques.

So we did some brainstorming and we considered several possibilities. We looked at "Bas-du-fleuve" and at "Bas-Saint-Laurent", but the latter was unacceptable because it did not embrace all of the lower St. Lawrence. Portions of the region are not part of the electoral district. The most acceptable name for all three RCMs was really "Centre-du-Bas-Laurent". It is geographically accurate. The name "Bas-du-fleuve" is inappropriate for Témiscouata because it has no relationship to the river. Consequently, they did not identify with that name.

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC]

Were you interviewed on the radio on the subject? Were there any articles in the newspapers?

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Mr. Dion, I'm just trying to stop....

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC]

To what extent are the people aware of your proposal? Were you interviewed on radio? Was the proposal published in the newspapers?

[Guy Caron, NDP, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

I spoke with the wardens of the RCMs, who are the elected or appointed representatives. People were completely satisfied. The population of the three RCMs was extremely pleased to know that the riding would not change. That was the most important point. I worked toward that with Mr. Fortin, Mr. Toone and Mr. Lapointe because it was the priority.

We want the name to be as inclusive as possible. I am aware of the limits the commission members have imposed. That is why I proposed various options to the elected representatives of the three regions, and that is the compromise that is acceptable to all three.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Thank you. All three of you have made very good points on your name changes, and we'll move those forward.

I will suspend just for moment while we switch to another panel.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

We'll get started, please.

It's great to have our colleagues here today. We're trying to get through the rest of our look at the electoral boundaries commission's report for Quebec. We're going to give each of you five minutes, but if you don't need to take that, please don't.

Who would like to go first?

Madame Hassainia.

[Sana Hassainia, NDP, Verchères—Les Patriotes, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you for the opportunity to speak before the committee today.

The report of the Electoral Boundaries Commission, which was tabled on February 28, 2013, respects a fundamental principle that I advocated during the public hearings, the principle of not dividing a municipality between two electoral districts. Consequently, I am satisfied with the electoral boundaries of Verchères—Les Patriotes and I thank the commission for taking that into account. However, the changes proposed in the report of February 28 considerably change the profile of the territory. Consequently, I am of the view that the name of the electoral district no longer accurately reflects the territory and its residents.

The new territory of Verchères—Les Patriotes now includes the entire city of Boucherville. Although the residents of Boucherville now make up 40% of the population of the electoral district, I believe that the name of the district should be changed to better reflect its composition and to stimulate Boucherville residents' sense of belonging to our electoral district. I therefore suggest that Pierre Boucher, the name of the founder of Boucherville, be added to the name Verchères—Les Patriotes. It is important for me to emphasize that the name of the electoral district should not be replaced but rather that Pierre Boucher's name should be added to it.

In addition, the names "Verchères" and "des Patriotes" should also be preserved in order to provide adequate representation of the electoral district's various territorial and demographic realities. The name "Pierre Boucher" currently appears on the electoral map in the name of the electoral district of Longueuil—Pierre Boucher, which includes half of Boucherville. However, I believe that completely removing the name of Boucherville's founder from the electoral map would be disrespectful to Boucherville residents. Pierre Boucher is the founder of Boucherville and a major figure in the history of Quebec, more particularly that of Montreal's south shore.

Madeleine de Verchères, the 14-year-old girl who defended the Fort of Verchères alone against Iroquois attacks, is a source of regional pride. Thus, to preserve the sense of belonging of the people of the RCM of Marguerite-D'Youville, the name "Verchères" should also remain. Verchères is also the name of the provincial electoral district whose territory is that of the RCM of Marguerite-D'Youville.

Lastly, it is equally important to retain the words "les Patriotes" in the name of the electoral district in order to represent the people of the RCM of La Vallée-du-Richelieu, many of whom are descendants of the "Patriotes". The battles of the Patriotes are significant events in the history of Quebec, even more so for the people of the RCM of La Vallée-du-Richelieu because the Patriotes' only victory occurred in Saint-Denis-sur-Richelieu, the 175^th anniversary of which we have just celebrated.

For all these reasons, I believe that, in light of territorial and historical realities, the most appropriate name for the electoral district would be Boucher—Verchères—Les Patriotes.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Thank you.

Ms. St-Denis, you have the floor.

[Lise St-Denis, Liberal, Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC]

My remarks also concern a name change.

I simply request that the current name of the electoral district of "Saint-Maurice—Champlain" be preserved. The commission has proposed the name "Saint-Maurice". However, in its 2001 report, the commission proposed to add the name "Champlain" to that of "Saint-Maurice".

Before 2003, there were always two federal electoral districts, one called "Saint-Maurice", the other "Champlain". Saint-Maurice was Mr. Chrétien's riding, but it did not have the same boundaries. At the time, the commission justified adding the name "Champlain" on historical and geographic grounds.

My riding is very large, covering 39,000 square kilometres and 23 municipalities. It is bounded to the west by the Saint-Maurice River, which runs from the north to the south of the riding. The name "Saint-Maurice" is being proposed on that basis. However, an entire portion of the electoral district is not situated on the banks of the Saint-Maurice River. It is bounded to the east by the St. Lawrence and another riding and to the north by aboriginal lands.

I believe that preserving the name "Champlain" in the name of the electoral district would reflect the fact that Champlain is an old city, an old village dating back to 1662. It has always had its purpose in the history of the Mauricie region. The name "Saint-Maurice", on the other hand, evokes the river used by the Attikamekw and the region's founders. The people of my region rejected the name "Shawinigane" at a parliamentary committee meeting. I believe that name was linked to the Attikamekw, but the people from the riding did not want it.

Clarity is another reason. At the provincial level, one electoral district bears the name "Champlain", another is called "Saint-Maurice" and yet another is named "Laviolette". There are three provincial ridings in my electoral district. If the name "Saint-Maurice" is used in advertising for elections or for any other reason, people will think of the provincial, not the federal electoral district.

That is why I ask that the present name of the riding be preserved. It was proposed in the 2003 report and the federal electoral district has been called "Saint-Maurice—Champlain" since the 2004 election. I believe there is good reason to retain that name.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Thank you.

Monsieur Pacetti, please.

[Massimo Pacetti, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

It's always fun to appear before a committee with your colleagues, but my change is an administrative one. The name of my riding right now is Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel. The commission decided to change it to Saint-Léonard—Villeray. I'm asking that it go back to Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel.

For anybody who is not familiar with the City of Montreal, it is divided into boroughs. There is a district called Villeray on the island of Montreal, but it doesn't touch any parts of my riding.

I think it's a typo. I've distributed two documents. I don't know if you have the one with the map. The visual is quite apparent where they've made a mistake. I think the reason they made a mistake is that the borough in which the portion of Saint-Michel is included—and that's why I gave you the letter even though it's in French—is called Villeray-Saint-Michel-Parc Extension. I think they just took the first name and they did a cut-off. I think it's just a mistake. That's the extent of my intervention.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Super.

Are there questions for the witnesses?

Mr. Reid, a couple of minutes, please.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Lennox and Addington, ON]

Actually, I don't have any questions at this time, just an observation, if I could.

I do think there's a good point being made here that there's a tendency of some of the boundary commissions to take the largest community, and it tends to disfavour on a systematic basis small communities, rural communities. I think that's something that deserves to be considered by us, and it's another problem for us as well.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Thank you.

Are there no questions?

Monsieur Dion.

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC]

I think it would be a very good idea to emphasize the contribution of Pierre Boucher. I also cannot conceive of eliminating that of Champlain. In the case of Villeray, not only is our colleague Mr. Pacetti entirely correct, but his neighbour, the member representing the riding of Papineau, where Villeray is situated, also agrees entirely with him. He has promised to send a letter to the committee. That should therefore be done quite quickly.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Thank you.

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC]

I think the commission has done an excellent job but that it made a minor error to prove to us that it was human.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Yes, and it's this committee's job to fix it.

Are there any further questions for our witnesses?

Thank you very much. We will pass on your information.

I will suspend the meeting and then we will go in camera.

[Proceedings continue in camera]