Procedure and House Affairs Committee on Sept. 21st, 2017

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Does anybody else have it in front of them right now?

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

No.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

No, okay. That's my point.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

The clerk says the dilatory motion is legally on the floor, so we have to have a vote on it.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Even though you didn't give the mover of the motion a chance to speak just because technically David got on the list first? You're going to let this whole thing be shut down based on that, Chair.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Further to that point, I believed I did have the floor. I was simply allowing a courtesy because I was moving forward something that we hadn't seen in a while. I was simply allowing the documents to be distributed, and I kind of paused to allow that to happen. I would have believed I had the floor at that point.

[Chris Bittle, Liberal, St. Catharines, ON]

Mr. Chair, the motion—

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

The motion is on the floor.

[Chris Bittle, Liberal, St. Catharines, ON]

The clerk has advised us of the rules. It should proceed to a vote.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Welcome to the new era.

Okay. We can play that way, too.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

We are going to suspend just for a minute so I can discuss this with the clerk.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

I'm prepared to rule on that point of order. I think Mr. Richards is right in the sense that it's a courtesy for the person who proposed the motion to have the first speaking slot. It's not a rule but it's often the way things are done. I apologize that I didn't leave time for that, but I did recognize Mr. Graham in the process, so I have to allow the vote to proceed. Nevertheless, I apologize to Mr. Richards for not going to him first in the time when nothing was happening.

[David Christopherson, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Chair, with the greatest respect, you just acknowledged that your mistake caused a member to lose his right, a right he would otherwise have. You have the means to fix that by giving Mr. Richards the floor. I find it hard to believe that you would articulate a right denied, recognize that you caused it, and then not take the opportunity to fix it.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Mr. Chair, I too find it disappointing that you would make such a ruling, because you do have the opportunity to correct the mistake you made in recognizing somebody else while I had the floor. I'll just point out that I don't think it would have taken a lot of time to deal with bringing forward this motion. I noticed that the member, Mr. Spengemann, was present. I'm not here to try to assassinate someone's character. In fact, it's the very opposite. I'm trying to give him an opportunity.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Coast of Bays—Central—Notre Dame, NL]

He had a point of order, and now he's actually talking about his motion.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Well, I—

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Coast of Bays—Central—Notre Dame, NL]

I think the ruling was—

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Hold on, Mr. Simms, I'm in the middle of a point of order here.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Yes, but please talk about the point of order and not the motion.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

I'm getting to that. There was an opportunity for the member, while he was here, to clarify and hopefully be able to...There are allegations that hang over his head, and he should have the opportunity to correct those. I was simply making that attempt. and I would have explained that, had I been given the opportunity I was due, given that I did have the floor. I think it would have been appropriate for you to make that ruling. Maybe you can still reconsider, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

In regard to Mr. Christopherson's point, I talked about a courtesy and a procedure that often occurs, but I didn't suggest that I had taken away a person's right.

So I'll call the vote.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

Hang on, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Yes?

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

My understanding of how the rules work is that as long as Mr. Richards hasn't surrendered the floor, he has it. So if you're ruling that Mr. Graham had the floor, then I'm challenging that ruling.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Okay, the ruling is challenged. We have to vote on whether the ruling of the chair should be sustained.