Citizenship and Immigration Committee on March 8th, 2011

[Geoffrey Leckey]

Yes, that's exactly it.

[Thierry St-Cyr, Bloc, Jeanne-Le Ber, QC]

Knowing who has entered the United States and who has left Canada would enable you to rule out a large number of persons and to focus your efforts on those who could well still be in Canada illegally.

[Geoffrey Leckey]

Exactly. We obviously don't have any more data from the program, but we expect to be able to strike a large number of persons whom we are looking for from this category.

[Thierry St-Cyr, Bloc, Jeanne-Le Ber, QC]

All right.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Mr. Allen.

[Malcolm Allen, NDP, Welland, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My thanks to you folks for being here.

In the presentation you talked about when CIC feels that an applicant might pose a security risk they turn to you to do some additional things. When you have a family class application that comes before you because of a security check, how long does it take to do that, on average?

[Geoffrey Leckey]

We don't treat classes, such as a family class, differently. We don't make any distinctions between this or that type of class. Whenever an application is referred to us for further examination, it's processed on a first-come, first-served basis. We do not, for example, take family class applications and put them at the bottom of the pile. They're treated equally with all the other types of applications.

Whenever we receive an application, we do a triage based on what we perceive as being the operational challenges. We will look at an application that's been referred to us and we'll identify if it looks fairly straightforward and if it doesn't appear that there will be too many information-gathering challenges. In that case, we ensure that this application is processed as expeditiously as possible.

We also identify another group of applications. These applications have significant challenges requiring the collection of additional information that we know from experience will be difficult to obtain, sometimes impossible to obtain. In these cases, we make sure that the requests to obtain the additional information are sent out immediately, because we know we're going to have to wait for quite a long time for them to come back.

[Malcolm Allen, NDP, Welland, ON]

Just so that I'm clear, we do it on a first-come, first-served basis, but we triage the first-come basis into easy, not so easy. Are we doing the easy ones first and then the less easy ones later, or are we simply saying we've triaged them into those categories?

A yes or no will do for that. I just want to be clear in my own mind that you're not saying the hard ones get put down the list.

[Geoffrey Leckey]

No, I'm not saying that.

[Malcolm Allen, NDP, Welland, ON]

Perfect. That's okay. I just want to be sure I didn't hear that. One side of the brain sometimes does that to us, right?

Since there is no sense of class application, family class, business class, etc., what is the average time it takes to do a security clearance?

[Geoffrey Leckey]

We did have, until recently, what we call a service standard of 18 months with regard to responding to CIC. We have started to look at that very closely recently based on a risk management approach because we have realized that there are many applications that can be done in much less than 18 months.

I can't say that we have settled on a new service standard, but when we do, I'm confident that it will be considerably shorter than 18 months.

[Malcolm Allen, NDP, Welland, ON]

Based on what you see as the history, you believe that in going forward with the new risk management strategy you can actually lower the amount of time on average, albeit it is understood that some cases are more difficult to get information for. It's not the decision. I understand that. It's actually the garnering of information from sources that are beyond your control to a certain degree. I get that.

If indeed we are headed in that direction, do you have any sense as to when you think you can actually get to the point where you will be enabled to do that?

[Geoffrey Leckey]

Yes, your understanding is exactly correct. We're in the middle of a study on that right now. We should be able to settle on a new service standard within a matter of months.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Thank you.

Mr. Shory.

[Devinder Shory, Conservative, Calgary Northeast, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I also want to touch on the enforceability of our legislation when we talk about deportation, specifically in the case of criminals wandering the streets for years and years after their deportation order is passed. I actually have seen in some cases, and I know as a matter of fact, that some of the potential deportees also go underground once the deportation order is passed against them.

You also mentioned this dual process under the law and exhaustibility of all the venues before you commence your action.

Before that I got interested in your comments when you talked about migration integrity officers. In the screening process they come across...specifically I was touched by this fraudulent screening process. What exactly do you mean? Are you talking about some documentation fraud? What are we talking about here?

[Geoffrey Leckey]

My colleague, Ms. Reza, is going to answer that question.

[Arianne Reza, Director General, International Operations, Canada Border Services Agency]

There are 57 migration integrity officers located around the world, and their responsibilities are to look at interdiction, facilitation, investigative techniques, liaison activities. They have several types of functions. They work with the airlines to train them with regard to what types of documents are showing up with passengers looking to come to Canada to delineate between facilitating those legitimate travellers and those who are trying to come fraudulently to Canada. They do a lot of document verification.

We see what the travel documents look like. Often we are faced with fraudulently obtained genuine documents. We are working with the airlines on training for what those documents look like.

In their broader role, they assist CIC at its request concerning anti-fraud activities. If CIC would like to have some further investigation done, site visits, looking at travel documents, financial documents, educational documents, MIOs will make physical visits to different sites.

[Devinder Shory, Conservative, Calgary Northeast, AB]

During our casework through our constituency office, I have also noticed that it is a pretty time-consuming process when you have to verify documents, specifically the documents from the foreign countries. I hope you have come up with some steps to counter the issue of fraudulent documents at least, and if you have, how do you deal with this?

At the same time, because the chair will be cutting me off quickly, I really want your comment on that enforceability. I am concerned, as are quite a lot of Canadians as well, that once the deportation order is passed, then how can...? I need your suggestion to this committee. What are your thoughts to expedite that?

[Geoffrey Leckey]

I'll answer that question.

Once a removal order is issued, it becomes a priority to remove that person from Canada, but we don't have all of the resources to remove everyone tomorrow. So we prioritize, and the priority does lie on removal of criminals and persons who have been associated with violent behaviour. You're right when you say that a lot of them, faced with a removal order, go to ground. That's why we need something like 100 more officers to do the research, to do the basic police intelligence work to try to find those people.

[Devinder Shory, Conservative, Calgary Northeast, AB]

Ms. Wong would like to ask a question, Mr. Chair, if I have some time.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Be very brief, Dr. Wong.

[Alice Wong, Conservative, Richmond, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you for coming to our committee.

I have a very simple question. How can the migration integrity officer, the MIO, help the immigration officer handle organized crime or other criminal issues?

[Arianne Reza]

The MIOs assist with the visa processing in terms of doing some of the research. In terms of the organized crime, we often look at level two. That is to see where it's not an individual visa application and to see whether there is a pattern, whether there is fraud being intended to the immigration program. So they provide assistance. There are 12 MIOs around the world whose jobs are dedicated to that type of support for CIC.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Thank you.

Mr. Leckey, Ms. Reza, thank you very much for coming. I'm sorry we have run out of time, but your comments have been greatly appreciated.

We are now going to suspend to go in camera.

[Proceedings continue in camera]