Subcommittee on International Human Rights Committee on Feb. 23rd, 2021

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

Welcome back, colleagues, to meeting number 11 of the Subcommittee on International Human Rights. Today, pursuant to the motion adopted on October 27, 2020, we're beginning our study on the role of the Canadian ombudsperson for responsible enterprise.

Mr. Reid, I'm glad you found the link. Those are some of the transition pains.

I'd like to welcome our new clerk, Naaman Sugrue. He's no stranger to this committee. Naaman Sugrue was the clerk of this committee back in 2017 to 2019. Some of the members here—some of the vets like probably Scott, Iqra and Anita, and Jennifer I know subbed a number of times, and others—probably know Mr. Sugrue from being here.

As we get on to the meeting, to ensure an orderly meeting, I'd encourage all participants to keep their microphone on mute unless they're speaking. Also, I'll put up my regular 30-second sign when your time is coming to a close. I'll do that for the members and also for the witnesses.

For those who have not used this platform, on the bottom of your screen you'll see a globe. If you need interpretation services for English or French, please select the language of your choice on that globe. Also, please note that screen captures or photos are not permitted.

At this time, I'm going to have the opportunity to welcome our first guest of this first panel. From the Office of the Canadian Ombudsperson for Responsible Enterprise, or CORE, we have Sheri Meyerhoffer, ombudsperson.

You'll have five minutes for your opening statement, and then we'll move to members' questions.

You may begin.

[Sheri Meyerhoffer, Ombudsperson, Office of the Canadian Ombudsperson for Responsible Enterprise (CORE)]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thanks to the members of the subcommittee for your invitation. I appreciate your interest in the work we do and I'm eager to answer your questions.

Our office is the first of its kind in the world. I think Canadians should be proud of this, as well of our commitment to protect human rights abroad. In short, CORE, or the Canadian Ombudsperson for Responsible Enterprise, is the name under which we are known. Our mandate consists in investigating potential human rights violations in the context of the activities of Canadian businesses abroad in the clothing, mining, oil and gas sectors.

We are independent, impartial and transparent in our work. We are required to make public reports. We also have tools to initiate reviews, carry out investigations, conduct meditations and, if necessary, make proactive recommendations to the Minister of International Trade.

The idea of the CORE was announced by government in 2018. I was appointed to my role more than a year later. Our team is currently concluding what we consider our start-up phase. We are working from a blank slate. We are the first of our kind in the world. That meant consulting widely.

We engaged with more than 200 stakeholders. We developed and refined our operating procedures. We published policy briefs and statements. We listened to ensure that we were building an office that will make a positive difference in the world. Now, this winter, we have arrived at an important time for our team and for our mission.

In the coming weeks, we will be launching an online complaints portal. It's a way for people and communities to reach out to us. Anyone, anywhere in the world and at any time will be able to lodge a complaint by computer, phone, online form, email and even by letter. The online portal is easy to use. When a complaint is filed, it can be done so anonymously. If people or communities have an issue, they can make their voices heard and we will respond.

As with any new body or agency, the creation of CORE has prompted a lot of enthusiasm, but also a range of questions.

Specifically, I am often asked whether we have the tools we need to do our work. I would like my answer to be very clear.

I believe our office can make a real and positive difference now. We can respond to complaints and initiate reviews. We can engage in mediation and publish our findings. We can make recommendations for action and publicly issue follow-up reports on their implementation. In other words, we can help Canada promote and protect human rights, full stop.

I have tremendous pride in what CORE is doing and great belief in our potential. We are eager to begin our investigative work. Canadians expect their companies to respect human rights no matter where they operate. The creation of our office represents another example of Canadian leadership on the international stage.

Thank you. I look forward to our discussion.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

Thank you, Ms. Meyerhoffer.

Now we are going to go to members for questions.

We are going to commence with the Liberals. We have Ms. O'Connell for seven minutes.

[Jennifer O'Connell, Liberal, Pickering—Uxbridge, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I think my broadband might be a little bit slow tonight, so hopefully I won't freeze.

Thank you for your presentation.

I recognize that this is somewhat new, and it's great that the online complaints portal is beginning, but what have you designed in terms of how you will determine what complaints to investigate? I'm sure you will have many, but what's that threshold? What's that protocol? What are the key points that need to be hit to actually begin that investigation?

[Sheri Meyerhoffer]

We have developed, through very broad consultation, our operating procedures, which have been translated into French and Spanish. It's taken a good deal of time to consult and to make sure that all people have had a say and are comfortable with our procedures. It's quite detailed in terms of time.

With respect to what we will hear, there are three admissibility criteria. Number one, is it a Canadian company? We have to determine whether it's a Canadian company. Is there an alleged international human rights abuse? Is it outside Canada? It has to be outside Canada, it has to be a Canadian company, and it has to be a human rights abuse that is recognized internationally.

[Jennifer O'Connell, Liberal, Pickering—Uxbridge, ON]

Thank you so much.

I have a follow-up question.

How will you determine a Canadian company in the sense of this globalized world? There are not very many borders anymore. I recognize the criteria around the industries that you're looking at, so that might be a little bit easier, just in the sense of head offices or where these companies maybe originated, but with aggressive taxation planning, companies can set up head offices or corporate headquarters around the world. Is there a broad definition to determine that to get away from...? In this case, it's oversight, but we see it elsewhere, usually for taxation purposes. Is there some thought that has been given, or consultations that were given, to look into that to make sure there aren't loopholes?

[Sheri Meyerhoffer]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Yes, there is a broad definition of “Canadian company” in our order in council, which sets out our mandate. That definition will allow us, if it's a company that is formed in Canada in any way—it doesn't have to be incorporated—or any company that is controlled by a Canadian company and those that are controlled by that company.... There are three layers there. We will have to apply a very strict protocol as to how we determine that. We have consulted broadly on that with stakeholders, and we are putting a process in place for those determinations. It's part of our operating procedures.

[Jennifer O'Connell, Liberal, Pickering—Uxbridge, ON]

Thank you.

In terms of one of the processes, essentially, one of the mechanisms is naming and shaming, to put it in those terms, if you determine there are findings. Is there a process whereby you don't always name and shame? I used to be on the finance committee, and we talked about some of the financial mechanisms around the world and sometimes there are decisions not to name and shame and the justification.

Is there a protocol in place, or must you always provide that type of report? Do you have some sort of annual reporting for the investigations or the procedures that you've done, let's say in the course of a year, or something like that?

[Sheri Meyerhoffer]

Naming and shaming is part of publishing, and we are required to publish. If we receive a complaint, we have to publish it. The amount of information we publish with respect to a complaint will depend on the situation. It will depend on whether the situation was mediated between the company and the complainant, and whether the complainant and the company requested that certain information not be published. That's possible, but we will definitely publish that we received 10 complaints, that we reviewed eight—that kind of information will be there. We don't always have to name and shame.

There's also part of our mandate where we advise companies and we promote the international business and human rights standards. We can do a lot of know and show. We can be very proactive to prevent the occurrence of human rights abuses by letting companies know what they ought to be doing to avoid that. That's part of the opposite of name and blame; it's know and show.

[Jennifer O'Connell, Liberal, Pickering—Uxbridge, ON]

Do I have more time, Mr. Chair?

I see Madame Gill's hand up. I don't know if it's about translation.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

You have one minute.

[Marilène Gill, Bloc, Manicouagan, QC]

Mr. Chair, I have a point of order.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

I think interpretation is not working for me.

[Marilène Gill, Bloc, Manicouagan, QC]

The interpretation is working very well. I am commenting more out of concern for the interpreters.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

I am not receiving any interpretation.

[Sheri Meyerhoffer]

Neither am I.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

Mr. Clerk, can you check? I cannot get any interpretation.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Mr. Naaman Sugrue]

I am looking into it right now.

I suggest we suspend for just a minute.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

We will suspend.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

Okay, we're good to go.

Ms. O'Connell, you can get in one last very quick question.

[Jennifer O'Connell, Liberal, Pickering—Uxbridge, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

In terms of the industries you're looking at.... Again, you're in an infancy stage. Will there be opportunities to review your mandate in terms of additional industries as your role grows, as the organization grows, and the need?

Thank you so much.

[Sheri Meyerhoffer]

Certainly we're open to advancing our mandate and making a positive difference in the world. We would be open to that eventuality. We would want to ensure, of course, that a clear framework is in place to guide any additional work that would occur because of additions of sectors.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Fonseca]

Thank you.

Now we'll move to the Conservatives and Mr. Chiu for seven minutes.

[Kenny Chiu, Conservative, Steveston—Richmond East, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to the witnesses for coming to talk to us.

Ms. Meyerhoffer, I have a question about your mandate, since you quickly touched on that.

Do you believe the CORE mandate should be expanded to include sectors beyond the three that are listed? Do you think we should expand them? What is your view?

[Sheri Meyerhoffer]

As stated, certainly we're open to advancing our mandate and making a positive difference in the world. If that were to be by adding sectors, we would be open to that discussion. We would want a clear framework in place to guide the additional work. So, yes.