Evidence of meeting #67 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was immigrants.
A video is available from Parliament.
4:35 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Borys Wrzesnewskyj
Mr. Tilson, if I could have your indulgence for a second. I've been told that Mr. McDonald has a flight to catch, and he would need to leave at 4:40 p.m., which is right about now.
Mr. McDonald, thank you so much for your testimony, truncated as it is. We appreciate it, and you're free to leave. Thank you.
4:35 p.m.
Prof. James Ted McDonald
Thank you for the opportunity.
4:35 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Borys Wrzesnewskyj
Mr. Lacey, I believe that, if you'd like, we can still have you on video conference for the next 20 minutes. There is no guarantee that you'll have an opportunity to speak, but you're free to stay for the next 20 minutes.
Mr. Tilson.
4:35 p.m.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
Mr. Chair, I mentioned the border crossing crisis. There was a motion that was made on that, and the debate was promptly adjourned by the government members. At the very least, we should be able to vote on this topic, even if we don't have debate. At the very least, let's vote on it, as opposed to just adjourning it into that never-never land, and it never gets heard of again. The same goes with the appeals process for citizenship fraud. Let's vote on these things. Motions are made, and then the government members simply adjourn them, and they're never to be heard of again.
I hope on this motion I've moved now, Mr. Chairman, that we have an opportunity to vote on it. Going to Atlantic Canada is important. We're spending a lot of money bringing people up here. Why don't we go down there?
4:40 p.m.
Liberal
Randeep Sarai Liberal Surrey Centre, BC
Mr. Chair, on a point of order, I think Mr. Lacey is trying to talk to somebody. I don't know if he's trying to talk to Mr. Tilson. You might want to ask.
4:40 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Borys Wrzesnewskyj
Mr. Sarai, I'm being told that he's speaking with the technician. He's not trying to speak with us.
4:40 p.m.
Liberal
Randeep Sarai Liberal Surrey Centre, BC
I wanted to make sure he was listening to you. I didn't want to—
4:40 p.m.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
I know he is, Mr. Sarai. He's listening very intently. I see his eyes looking at me.
4:40 p.m.
Voices
Oh, oh!
4:40 p.m.
Liberal
Gary Anandasangaree Liberal Scarborough—Rouge Park, ON
We all are, Mr. Tilson. You have our undivided attention, sir.
4:40 p.m.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
Yes, indeed.
I don't have any pages. I have the motion before me, which I hope you'll listen to, because I think it's a very reasonable proposal for us to go to Atlantic Canada in the upcoming summer months.
Through you, Mr. Chairman, to Mr. Sarai, I hope you'll be able to travel from British Columbia to Atlantic Canada and hear these very complicated, serious issues about the economy, how we are going to improve the economy to take new immigrants, and the issues new immigrants have when they come to this country.
You've spoken many times very eloquently. I appreciate the experience you have on this topic, and hopefully we'll hear more of that if you agree to go to Atlantic Canada. There is the issue of language, the issue of education, and the issue of preparing new immigrants to perform. It's true that we need temporary workers in the maritime provinces, but we certainly need experts and well-educated people as well. I think, obviously, many of the new immigrants who are in Vancouver, Toronto, and Montreal are people we need in Atlantic Canada.
Mr. Sarai, I hope you will listen to those comments, and I hope that when you have an opportunity to respond, you will support this motion to go to Atlantic Canada. I hope you don't do what you've done in the past, which is to simply adjourn the debate with no discussion and no vote, and have it just disappear.
I think the people of Atlantic Canada want us to go down there. They want this committee to go down there, whether it's the full committee or a smaller form of the committee. I hope you and your colleagues will agree with that so that we can go down and hear first-hand about some of the major issues on education. The whole issue of education and the universities does get complicated. We need to find out how private enterprise can get involved in that. We haven't had too much testimony on that. What a great opportunity to go down to some of the cities in Atlantic Canada and hear from some of the private companies that are down there as to what they would expect, and what requirements they would have to retain new immigrants to help settle the areas.
Also, I think we need to hear from the people in the rural parts of Atlantic Canada, to hear more of what they have to say about how the economy can improve there, and whether they're able to accept new immigrants down there. There's no question that there's an issue. Will jobs be displaced as a result of new immigrants? Quite frankly, I think that the provincial governments, the federal government, and private enterprise can do things to encourage the economy in New Brunswick, Nova Scotia, Newfoundland... and who have I left out?
4:40 p.m.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
How could I leave out Prince Edward Island? It was just a slip. I love going there and seeing Anne Shirley.
I hope the government members will support this and that we will proceed to accept this and go down to Atlantic Canada to hear some of what the people have to say.
I guess the other issue is why the government members are simply adjourning these debates on these topics—the topics of the border crossing crisis, the appeals process for citizenship fraud. These matters can be dealt with here promptly.
We have two reports to finish. I don't know how many days—maybe no one knows how many days—we're going to be here, but hopefully we will have at least a couple of days in which this committee can finish both of those reports, which are just on the cusp of being completed and concerning which, Mr. Chairman, you can proudly attend before the House of Commons to make the report on behalf of the committee.
The other issue is, as I indicated in the preamble of the motion, that the new minister has appeared, I think, only once before this committee. He won't come to talk about estimates. The government is going to be spending some more money on immigration. What is he prepared to do, as the minister, to deal with the issue that's before us now? What is he prepared to recommend to the government concerning programs? There has been mention of pilot programs. What is he prepared to do to encourage an increase in the economy of Atlantic Canada and to encourage new immigrants to come to Atlantic Canada?
The problem is, of course, that most immigrants, when they come to this country, want to go to those areas in which immigrants have already settled, and not a lot of them have settled in Atlantic Canada. That's one reason this motion is before us. They go to Montreal, Toronto, Vancouver, and I don't know about other areas, but generally to the major cities in the rest of Canada.
Why aren't they going to Halifax? Why aren't they going to Charlottetown? Why aren't they going to Fredericton? I suppose the people who are there can tell us first-hand, which is another reason I believe we should go there.
Mr. Chairman, I strongly recommend that the committee review this motion. I can't believe it's going to take much movement. I mean, they're the ones who brought the motion. The work has been done by the clerk. She has a budget that's ready to go. We could go in the summer months, with agreed-upon dates in the summer months. I'm sure witnesses would much rather that we go there to talk about these complicated issues than that they come up here or appear by television.
The other question, of course, which I can't emphasize more, is why can't we finish these two studies? Why can't we finish the LGBTQ study? The testimony is in. We always study these matters in camera. We've had witnesses on these issues who are crying out for us to do something, crying out for this committee to make recommendations to Parliament and indeed to the department to do something.
There are rumours flying around this place that we may prorogue. Well, if we do and we haven't done these studies, they will die. After all the testimony that has been given on those two studies, they will die. I suppose it's possible that the committee could make a motion to have them come forward again in the fall. I suppose that's possible—it has happened before—but right now, if they prorogue, those studies would die.
Those people who have come to this committee and given very emotional testimony, particularly on the LGBTQ study, will be most upset that we allowed this matter not to have priority with the committee, and instead proceeded with the Atlantic study, which is most important. That's why I am recommending, Mr. Chairman, that we go to Atlantic Canada to hear some more testimony with respect to Atlantic Canada and with respect to the problems in Atlantic Canada.
The same goes for the immigration consultants study. We've heard a lot of testimony about that, and it will be a shame if that study just dies. That's what's going to happen if we continue on bringing people from the Maritimes, from Atlantic Canada, here, and allow the immigration consultants study to die as a result of prorogation. Maybe we're not going to prorogue, but someone starts these rumours. Mr. Chairman, you've heard these rumours.
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
Indeed you have, but it's something we have to keep in mind because the immigration consultants study has had a huge impact on all of Canada. You look at the issues that have been before us, and members have whispered to me that I don't care about Atlantic Canada. Well, that's just false, and I've given the reasons that I do care about Atlantic Canada. I wasn't born there, but I lived there. I was educated there. I am aware of the issues because my family still owns property there, and I'm concerned about the economy of Atlantic Canada, as are all of us in this committee.
I believe we could quickly put forward a plan as to which cities we could go to to cover as many areas as possible. I don't know how many meetings it would take, but if we went down there, we could spend considerable time hearing from the people from Atlantic Canada. Do they want new immigrants? Do they want to improve the economy? Do they want to have more jobs? How can we do that? How can we receive immigrants and welcome them into the committee? They're experts on that. They have a great reputation now. How can the economy be improved? Sure, we had Premier McKenna show up, and he gave us some comments, but I'd like to hear from the people. I'd like to hear from the residents of Atlantic Canada and what they have to say. People who are working there, people who are unemployed, I'd like to hear what they have to say. I'd like to hear from the temporary workers who work in the lobster factories. What's going to happen to them? How can we improve those jobs, and continue to improve them? If we don't do something, there's the issue of whether they'll be going on welfare. With all due respect to the witnesses before us now, it's very fine to hear from these experts, but I'd like to hear from the people.
Ms. Rempel has a few words.
4:50 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Borys Wrzesnewskyj
Mr. Tilson, several times you asked the chair for clarification as to why very important reports have not been completed. There's a procedural explanation. As is the opposition's right to filibuster, that is a right that you have, but—
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
Mr. Chairman, I'm not filibustering. I'm asking that we go to—
4:50 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Borys Wrzesnewskyj
—that has impacted.... I'm just providing a clarification for you—
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
Mr. Chairman, I question your words on that. I don't think you need to say that. What we're trying to do is to give the best effect of this study by going to Atlantic Canada to hear testimony from Atlantic Canada.
4:50 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Borys Wrzesnewskyj
I assumed that was genuine questioning of the chair to provide clarification.
4:50 p.m.
Conservative
David Tilson Conservative Dufferin—Caledon, ON
Oh, no, I'd never do that, Mr. Chairman. I have the greatest respect for you and I'd never do that.
