Evidence of meeting #33 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was president.
A video is available from Parliament.
12:40 p.m.
Executive Chair, First Nations Financial Management Board
Gender equality has become the norm in all boards, and it should be pursued.
12:40 p.m.
Liberal
12:40 p.m.
NDP
Lori Idlout NDP Nunavut, NU
Qujannamiik. First of all, welcome and thank you for your interventions. They were very important.
I have a quick question to either Carol or Allison.
Do you have Inuit representation on your board at the Native Women's Association of Canada?
12:45 p.m.
President, Native Women's Association of Canada
Do we have what?
October 17th, 2022 / 12:45 p.m.
President, Native Women's Association of Canada
Yes, we do.
12:45 p.m.
NDP
Lori Idlout NDP Nunavut, NU
Okay. I'm glad to hear that. It would also be great to see a seat for Pauktuutit, the national Inuit women's association.
Do you have a relationship with them?
12:45 p.m.
President, Native Women's Association of Canada
I'm not quite sure. I just came in in July. I haven't had the opportunity yet, but I know it's in the talks that we will be talking to them.
12:45 p.m.
NDP
Lori Idlout NDP Nunavut, NU
Okay. Thank you so much.
Mr. Calla, it's good to see you.
I was struck by your intervention. You're hoping to see this bill create a transformative and systemic change. You see that as a great opportunity.
Bill C-29, under paragraph 7(d), reads, “monitor policies and programs of the Government of Canada, and federal laws, that affect Indigenous peoples”.
Do you think a section like that would create the transformation and the systemic change that needs to happen?
12:45 p.m.
Executive Chair, First Nations Financial Management Board
Thank you for the question.
There's no guarantee. My hope is that its report to parliamentarians will be what identifies the need for change and will trigger the incentive for change. If indigenous people could do it themselves, it would have been done a long time ago.
We need to have the ability to report directly to Parliament, which I believe this provides, around the issues that are required to achieve reconciliation. We're going to be coming here speaking to you as a result of that report, and it will be the actions that you undertake as parliamentarians that will help us achieve that goal.
12:45 p.m.
NDP
Lori Idlout NDP Nunavut, NU
I have the same question for Gérard, and NWAC as well.
Do you think that paragraph 7(d) will see that transformative and systemic change that we're hoping to see stem from the creation of this board?
12:45 p.m.
President, Native Alliance of Quebec
This provision can certainly be very helpful. There is every opportunity to have discussions to advance indigenous rights, both federally and provincially. Earlier, we talked about the idea of having federal-provincial meetings with the ministers responsible. That's one way to advance the cause.
That said, in some areas such as hunting, fishing and forestry, the federal government has transferred a lot of responsibility to the provinces, and sometimes the provinces make decisions that go against what has been explained to us by the federal government.
So yes, there are big changes and improvements, and that's one way to do it.
12:45 p.m.
Legal Technical Advisor, Native Women's Association of Canada
Thank you for your question, honourable member.
I think this is certainly a step in the right direction. Again, given the exclusion of indigenous women in such an important bill, I don't think it goes far enough. It certainly doesn't speak to subsection 35(4) of our Constitution. I don't think it speaks to section 20 of the charter. I don't think it speaks to article 22 of UNDRIP. I don't think it speaks to the RCAP report or the calls for justice in the National Inquiry into Missing and Murdered Indigenous Women report.
Yes, it is certainly a step in the right direction, but we still have a very large missing piece here.
12:45 p.m.
NDP
Lori Idlout NDP Nunavut, NU
Thank you so much for your responses.
I've looked at the bill in terms of what rights could be upheld and the failures that we see in protecting indigenous people's rights. I've been curious to see if there would be responses about how we ensure that this council is also able to monitor whether indigenous people's rights are being protected or whether we continue to be deprived of our rights.
I asked the previous witnesses about this example, and I would love to hear a response from each of you as well. I used the example of the Human Rights Tribunal's decision on the first nations children who were discriminated against. Their rights were being violated, yet the federal government is still fighting that decision.
I wonder if you would see an improvement in this bill in terms of taking a rights-based approach to monitoring some of the work that's going on with regard to reconciliation.
I'll start with Gérard.
12:50 p.m.
President, Native Alliance of Quebec
Personally, I believe that these are functions and responsibilities that will have to be given to this board. I think this board will have to intervene with the government so that we never accept that indigenous people lose any rights. In fact, some rights have been lost or forgotten because the government ignored them or tried to circumvent them. Yes, I think this board should be responsible for making recommendations, but I think it should have a little more power; this board should also be the body that represents the indigenous people in Canada before the federal government.
12:50 p.m.
Executive Chair, First Nations Financial Management Board
I believe it can protect our rights. The council will have that opportunity. If it has government-wide access to information and data, it can bring that forward in ways we've not been able to do before, so I think it can help. It doesn't mean that the issues we have today don't require alternative measures to deal with those kinds of things, but, as I have said several times when I've come here before, whatever you do, you have to have a picture in your mind of what you want to see 20 years from now. We can't expect an overnight solution here.
We have to deal with the realities of colonialism. We have to deal with the suffering and the poverty that exists in our communities. It has to be reported to Parliament, and parliamentarians have to weigh in on the progress that's being made.
Too often when we establish policy, we can't wait five years for a census to determine the effectiveness of the policy change. We need a real-time process of evaluation of whether it's working. There are initiatives under way through a number of organizations and institutions in this country that are working with the departments to help achieve that.
I think it can help, but we need an opportunity to be able to report to this council so that the report can go back to Parliament.
12:50 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Marc Garneau
Thank you.
President McBride, do you want to add anything, very quickly?
12:50 p.m.
President, Native Women's Association of Canada
This is a step in the right direction, but again, without representative representation on the board, I don't know how it could achieve any rights-based approaches at the end of the day.
I think a culturally relevant gender-based analysis needs to be applied to everything this committee does. I think consultations with indigenous women and two-spirit, transgender and gender-diverse people within the communities as to how this legislation and this board are effectively responding are important and very relevant and, beyond that, with canvassing, what specific rights could be upheld within the legislation. NWAC hasn't been consulted on the bill. We would need a lot more time to be able to review this bill in detail.
12:50 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Marc Garneau
Thank you.
Colleagues, we're going to have time for a very shortened second round, providing we all show discipline because of the time.
We will start with Mr. Melillo for three minutes.
12:50 p.m.
Conservative
Eric Melillo Conservative Kenora, ON
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
It's great to be back with you and with committee members here in INAN.
Thank you to all our witnesses for taking the time to join us and to share your thoughts. We really appreciate all of the comments you have made so far.
With my limited time, I want to pick up, Mr. Calla, on an answer you gave in response to a question from my friend Marcus Powlowski, my neighbour over in northern Ontario. That's around the funding aspect when we're talking about reconciliation and indigenous services.
I think we would all agree that in many instances, government funding is required and necessary to help address some of the concerns that indigenous people are facing. We see that in my riding, but we've also seen over the years and in this recent Parliamentary Budget Officer's report that the dollars the current government has been spending aren't leading to an equal increase in the organizations' meeting their objectives. To that end, I think there's clearly a disconnect between the rhetoric and the announcements in Ottawa and the results that are being experienced on the ground.
The question I have is this: Do you have any thoughts or specific suggestions for us as a committee to consider to ensure that the government can make sure it's getting value for its money, that the dollars it's spending are going to improve the lives of indigenous people across the country?
12:55 p.m.
Executive Chair, First Nations Financial Management Board
I think you have to invest in indigenous-led solutions. Government-led solutions haven't proven to be successful.
If you were to look at the results of the First Nations Fiscal Management Act, at the 300 communities and the work that the financial management board has done even in communities that are in financial trouble, what you see is that bringing governance and administrative and fiscal capacity to those first nations has increased their own-source revenue and their index of well-being.
I think that some wise investments have been made in fiscal institutions and other organizations like ours to start creating indigenous-led solutions. I'm hoping that's what this council will be able to seize, which is that you need those kinds of solutions.
I think the important thing for this council is to be adequately resourced. It will need a secretariat. It will need to be able to do the due diligence necessary to allow it to report to you in a way that isn't filtered.
12:55 p.m.
Conservative
12:55 p.m.
Liberal
12:55 p.m.
Liberal
Patrick Weiler Liberal West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I'm really grateful to our witnesses for being here and for their thoughtful testimony they've given already.
My first question will be for the Native Women's Association of Canada.
The national council on reconciliation will be reporting on the progress on meeting the Truth and Reconciliation Commission's calls to action. I'd like your opinion on what role you see this council having on reporting on the MMIWG calls to action as well.
12:55 p.m.
Legal Technical Advisor, Native Women's Association of Canada
Thank you for your question.
I think it's important that the calls to action be embedded in pretty much all that the Government of Canada does moving forward. There's certainly a space for it, I think, on the TRC's board of reconciliation. I think there's definitely room for that here.