Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Dec. 13th, 2016

[Ali Ehsassi, Liberal, Willowdale, ON]

Thank you.

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, Jenny Kwan]

We'll move on to the next round with Ms. Harder.

You have five minutes.

[Rachael Thomas, Conservative, Lethbridge, AB]

Thank you.

I'm going to give the first few minutes to my colleague.

[Bob Saroya, Conservative, Markham—Unionville, ON]

Thank you.

To speak from personal experience again, last year I saw a number of these cases. Of the people who filled out their own forms, many found their forms rejected. The people who went to people such as you were successful.

What can be done? In some cases, I personally know that they're absolutely qualified, and they were rejected simply because of an error made because they're not professionals in filling out those forms. Are there any suggestions you can give on how we can make it easier for people to do it for themselves, especially poor people? In some cases I have to tell them to see a professional, but they don't have the five hundred bucks. Is there anything you can bring forward that can be done?

[Dory Jade]

Thank you.

Well, first, they don't have to put, let's say—l'll get it from your mouth—“big bucks”.

You are dealing with immigration law, and to start, the first section of the law says that you must submit a complete application. The word “complete” is used in there and is exactly what it means. Anything that is missing will lead to a refusal or rejection, or, if the process allows it, probably a long processing time, because they need to ask you for more documentation.

In my opinion, they can make it as easy as possible, but because it's law.... What we're seeing now is that everybody thought that if express entry was in, then it's easy: you put it in, you get out, and it's all about numbers.

Well, that is not correct. It's all about law. This is why there is also a need for an authorized representative. Those authorized representatives who exist do not exist by chance. The market has a need for those individuals, and they are under the law. They are authorized by law to do it.

I really can't see how you can make a law simpler to individuals. With due respect, I will give you a very simple example: matrimonial law. If the couple is not really 100% accepting, the two parties would still have to go to a lawyer, and maybe not to court, but for arbitration. It is part of our law. This is how the country functions, and this is how Canada works. This is our system.

[Bob Saroya, Conservative, Markham—Unionville, ON]

You don't know how hard it is for me to tell somebody who doesn't have the money that they have to go see somebody. I was coming from that point of view.

Personally, somebody came to see me over and over. They are absolutely qualified, but they were denied. When I made the phone call, they said, “Oh no, they have to reapply for it.”

[Dory Jade]

Exactly.

[Bob Saroya, Conservative, Markham—Unionville, ON]

So the first nine months, ten months, were gone—

[Dory Jade]

And then they have to reapply. That's correct.

[Bob Saroya, Conservative, Markham—Unionville, ON]

Then they have to reapply, but they still had to go back.

[Dory Jade]

What I can suggest is that we would make some arrangement, let's say, as an association, for those people, and probably our members would be offering either pro bono, which is already happening, or some reduced fee services. We have already been doing it for some time now.

[Bob Saroya, Conservative, Markham—Unionville, ON]

That would be fantastic. We can forward those cases to you.

[Dory Jade]

It's a pleasure.

[Bob Saroya, Conservative, Markham—Unionville, ON]

Is there anything that you would like to add?

[Loly Rico]

Yes.

I would suggest that it should be funded by IRCC to the settlement agencies so that they can fill out the forms, because as we see it, it's part of the settlement process. At this moment, there is no funding by IRCC. The filling out of the forms is more on the settlement element, and I think that is going to help. As well, in your offices, I've been seeing a few members of Parliament who have staff who help the constituent fill out the forms in that way.

[Bob Saroya, Conservative, Markham—Unionville, ON]

Most of the time when they come to us, the damage is done. This is the problem.

[Loly Rico]

Yes.

[Bob Saroya, Conservative, Markham—Unionville, ON]

Rachael, go ahead, please.

[Rachael Thomas, Conservative, Lethbridge, AB]

How long do I have?

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, Jenny Kwan]

You have 15 seconds.

[Bob Saroya, Conservative, Markham—Unionville, ON]

I think the clock is going too fast.

[Rachael Thomas, Conservative, Lethbridge, AB]

I'm good.

[The Vice-Chair, NDP, Jenny Kwan]

All right; thank you. We'll move onto the next round, then.

Go ahead, Ms. Dzerowicz.

[Julie Dzerowicz, Liberal, Davenport, ON]

Thank you so much.

Ms. Rico, bienvenido. Gracias por su presentación.

Mr. Jade, thank you so much for being here.

I only have five minutes and I have a whole slew of questions, so try to respond as quickly as you can.

The first question is for you, Mr. Jade.

I'm always interested in why potential immigrants actually come to see immigration consultants. If I asked you for the top three reasons that they come to see you, it will help me understand the system as well. If you could respond as to what those top three things are, I'd be grateful.

[Dory Jade]

Number one is dealing with law. It's not easy.