Procedure and House Affairs Committee on May 22nd, 2018

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

By whom?

[Stéphane Perrault]

Ideally, I think it's the Privacy Commissioner. He's the expert in that area, but there may be other options. We've recommended other options in the past.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

We've seen with the Cambridge Analytica scandal, Brexit, and the Trump election the ability to manipulate, using vast amounts of data. The government gave Cambridge Analytica a pretty sizeable contract. The ability to manipulate voters going into the voting booth with fake news, alternative facts, and that vast amount of data is an actual threat to our democracy.

Would you agree?

[Stéphane Perrault]

Yes. I think it's important that we be prudent about how personal information is used in the context of the electoral competition.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Are we prudent right now? Do we know?

[Stéphane Perrault]

We don't know a whole lot.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

We don't know.

[Stéphane Perrault]

Yes.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

We don't know what parties do with the...? Can parties sell the personal information of Canadians right now?

[Stéphane Perrault]

It's not a simple answer. Parties can only use the information that we provide for purposes related to a federal election.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

How about other sources of data?

[Stéphane Perrault]

That's the issue. It's all put into a database that includes various sources and we're not quite sure which sources. At that point, it's impossible to tell whether the name or address of a person comes from Elections Canada or from another source.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Elections Canada is essentially blind to how parties collect and then use data in the course of an election.

[Stéphane Perrault]

Correct.

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Should you be made aware of that? As to how parties use data, do you want to have that knowledge or the Privacy Commissioner at least?

[Stéphane Perrault]

I think Canadians need to know how parties.... That's the key point.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Thank you, Mr. Cullen.

Now we'll go on to Ms. Tassi.

[Filomena Tassi, Liberal, Hamilton West—Ancaster—Dundas, ON]

Thanks, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Perrault, for being here today, for your testimony, and all the great work that you've done to date.

With respect to C-76, about 85% of what's contained in there are actually recommendations from the CEO, so I trust that you're pretty pleased with that—

[Stéphane Perrault]

Absolutely.

[Filomena Tassi, Liberal, Hamilton West—Ancaster—Dundas, ON]

—and that you are looking forward to the implementation of those recommendations and other things that are contained in the legislation.

In terms of the process, you mentioned that you are refining the implementation plan and that, over the course of the summer, you'll work on the implementation. Can you comment on what you perceive as your potential progress in that plan?

[Stéphane Perrault]

We haven't begun executing that plan.

This summer, we'll be starting work on the guidebooks for poll workers and the training material. What we will need to do is to build those guidebooks based on the current legislation, but also contemplate adjustments to those guidebooks for C-76.

When I appeared on the main estimates, I said that we are migrating 27 systems to a new data centre and we need to do integrated testing on September 1. We will proceed with that plan and, once we've done the integrated testing—it's a tight schedule, but things are going quite well—once we've solidified, then we will look at what IT changes are required for Bill C-76.

I think we're looking at 18 systems that are affected by Bill C-76. We will look to minimize. In some cases, they are minor changes, while in others, they're more comprehensive. Once we've done the integrated testing, we will then look at the other IT changes that are absolutely required for implementation of C-76. If it's not absolutely required, it will be deferred.

Then we're going to do a second series of integrated testing on January 1. Hopefully, at that point in time, there will be no further impacts on the IT system, so that we can do our simulations in the field with the new systems, as we planned.

[Filomena Tassi, Liberal, Hamilton West—Ancaster—Dundas, ON]

With the progress of your plan moving forward, are you confident that implementation is doable?

[Stéphane Perrault]

I'm confident that it is doable. I think we'll have to limit what we leverage, in terms of....

A lot of the changes that are being brought forward, which came from the former CEO's recommendations, are changes that provide flexibility to the Chief Electoral Officer. We don't have to exercise that flexibility in all cases for the next general election. In some cases, we will. In other cases, where it requires significant investments of energy and preparation, we'll defer that to the next election. Therefore, there is flexibility in the act, based on how we implement this.

[Filomena Tassi, Liberal, Hamilton West—Ancaster—Dundas, ON]

Okay, very good.

With respect to the process, congratulations. It sounds like the process was very robust and thorough.

You mentioned you had an interview with five or six people, then a reference check, which was a 360 reference check, and online tests. How extensive was the online testing?

[Stéphane Perrault]

The online part is fairly simple. It's more about personality type. That's followed by a live interview and that's more on mental ability.