Citizenship and Immigration Committee on July 24th, 2018

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

You are implying that somehow—

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

In fact, I have done the opposite.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

—they're acting in an illegal manner—

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

I have not done that.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

—and it does not help this conversation. It does not help this approach, Minister.

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

Okay.

Will you give me an opportunity to clear the air? I have not done that. In fact, I have gone out of my way to make sure that I defend the right of people to claim asylum in Canada. I have defended their humanity and I have fought back against those who would seek to dehumanize or delegitimize them.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Sorry, Minister, but that is not really the case. If you're honest with yourself and you go back and look at Hansard, time and again in the comments that you have made you have used the words “illegal” and “irregular” interchangeably, to the detriment of the asylum seekers.

Now I want to turn to another issue. On the safe third country agreement, we just heard the story of Mr. Seidu Mohammed, who had to cross over. He risked life and limb to do so. He had other people who crossed over irregularly as well. As someone who has lived that journey, today he has called for the government to suspend the safe third country agreement. Is that something you will consider doing?

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

I'd like to begin by acknowledging and sympathizing with individuals who are seeking asylum, who are fleeing war and persecution.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Sorry, Minister, I have only seven minutes, so could you just answer my question quickly?

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

I understand and I'm going to get to the answer.

It's important for us to acknowledge the humanity and the dignity of these people. The safe third country agreement is premised on a principle supported by the United Nations, which is that people should claim asylum in the first safe country that they land in. According to the analysis of IRCC, as well as of the UNHCR, the United States is a safe country for asylum seekers.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Okay, so you take the point of view that the U.S. is a safe country for inland asylum seekers.

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

Correct.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

All right.

The United States has a standing policy under which it will not accept any applications for gender-based asylum claims based on domestic violence and gang violence. That is its standing policy at this point in time. Inland asylum seekers who show up at its border seeking asylum because of domestic violence or gang violence will be automatically rejected. Do you think that's safe for asylum seekers?

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

I'll answer your question by stating that we conduct analysis of the U.S. domestic asylum system. Regarding the policy direction you referred to, we are analyzing the impact of it on the U.S. domestic asylum system. As of today, the U.S. asylum system continues to provide due process, it continues to provide appeal rights, and it actually has acceptance rates comparable to Canada's and many other industrialized countries' that accept asylum seekers.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Aside from the fact that the U.S. has a standing policy that rejects asylum seekers who are fleeing domestic violence or gang violence, it also has more than 400 children who have been separated from their parents, whose parents have left the U.S., have been deported. Effectively, those children are orphans. That is the current situation. I don't know how, Minister, and I am sad to hear you say that—

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

Well, that is wrong. We've been very clear on that.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

—you consider the U.S. a safe country.

On the issue around plans or lack thereof, really, the government has taken an ad hoc approach to dealing with the situation, and it's inadequate. On the question about a plan, will you consider changing the immigration levels plan for the protected persons stream, from 16,000 to double that, so that you can properly accommodate the influx we're faced with today?

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

That's a very good question.

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

Be very brief, please.

[Ahmed Hussen, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

In anticipation of the rise in the global migration patterns as well as those seeking asylum, we did proactively, as a government, raise our protected persons allocation by 4,000. It shows that we were ready with a plan.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

No, your number's at 16,000. Will you actually adjust that to reflect the current reality today?

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

I'm afraid I need to end there. Thank you.

Moving to Mr. Fragiskatos and Ms. Mendès, who are sharing this time, would you like me to tell you when you're at three and a half minutes, or can you manage that?

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London North Centre, ON]

I think I can manage that, but jump in if I can't, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

No one else has been able to.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!