Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Dec. 7th, 2020

[Marian Campbell Jarvis]

I'll turn to Mr. Mills if we have that percentage, and if not, Madam Chair, we'd be pleased to follow up on the member's question.

[Daniel Mills]

At the moment, about 40% of the applications are made here in Canada, while 60% are made from another country.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Okay.

Of the applications being processed, how many are inland, and how many are outland?

Maybe I can get those numbers from the officials. If I can get the breakdown, both in percentage and in actual numbers, of how many have been received by IRCC and how many have been processed, that would be very helpful.

I'll turn to the issue of dual intent. If someone applies with dual intent, they can't be denied simply on the grounds of having dual intent. However, it is possible that by virtue of having dual intent, the bar to convince an immigration officer that they will leave Canada according to paragraph 179(b) is more difficult. That seems to be playing out in the evidence given the number of families that have been rejected.

Dual intent does nothing to negate paragraph 179(b). If you have a loved one in Canada, would that not put you at a disadvantage in trying to convince the officer that you will indeed leave Canada after your visa is due?

[Marian Campbell Jarvis]

With respect to dual intent, it is recognized as the member has noted that it's perfectly reasonable to have a dual intent. Many people come as temporary residents with the hope to stay. The issue, though, is that in law there has to be a strong commitment to leave at the end. We need to know that the temporary resident, if they are not successful in their permanent residence application, would leave. In terms of the grounds that the member has raised, the agent will assess the full range of measures, not one particular instance.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

I wonder if IRCC has any stats, historically or previously, to show that people who have dual intent and receive their TRV then ended up not leaving the country.

Do you have stats to that effect that you can share with the committee?

[Marian Campbell Jarvis]

I do not have those stats at my fingertips. I would be pleased to take that back and see what we have available.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Yes. I think that would be very helpful, because the—

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Ms. Kwan, I'm sorry for interrupting, but your time is up.

Ms. Jarvis, yes, we would appreciate it if you could provide the numbers that the member has requested.

We will now—

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Sorry, Madam Chair. Can I just interject for one second?

Could I also have those numbers broken down by country as well?

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you.

We will now proceed to our second round of questioning.

Ms. Dancho, you have five minutes.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Could I have the committee's confirmation that any data they provide to individual members of the committee are provided to all members of the committee?

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

The data, whatever the officials provide, will come to the clerk and will be distributed to all the members.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

That's perfect. I appreciate that.

Let's talk about expired COPRs for a little while. From the last couple of times we've spoken about this, my understanding is that there are about 10,000 abroad that are expired, 6,000 have been contacted by the department, 1,000 of those have been provided travel documents, and about 675 of that 1,000 have actually travelled.

I'm sure that has been updated since last week, but that's approximately my understanding of the issue.

Is that correct?

[Marian Campbell Jarvis]

That does sound very familiar, but I will turn to Mr. Mills for further confirmation.

[Daniel Mills]

Ms. Dancho's figures are correct. However, the total number of expired Confirmations of Permanent Residence is about 14,000 at the moment

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Sorry, was that 14,000 rather than 10,000?

Okay, then there are a few more than we thought. There are about 14,000 abroad that are expired and are certainly in this troubling situation.

I was just reviewing a letter submitted by an advocacy group that started up for these individuals. They pointed out, and I just want confirmation on this, that you've been contacting all of these approximately 14,000 folks. However, my understanding is that they've also been asked by your government, first and foremost, to apply through this web form and then they are contacted.

Can you just run through for me why that is?

If they've applied on the web form, why do they need to be contacted to confirm whether they want to come. I am just thinking that they probably wouldn't have applied with the web form if they didn't want to come. I wonder whether that's an additional step that's unneeded.

[Marian Campbell Jarvis]

Thank you. That's a good question.

I think this reflects this whole new line of business for us since COVID, which is uncharted territory.

Mr. Mills, would you like to provide further details on the actual process, please?

[Daniel Mills]

Yes, this really is a new area. We had to adapt very quickly to respond to the needs of the clients, while keeping in mind the health and safety of Canadians in this country.

When people who want to come to Canada send their applications through the electronic form and are ready, we are very happy to welcome them and we want to do so as quickly as possible. However, we must make sure that they have a suitable quarantine plan and that their various travel documents, such as medical exams and passports, are still valid. We communicate with them to check that information before we send the letter of confirmation.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Thank you, Mr. Mills.

I remember from last time we spoke that you did mention the medical application they sort of have to reapprove. My understanding is that the medical part can be very costly. I think I asked last time if you would consider, since they had good health nine months ago, given the extraordinary circumstances whether we could just use their former one even if it's a bit expired. I'm not sure you're considering that.

Further on in this letter that they wrote to our committee and to you, they mentioned that when you contact them you ask for a lot of additional information. They mentioned you want documents showing where they live, the address, lease agreement, plans to work in Canada, proposed travel itinerary, and the additional medical re-examination as you mentioned. It sounds as though they're being asked all the same questions that they would have already provided information on before, and I'm just wondering if that's part of the problem. If they applied and were approved, can't we just take their approved applications from before and approve them now and allow them to come?

[Marian Campbell Jarvis]

Madam Chair, that's a good question. One contextual point is that as we have these COPRs, it actually means that the permit has expired a year ago. Quite a bit of time may have passed. In the context of the pandemic, we are wanting to verify that we have the relevant detail to protect the health of everybody involved.

Mr. Mills, I don't know if there are further comments you wish to make to help answer the member's question.

[Daniel Mills]

As my colleague mentioned, some Confirmations of Permanent Residence were processed about a year ago, or have expired. We want to make sure that the information supplied to us a number of months ago is still valid. Once again, we want to protect the health and safety of Canadians. We want to make sure that, when these people arrive in the country, they will have a suitable quarantine plan.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you, Mr. Mills. The time is up.

We will now proceed to Ms. Dhillon.

Ms. Dhillon, you have five minutes for your round of questioning. Please proceed.

[Anju Dhillon, Liberal, Dorval—Lachine—LaSalle, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Let me start by asking you this question.

At the start of the pandemic, a lot of newcomers or potential newcomers were caught in a really difficult situation. They either had permanent resident status or they had been given a Confirmation of Permanent Residence. However, because of the pandemic, they could not travel. Time went by and those Confirmations of Permanent Residence ended up expiring.

What are you doing to make sure that people like that are protected? What choices have you made to help them in that situation?

[Daniel Mills]

Yes, indeed, with the Confirmations of Permanent Residence, we had to react quickly during the pandemic and adapt our various processes.

First, in April and May, we reviewed the Confirmations of Permanent Residence for which the medical exams were about to expire. We looked at the various files and we proactively extended the validity period of some medical exams by 6 to 12 months, so that those permanent residents could travel to Canada.

As I mentioned, since April, almost 14,000 Confirmations of Permanent Residence have reached their expiry date. Of that number, we have contacted 6,000 people to explain to them that they are still able to come to Canada because we have proactively extended the validity period of the medical exams. We still have to communicate with approximately another 4,000 people. We are doing that in a rigorous manner. Last week, we reached 500 people and we will do the same this week.

We are working at a very good rhythm. We hope that we will be moving forward quickly and communicating with everyone in a very reasonable time period.

[Anju Dhillon, Liberal, Dorval—Lachine—LaSalle, QC]

Thank you for your answer, Mr. Mills.

Now I would like to talk about how effective your activities are.

We know that our government analyzes all possible approaches, as it has done in the past, to avoid the duplication of work.

Can you tell us what you did in August to allow visitors to apply for a work permit without leaving the country? Has that approach been used in other aspects of immigration?