Procedure and House Affairs Committee on May 4th, 2020

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Obviously, the preference for all of us here is to reach unanimous consent, but it's important to know the rules ahead of time as we are discussing among ourselves the options we have.

[Charles Robert]

That's correct.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

What are the technical obstacles before us right now if we were to choose to go fully virtual?

[Charles Robert]

As the Speaker mentioned, you might want to go back to the idea of how we want to vote. That's a critical element of procedure. It's really the purpose for the deliberative aspect of the debates you have. As the Speaker indicated in his presentation, we feel comfortable that the current rules work reasonably well and the adaptation would not be too difficult, but voting is perhaps a bit more challenging.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

To clarify, that's not necessarily a technical infrastructure aspect. We could choose to change voting rules to make sure the member of Parliament is seen on screen and is present during the vote, so it's more of a procedural aspect. Is that correct?

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

Yes, but we have to remember the rules. The member of Parliament has to be physically in the House to cast that vote. To implement what the parties have agreed to among themselves, they could pass it. I'm not sure I would feel comfortable with that, but the House has the right to do it.

If we were to have everyone vote, we would have to open the House and have everyone come in to vote on making those changes. That's one of the things that has to be considered right now with the pandemic. How safe and how prudent is it to bring everyone into that chamber so they can vote, when they won't be standing six feet apart and bodily fluids will be spread around or breathed around in the room? I'm not sure it would be a safe way of doing it, but that would be the way that it would have to happen.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

It could be adopted on division, couldn't it?

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

I'll let the Clerk answer this one.

[Charles Robert]

There are several ways of doing it. You could do it on division, but you can always escalate. That's the real issue, and there are no rules in place that prevent the escalation. Members have the right to vote in a way that clearly demonstrates how each member in the House who's participating in the vote chooses to vote.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Right. I guess to adopt it on division, you'd need unanimous consent.

[Charles Robert]

You don't have unanimous consent if you're adopting it on division.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

No, I meant unanimous consent for the process for adopting it.

[Charles Robert]

You'd have to have fewer than five members rising to request a recorded division.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Right.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ruby Sahota]

Okay, that's all the time we have. Thank you so much.

Ms. May, you have either a point of order or—

[Elizabeth May, Green, Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC]

I was hoping to ask a brief question around the voting issue if it could be squeezed in, Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ruby Sahota]

I want to discuss the work plan that our analyst, Andre, has put out for us, but we have enough time to do that and perhaps give two to three minutes to each party for one last round. If it's okay with everyone, we can give Ms. May the opportunity as well.

Ms. May, we'll put you after the NDP. We'll go through our regular round. Each party will have two minutes so that we will have time to discuss what Andre has for us in his work plan. Thank you.

Mr. Richards, this gives you an opportunity to finish your questioning for two minutes, if you'd like to be the one going for the Conservatives.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Sure. I'll take that opportunity and see how many of my colleagues choose to be upset with me later.

I would like to follow up a little further on where we were with the issue of in camera meetings.

Obviously, there are times in committee—it even arose in my previous round of questioning—when, if we want to explore something further, we may need to go in camera. It seemed to me that I was hearing that we would have difficulty with Zoom being able to do an in camera type of setting for meetings. I think it also applies to things like caucus meetings. I know that we haven't been able to have caucus meetings or internal caucus meetings of various types. We haven't been able to have interpretation or things like that.

I wonder if you could speak to that aspect. If we were to proceed with these types of meetings, how would we deal with the in camera nature of things? How would we deal with proper security for caucus meetings and these kinds of things?

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

At this time, Skype is approved for in camera meetings. The meeting we had for the Board of Internal Economy was in camera. That's why we had to shift to Skype.

What we're doing right now with Zoom is something that's very public and out there so that everyone can see what's going on in Parliament or in this virtual COVID-19 committee—

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Sorry, Mr. Speaker, but just knowing the shortness of the time we have, I want to explore a little. What about caucus meetings, which have a larger number of participants?

Also, what about when there's a need to go in camera quite quickly in the middle of a committee meeting because a certain subject comes up? I understand that happened in the Board of Internal Economy meeting. What about those kinds of instances? How would using Skype work in those situations?

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

At this time, if there's a meeting that foresees a need to go in camera, I would recommend going with Skype. That would be the way to go. As far as—

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

We would use Skype for caucus meetings and those kinds of things, then?

[Anthony Rota, Liberal, Nipissing—Timiskaming, ON]

You know what? That's a party issue. I'm not sure I'm qualified to comment on that aspect. You would have to consult with your party. The individual parties would determine the platform they would use.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Then does each party makes a determination? It's not Parliament itself that determines the platform—

[The Chair, Liberal, Ruby Sahota]

That's all the time we have.

Next up we have Ms. Petitpas Taylor, please, from the Liberals.