International Trade Committee on March 25th, 2013

[Kerry Buck]

That's right.

Thank you.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

Mr. Chairman, could I just clarify...?

I have a question about this subject.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

Okay. We'll try it, but very carefully.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

I understood Mr. Easter's question, and I understood Ms. Buck's answer, if I understood her correctly, to be that there hadn't been a cost-benefit analysis done on joining as a full member, but there had been a cost-benefit analysis on becoming an observer.

All I want to be clear on is this. Madame Papillon was asking you to produce the cost-benefit analysis to become an observer.

The answer that I'm taking away, Ms. Buck, is that no such written document exists. Madame Papillon is asking you to provide this committee with the cost-benefit analysis, and I'm not clear if that exists or not.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

We've gone through that already.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

Is the witness going to produce it or not?

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

The information was what was in her report. She clarified to the committee—to me, at least—that she was going to go back and see if there was anything further to what was in there, and if so, she will bring it forward.

Is that right?

[Kerry Buck]

Yes.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

Mr. Holder, the floor is yours.

[Ed Holder, Conservative, London West, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

I have appreciated your testimony today. It's helped me understand somewhat better the process you're going through—not unlike what we're going through as well, as we make our recommendations.

I was glad to hear Mr. Easter being more supportive of trade than I'd actually thought. That's very good.

What you've made clear, to me at least, is that trade is more than just numbers. I think Mr. MacKay talked about a rules-based system, obviously labour and environment agreements that are in place, and integrated economies in terms of Canada in association with other countries. I have a few very quick questions.

First, Ms. Buck, in your comments originally, you talked about Canadian assistance since 2008, that we've invested over $2 billion for international development assistance and so on.

How much of that is Haiti, please? Would you know?

[Kerry Buck]

I would not know that off the top of my head, sir. I'll have to get back to you on the relative division.

[Ed Holder, Conservative, London West, ON]

I'd appreciate that, if you could. Thank you very much for that.

Second, I got the sense, aside from the issue that visas were very much part of the process, that if Canada were to look beyond “dating”, in fact that would have to be on the table. I think you responded to that well, however, in terms of saying that Canada would not compromise its rules.

I got a sense from the Pacific Alliance that this was very much an alliance put together to counter, if you will, Brazil in that region, to become its own powerhouse. Do you have any opinions on that? That's just my sense, from having talked to them. I didn't get a direct response from the ambassadors, but that's my sense. Do you have one?

[Kerry Buck]

It's actually a very complicated question.

Brazil is its own powerhouse in the region, a member of the BRICs, as you know.

[Ed Holder, Conservative, London West, ON]

Sure, and Mercosur.

[Kerry Buck]

Yes.

As a result of Brazil's ascendancy—and, to be frank, Mexico's ascendancy—you're seeing all sorts of different sub-regional groupings emerge. I wouldn't ascribe to Pacific Alliance the primary motivation of counterbalancing Brazil's economic weight, necessarily; I think that would be a question better asked of the PA members.

But it is true—

[Ed Holder, Conservative, London West, ON]

I must admit that I didn't get great answers from them. I'm not sure if they were dancing on the head of a pin, to quote my Cape Breton mom.

Let me just ask you a third question. You're going through this process of review to determine what Canada's next step should be. In the same sense, we as a committee are doing this. We are going to be speaking with a number of witnesses going forward.

I don't mean to sound trite when I say “How can we help?”, but are there some things in terms of areas of focus that we can help clarify for you when we make some recommendations, ultimately, as a committee—because that's what we're trying to do—and that would help us as well? Can you give any direction that way?

I would have liked to ask this question before we had three of our four ambassadors in front of us, but is there any focus you can help give us that would help you as well?

[Kerry Buck]

It's a very, very good question. It takes a lot more policy analysis than I'm capable of doing right now, in the two seconds I have to think about it.

I think it's clear, or to us it's clear, that Canada brings a lot to the table to Pacific Alliance. That might be an interesting area for the committee to think about. We're not just demandeurs here. We're our own powerhouse. As I said, we're G-8, G-7, G-20, and we have a really broad Pacific network when the Pacific Alliance turns to bringing itself out into the Pacific—that second part of its mandate or objective, right?

So what Canada brings to the table would be an interesting analysis, for us. To us it seems clear.

In terms of what's inside the Pacific Alliance box, are there specific areas that the committee could helpfully focus on? That's a more difficult one, because some of the areas inside Pacific Alliance negotiations are so embryonic at this stage.

[Ed Holder, Conservative, London West, ON]

Ms. Buck—

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

Please be brief.

[Ed Holder, Conservative, London West, ON]

Okay. You and your staff all seem very wise. Are there some things that we at our end could do to help support this process of coming to an understanding? Could I ask you to share that with us so that we all get wisdom?

[Kerry Buck]

Yes, Mr. MacKay?

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

Go ahead, Mr. MacKay.

[Cameron MacKay]

I think we'll all be looking very carefully at the reaction of any private sector stakeholders you invite as witnesses, to see what their assessment is. There is a lot we don't know about the Pacific Alliance, and I think that's one reason why the members themselves haven't yet negotiated the final terms and conditions. They're still in that process, and you got a sense of that from the ambassadors. But the views of the Canadian private sector would also be interesting for us to know.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rob Merrifield]

Mr. Sandhu.

[Jasbir Sandhu, NDP, Surrey North, BC]

Thank you for being here today.

I'm going to go back to a question that was asked earlier. It's my understanding that there was a cost-benefit analysis done to see if we wanted to join as an observer. Is there a document within DFAIT of this analysis?