Industry Committee on May 16th, 2017

[Kirsty Duncan, Liberal, Etobicoke North, ON]

Thank you, Lloyd, for your work in this area.

I actually would like to thank all of the committee for being down in Washington, D.C., two weeks ago. Thank you for being there to recognize and celebrate Dr. Art McDonald, and thank you for the important meetings you had down there.

I'm going to use artificial intelligence as a way to highlight the shift from fundamental research through to applied and on to commercialization. Canada really is a world leader when it comes to artificial intelligence. I think of people like Geoffrey Hinton and Yoshua Bengio, and we have these incredible areas from Toronto to Waterloo, the hub in Montreal, and out in Edmonton. Our talent and our ideas are in high demand around the world. We want to make sure that the activity stays here in Canada.

In this budget 2017, we're investing $125 million in artificial intelligence to create a pan-Canadian artificial intelligence strategy, and we know that with these research hubs—and, Frank, I think of you in Montreal. Montreal has the Canada first research excellence fund, and part of that funding went to artificial intelligence in Montreal.

I will just remind the committee that we had a $900-million investment in artificial intelligence in September. The idea is that if we create these research hubs, we know that companies will be attracted. We also know there will be applied research and that we will get commercialization.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Thank you.

Mr. Knubley, did you have something to add?

[John Knubley, Deputy Minister, Department of Industry]

Yes. I would just add that very consistent with Minister Duncan's example of artificial intelligence, broadly speaking, in the innovation agenda, we are looking at a number of points of interest, if you like, with respect to tech transfer.

Another concrete example would be the initiatives related to our incubators. We have funded incubators over the last few years. Basically, these are entities that are specifically designed to help take the excellent science, which Minister Duncan is focused on and talking about, to the marketplace. The Honourable Navdeep Bains will also want to speak more broadly about intellectual property and the issues at play there, and how we need to move forward, from the innovation agenda perspective, to really promote a strong intellectual property regime in Canada to make sure that tech transfer happens.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Thank you, and thanks for your support for agriculture. I just had to sneak that in.

[Kirsty Duncan, Liberal, Etobicoke North, ON]

I just wanted to add to that actually, and I'll be really quick.

Lloyd thank you for being such a champion in this area. As you know, $70 million was invested in budget 2017 in agricultural research. When we were down in Washington, the National Science Foundation told us that the areas it wanted to come up to Canada to see in terms of our research were related to research in neuroscience, quantum, and Arctic, but also in biodiversity at the University of Guelph and the bar-coding that's done there.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Lobb, you have seven minutes.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Thanks very much, Minister, for coming here today.

I want to go back to touch briefly on the diversity you set out for universities. Again, I know there have been a couple of other members that have talked about this.

In the regulations, again, Mr. Masse and I fought really hard to get it actually into the bill. We weren't able to do so, but in the regulations, it's basically just comply or explain. There's no target set.

When you and Minister Bains are sitting around the table having discussions, does that come up where in one piece we're talking about the makeup of our corporate boards having a much weaker and lesser standard than the chairs at these universities? Does that come up? Why would the department come at it from one direction on one, then another direction on the other? Why wouldn't it be the same?

[Kirsty Duncan, Liberal, Etobicoke North, ON]

I will speak a bit, and then I will turn it over our deputy minister, John Knubley. I really want to bring home that we're taking a very different approach on science than the previous government.

The previous government—

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Sorry, I don't want to get into the before or after. It's 2017 now. Your colleague, Minister Bains, brought a bill forward that had one set, and yours had a different. We don't need to talk about Stephen Harper. We're talking about you two. Why would one have one, and the other have a different one?

[Kirsty Duncan, Liberal, Etobicoke North, ON]

Ben, I am going to do two sentences before I hand it to my deputy minister. We are taking a very different approach than the previous government.

The previous government cut scientists, muzzled scientists, scientific evidence—

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

If that's the approach you're going to take Minister, then don't.

[John Knubley]

I would like to talk about Bill C-25. I know the Honourable Navdeep Bains will have another opportunity on Thursday to speak to that.

In that context, the bill does identify a name and comply approach. Similarly, with respect to the CRC program, we're proposing that all institutions with five or more chairs—these are specifically the medium and large universities—must table a plan. It's not enough to do targets; they must also table a plan to reach the targets.

As Minister Duncan was mentioning, the challenge, when you look at the targets they set of their own will, is that they have not been meeting those targets. What we're asking them to do is, again, name and identify what it is they are doing.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Fair enough. All I was trying to get at was how can two people in the same department have two different approaches on what you're trying to achieve, which is kind of the same thing. I'll leave it at that and move to a different topic now.

Within the lobbying registry with whom the minister has met with, Minister Duncan has met with almost all who one can say are reasonable, they're universities, etc.

The one that I would question though or try to understand, and maybe you can't comment on it, is how is it that the Minister of Science meets with the Woodbine Entertainment Group? Basically, it's a casino and horse racing track. What relevance is there to that? Is that a constituent of yours? How does that happen?

[Kirsty Duncan, Liberal, Etobicoke North, ON]

Thank you.

Yes, Woodbine Racetrack is a constituent in my riding. They come to see me in my riding office.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

That makes a lot of sense, then.

Another question I have for you is on the opioid crisis. There will be some research and there has been some research, but what else is there we can do? This goes back to when we did studies on this when I was the chair of the health committee.

Are chair positions going to be appointed from coast to coast, to try to understand the issues with the opioid crisis—and the other fallout from it—from an urban perspective, a small urban perspective, or a rural perspective? I come from a rural area. We have the same issues. They have different roots, perhaps, but what are we looking at here for funding to research this issue?

[Kirsty Duncan, Liberal, Etobicoke North, ON]

Ben, thank you for the question and for highlighting this very sad tragedy in our country. I just want to begin by saying that my heart goes out to all those who are affected, their families, and their friends.

This issue—as you know—would fall under the Minister of Health. The Canadian Institutes of Health Research falls under her jurisdiction. The Minister of Health and I work very closely across research, but this specific example comes under her jurisdiction.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

I have one more—

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Your time has run out.

We're going to move to Mr. Sheehan. You have five minutes, please.

[Terry Sheehan, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

Thank you very much, Minister. I appreciated the presentation, and congratulations on the launch of Science Odyssey.

There are a couple of things happening in the Soo, including Entomica, which is a little business set up by a scientist working for Natural Resources Canada. It's just a side business that he runs, which employs a lot of young people. It's all about bugs, and it's really exciting.

A couple of weeks ago he was part of the science week they hold in Sault Ste. Marie. Your friend and mine, Dr. Roberta Bondar—Canada's first woman in space and the first neurologist in space—was there speaking. I was pleased that they had these young elementary students with Entomica at a senior citizens' home, and they were teaching the seniors science. Also, I was pleased to see that it was about 65% young ladies, so we're starting to see some changes since Dr. Roberta Bondar came on the scene.

On that topic and about education, in your presentation—in the estimates—you noted that $1.3 billion is going to be spent on SIF for post-secondary institutions. I know in the Soo that Algoma University, Sault College, and the Anishinabek discovery centre received some funding, and I understand on a local level the significance that it's having. Could you tell this committee—on the macro Canadian scene—what the $1.3 billion is doing for this country?

[Kirsty Duncan, Liberal, Etobicoke North, ON]

Thank you, Terry, and thank you always for your strong support of science. I think this committee would want to recognize that it's the 25th anniversary of Dr. Bondar's first space mission.

Dr. Roberta Bondar always talks about creating a culture of curiosity. This is what we want to do in this country. All children are born curious. They want to discover and explore. We want to foster that through elementary school, high school, and beyond. Of course, we're happy to do that, whether it's our investment in PromoScience of $10.8 million in this last budget, whether it's Science Odyssey's 600 events happening across the country, or whether it's $50 million to teach grade school children to code.

The last area you hit on was the SIF. As you know, in budget 2016 we made a $2-billion investment in research and innovation infrastructure across the country. Much of our infrastructure was 25 years of age. This is good for our students. We want them to have the most up-to-date labs and tools. They are going to be the ones out in the workforce in the jobs of the future. The $2 billion could be matched by the provinces, the territories, and other organizations. We're really pleased. We've announced 300 projects. Whether it's Holland College in Prince Edward Island, Centennial College in Toronto, or SAIT out west, this will make a real difference to our country.

With that, I will just highlight that in budget 2017 we're also looking at federal science infrastructure. My job is to work across government to bring together the science-based departments. In budget 2017 we've announced that we will work to create a science infrastructure strategy for the federal government, so that they have the best labs and tools.

[Terry Sheehan, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

Excellent.

I noted in the estimates that the Natural Sciences and Engineering Research Council of Canada is seeking $101.8 million in grants under the Canada first research excellence fund. That's $70 million more than in the 2016-17 estimates.

This funding is a joint initiative of the three research granting agencies. How will this funding be distributed between basic and applied research? Perhaps you could talk as well about how this particular group makes it easier for the private sector to collaborate with academia and private business.

[Kirsty Duncan, Liberal, Etobicoke North, ON]

I'll just start by reminding this esteemed committee that in budget 2017 we have the superclusters. It will be $900 million-plus that will go to areas such as agriculture, agrifood, advanced manufacturing, clean tech, and clean energy.

The Canada first research excellence fund invests in research across the country. Last September we made an investment of $900 million in areas such as neuroscience, agriculture and agrifood, and quantum computing. These are really areas where Canada has tremendous strengths and can lead.

As I said, I was at the National Science Foundation. They want to partner with Canada. They want to see our good Arctic research, quantum research, neuroscience research, and—again, I'll highlight—biodiversity research.

Lawrence, would you like to talk a bit about CFREF?

[The Chair, Liberal, Dan Ruimy]

Please respond very briefly.

[Lawrence Hanson]

I'll be very brief.

In terms of your question about basic versus applied research, the CFREF was directed more toward the end of funding basic research, but it was very much focused on areas where the institution had significant, demonstrated capacity, areas that could be ultimately demonstrated to be of significant economic benefit to Canada and had a strong plan for implementation. Again, although it was more toward the basic research end of the spectrum, it was very much designed to be able to lever areas of expertise and create future economic benefit.