Yes.
Evidence of meeting #36 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was caregivers.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #36 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was caregivers.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:20 p.m.
Professor, Faculty of Social Work, University of Toronto, As an Individual
There have been many cuts in our settlement services. This is a very different topic. The previous government in particular was pulling back a lot of resources from settlement programs. Even just now, the advocate working with Lean here has very limited capacity to support the people who need help.
I think we should consider what supports are in communities not only for those very traumatized immigrants but also for making sure their basic settlement needs are met. This may require increasing some funding, but also identifying, perhaps, the resources currently available to support mental health as well as physical health needs.
I don't have more information, but those are my initial remarks.
4:20 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Borys Wrzesnewskyj
Thank you, Professor Bhuyan.
Mr. Saroya, take five minutes, please.
November 1st, 2016 / 4:20 p.m.
Conservative
Bob Saroya Conservative Markham—Unionville, ON
Thank you to all the witnesses for coming out and giving us your expertise.
I have a question for the professor and Lean.
The live-in nanny's job is sometimes referred to as modern-day slavery. When my kids were small, I had a live-in nanny. She would leave at 5 o'clock and come back Monday morning at 8 o'clock. On Monday morning she'd tell us the horror stories.
A number of nannies would get together. They would party, or whatever—the socializing effect. They would tell each other what the issues were, what horrible employer they had, stuff like this.
If you have 60 seconds, both of you, perhaps you could tell us what you would recommend. You know a lot more than I do. The reason I know is that back in 1986 our nanny used to tell us the horror stories.
If both of you could take a minute, what would you recommend to this committee, please?
4:20 p.m.
As an Individual
I would say to allocate more resources to address the PR applications of caregivers to enable them to get out of those situations and away from the employers who are abusing them. I have certainly been to gatherings and parties where nannies get together to share and talk about how good or how bad, how great or how abusive their employers are. When I hear the stories, all I can think about is how they are able to hold it in. I would say that maybe they need psychological help so as not be traumatized or scared to talk about these things.
4:20 p.m.
Professor, Faculty of Social Work, University of Toronto, As an Individual
Thank you for the question. Just to reiterate, the conditions, especially for workers who have a closed permit, are really ripe for abuse whether or not an employer intends to be abusive. “Oh, it's 6 in the morning. Can you help me do something? Oh, it's 9 o'clock at night at night. Can you help me do something?” A number of caregivers we've spoken with—I would say the majority—have been required to do work outside of their contract or required to work longer than their contract in terms of hours per day, and they have often been paid less. This is certainly the case on an hourly basis if they put in 12 to 15 hours per day instead of eight hours per day. This speaks to the expansive abuse across the program.
Does this go away if someone has an open permit or permanent residence? It may not go away completely, but the reliance of the worker on that employer is minimized. They have the opportunity to seek other employment without having a gap in their eligibility to work. Currently, if those with a closed permit leave an abusive employer, we expect them to have the agency to take care of themselves. They may have to wait four to six months before they can find a new employer and have the proper documents to work legally. This really puts people in vulnerable positions. It often pushes people to break the strict rules that are placed on them. It makes them vulnerable to what is called labour trafficking.
Those are the recommendations we have. I understand they were laid out in a brief that was submitted by the Thorncliffe Neighbourhood Office. I think it provides some concrete direction to protect workers.
4:20 p.m.
Conservative
4:20 p.m.
Professor, Faculty of Social Work, University of Toronto, As an Individual
I believe that many caregiver action groups are calling for permanent residence on arrival, in the same way that the economic class has structured permanent residence. At a minimum, I believe an open work permit that allows people to arrive in Canada with their families....
I was able to arrive with my family. It makes a significant difference and helps people to establish long-lasting supports in their community and to contribute to Canada.
4:25 p.m.
Conservative
Bob Saroya Conservative Markham—Unionville, ON
Thank you.
We talk about the processing time, the number of years for parents and grandparents. What would be acceptable? What should it be? Would you recommend something for the time it takes to approve their applications? Do you have anything to add to that?
4:25 p.m.
As an Individual
I would recommend at least 36 months because I understand there are checks and paperwork that needs to be done. I would say that 36 months would be okay to wait to have the paperwork.
4:25 p.m.
Liberal
4:25 p.m.
Liberal
Julie Dzerowicz Liberal Davenport, ON
I want to thank all of our presenters for their very passionate and informative presentations.
I have a few questions. I'm going to start with you, Professor Bhuyan.
In your research, did you look at the overall demand for caregivers in Canada? Did you get a sense of that?
4:25 p.m.
Professor, Faculty of Social Work, University of Toronto, As an Individual
No. Actually that is outside of our research. I understand that there is a long-standing problem in Canada in terms of a lack of family support for working parents. I believe this is a broader economic question. Does Canada provide adequate support for two-parent households or sole support parents? The caregiver program, as a temporary foreign worker program, provides some amelioration for this, but it doesn't address the larger problem of gender pay equity as well as the lack of parenting support in the early childhood years.
4:25 p.m.
Liberal
Julie Dzerowicz Liberal Davenport, ON
Okay, thank you.
You talked a bit about how parts of the processing time are quite extensive. I think you gave the example earlier of 48 months to process a spousal application. It seems incredible how long that is. What do you think is taking so long? Do you have an idea where in the process it's getting stuck? Is it the medicals? Is it the security checks? Is it that for some reason, it just goes into a black hole? Do you have a sense of where in the process it might be taking extra long?
4:25 p.m.
Professor, Faculty of Social Work, University of Toronto, As an Individual
For the sponsorship applications we don't have specific data from the overseas visa offices.
In 2015 we saw a troubling pattern, in that countries located in the global south, specifically those that are Muslim-majority countries, had longer processing times. This was particularly alarming, because when we were looking at conditional permanent residence, although on average 25% to 35% of sponsored spouses were getting the condition, people coming from Muslim-majority countries were receiving it on average 50% of the time.
I thus have concerns about the kinds of relationships that people who are evaluating the applications view as more valid. I have concerns about the kinds of documentation requirements people have that conform to Canadian constructions of a proper family.
I have heard from our caregiver advocates that the applications for permanent residency have been bogged down for many different types of bureaucratic reasons. Some family members who are overseas are being requested to do three or four medical examinations. I don't know whether the medical results are lost or whether they are inadequate. Often the caregivers are not provided information about why there is a delay. They are referred to the website, which just tells them that there is a delay.
I just learned yesterday, for example, of a caregiver who had to pay an exorbitant fee for transmitting the application of her spouse because the photo was not in regulation size. Some of these bureaucratic steps may seem minor, but when they contribute to multiple years of delay, I think they are unjust.
4:25 p.m.
Liberal
Julie Dzerowicz Liberal Davenport, ON
Very quickly, because I have questions for the other presenters, what do you think is a fair amount of time for processing? The 51 months is obviously way too long, but what's a fair amount of time?
4:25 p.m.
Professor, Faculty of Social Work, University of Toronto, As an Individual
I would say six months. I have an 11-year-old. I don't like it when she goes away for two weeks. I can't imagine people having to wait multiple years. I will say that six months would be reasonable.
4:25 p.m.
Liberal
Julie Dzerowicz Liberal Davenport, ON
I have a quick question for Ms. Gerente. Thank you so much for your presentation.
When your mom was applying to come here to be a caregiver, did she know that it would take 51 months, or did she have a sense about how long the time period was when she was applying?
4:30 p.m.
As an Individual
Thank you for the question. No, she didn't. She thought that it would be at least 24 months before she could get my sister and me to be with her.
4:30 p.m.
Liberal
Julie Dzerowicz Liberal Davenport, ON
The reason I'm asking is that sometimes I think we don't give the right information internationally—not that I think 51 months is just, but even if it were two years, we should be giving proper information around that.
Her thinking, then, was that it was going to take two years. She must have been surprised when it took 51 months.
4:30 p.m.
Liberal
Julie Dzerowicz Liberal Davenport, ON
Mr. Harohalli, if you have one top recommendation for us, what would it be?
4:30 p.m.
As an Individual
Allow the parents and grandparents as well to be part of the family, part of the Canadian culture, and get the paper processing done much faster.