International Trade Committee on April 2nd, 2019

[Peter Fonseca, Liberal, Mississauga East—Cooksville, ON]

Thank you, Minister.

[The Chair, Liberal, Mark Eyking]

Thank you, Mr. Fonseca.

We're doing quite well here. That wraps up the first round. We're going to start the second round with the Liberals this time.

Mr. Sheehan, you have the floor.

[Terry Sheehan, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

Thank you very much.

Minister Bibeau, first of all, let me congratulate you on your recent appointment as Minister of Agriculture, Canada's first female minister of agriculture. Congratulations.

You started talking about the working group. Could you delve a little more into that and tell us some of the details, for example, when it might start? Again, you mentioned who was going to be a part of it, but what role will they play? Exactly how can they help resolve this very serious issue?

[Marie-Claude Bibeau, Liberal, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Thank you.

Maybe I can start by remembering everyone who is participating in the group: the Canola Council of Canada, the Canadian Canola Growers Association, the two companies involved, Richardson and Viterra, and obviously our federal government, but also our counterparts from Alberta, Manitoba and Saskatchewan.

I will be represented by my deputy minister in this group. I might be meeting with them as well. They have planned their first telephone meeting for this Thursday.

I would say there are three objectives for them. The first one is to make sure that we collaborate and share information throughout the process; the second that we also work on alternative markets; and the third that we discuss, as I said earlier, and potentially improve, the different programs in place to support the farmers in this particular situation. These are the main objectives of the working group.

[Terry Sheehan, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

Minister Carr, you mentioned that this isn't the first time this particular issue has come up. As soon as you mentioned that, I remembered that when I was in high school the minister of trade, Jim Kelleher, spoke to us. There was a particular country that had basically barred an agricultural product, an animal based upon a certain food product we were using, or something or other. He talked about backdoor protectionism, but he also talked about food security. I will never forget that.

In your opinion, how important is Canada's agricultural business to a country like China? It seems like they are cutting their own nose off to spite their own face. That's just a personal observation.

Would you like to comment on how important we are in supplying places like Asia?

[Jim Carr, Liberal, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

China is the second-largest economy in the world. It is by far the largest importer of Canadian canola. It's growing rapidly, and it will continue to.

I take a fair bit of comfort, by the way, in remembering that date in 1910 when the Richardsons signed their first deal with China. That's a long time ago. I would go out on a limb and say we will be doing business with China 100 years from now.

This is a tough moment in Canada-China relations. We have serious disagreements over the treatment of Canadian citizens in China who we believe have been arrested arbitrarily. We have an issue with the case of a Canadian national whose sentence has been moved to the death penalty. We talk about these issues.

There was a question before about the international community. I don't think I have had a conversation with any of my counterparts internationally without bringing up Canadian values vis-à-vis our relationship with China. That is our responsibility.

Because we believe in the rules-based world international trading order, we have allies. We have allies who understand that it's in the interest of their people to know that when you sign an agreement, you can solve disputes in ways that will be accepted by both parties. That's why we are working so hard internationally, not only to try to build a consensus on how to reform the WTO, but also for Canada to make alliance with those who understand what we're now facing in some of our bilateral relationships.

We're moving on both those fronts.

[Terry Sheehan, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Mark Eyking]

We're going to move over to the Conservatives now. They have five minutes.

Mr. Barlow, you have the floor.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I appreciate the ministers being here on this very important issue. I can tell you that my producers in Alberta are seized with this. Its urgency cannot be overstated. As my colleague said, many of them are heading to the fields in the next couple of weeks.

I just want to mention something to Minister Carr. I know you said that you're waiting for the Chinese to make a statement on this and that this is a scientific issue. China's foreign ministry spokesperson, Geng Shuang, has already said, when asked if this is connected to Meng's arrest and Huawei, that that is a scientifically sound and reasonable question and that “the Canadian side should take some concrete measures to correct its previous mistakes”. That is his quote. China is admitting this is a political issue. I'm hoping that the government is dealing with that, as well as the science side of it. We have to understand the reality we're faced with here.

I wanted to ask a question of both ministers—whoever can answer. There were 23 million acres of canola planted in 2018. As I said, our growers are at home making some very difficult decisions right now. Do they plant canola? Many of them have spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on their input costs. They've bought the seed and they've bought the fertilizer.

Yes or no? Should these producers plant canola this season or should they be looking at something else?

[Marie-Claude Bibeau, Liberal, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Obviously, I'm not the one who can tell farmers what to plant. I can say that we are really doing our best all together in a non-partisan way with stakeholders because we understand the importance and the emergency of this issue for them right now at this time of the season. We have a number of programs to support them through this difficult period as well. One part is by engaging in different ways to find a solution, but also supporting them. We all know it's more a medium-term solution, but still we are working on diversifying our markets.

We made sure also with our trade commissioners in the various countries where we export elsewhere that our partners still have confidence in the high quality of our products. This is still the situation, so there are other opportunities. They should know that their government is really standing up for them.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Thank you for that, Minister.

We have heard today that Richardson and Viterra have had their permits revoked. We also learned today that a third company is in jeopardy of having its permit revoked. Do we know which company that is?

My concern here is that our stakeholders and producers have certainly raised their worries that canola is just the first commodity to be targeted. While we've certainly heard from stakeholders that current contracts that have been signed are being honoured by China, new contracts on other products are not being signed. Do we know who this third company is that has had its permits revoked? Do we know of other commodities that may or may not be targeted?

[Marie-Claude Bibeau, Liberal, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

We've been informed there's a third company that received a noncompliance notification, but at this time I'm not allowed to share the details on this. It doesn't mean they are suspended at this time. We will obviously keep working with them and see how it goes.

I forgot the second part of your question.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Do we know of other commodities that may be targeted? We have heard that with commodities other than canola, China is not signing new contracts.

[Marie-Claude Bibeau, Liberal, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

We haven't been informed officially that there is an impact on other commodities. Of course the situation is creating uncertainty in the markets. As is always the case, uncertainty might bring some buyers or importers of our product to delay. This is a possibility, but I have no evidence at this stage.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

I have a last question.

You were talking about the cash advance program. It's my understanding that $116 million has already been applied for and has gone out on the first day. We've also been told that if this continues, the funding that is available will be maxed out. Is that going to be discussed as part of this task force, as the Premier of Saskatchewan has asked for? Could there be an expansion of the advance payments program?

[Marie-Claude Bibeau, Liberal, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Yes, this will definitely be on the agenda. This is why I want to work with the working group, to get as much data and information as possible to make sure that whatever we decide on to improve this program, or another one eventually, we choose the best one—the one that will have more impact on the biggest number of producers, for example. I just want to be sure; before engaging any additional funds, I have to go through a due diligence process, obviously.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Mark Eyking]

Minister, as you know, there are so many ridings and farmers affected. You can see how many MPs are attending at the table here today. Many of them don't have a chance to speak, but I appreciate their being here. We have Mr. Kitchen from Souris-Moose Mountain, Saskatchewan; Mr. Maguire from Brandon-Souris, Manitoba; and Mr. Dreeshen from Red Deer-Mountain View, Alberta.

It's good to see you guys here.

[A voice]

There are others too [Inaudible—Editor].

[The Chair, Liberal, Mark Eyking]

I know, but they'll be able to ask questions. These gentlemen are here because they're very interested, but they won't be able to get the floor. That's why I recognized them.

We have some people splitting their time. When members do so, they should keep in mind that they have to make sure their colleague gets enough time for their question.

We'll go right to the Liberals. Mr. Hébert is starting off, and he is splitting his time with Mr. Peterson.

Go ahead, Mr. Hébert.

[Richard Hébert, Liberal, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'd like to begin by congratulating you, Minister, and I thank you for being here today.

My fellow member pointed out that you are the first female agriculture minister. What's more, you come from Quebec, so double congratulations are in order.

Ms. Bibeau, yours is an agricultural riding, so I have no doubt that you're able to understand what farmers need. You know what the agricultural industry is all about. My questions will focus on that.

What role does the agricultural sector play in your efforts? How are you keeping the industry apprised of what you're doing?

[Marie-Claude Bibeau, Liberal, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

I've been working on this issue since the day after taking office as Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food. I'm in talks with departmental and CFIA experts, as well as my provincial counterparts and the various associations that represent grain farmers, specifically, canola farmers. Those discussions began immediately after I took office and have not stopped. Since the very beginning, we've been sharing a lot of information.

I can tell you that, when department officials initially told me about the science-based approach, I wanted to know what producers thought. I learned that support for the approach was unanimous. Everyone agreed on the importance of finding an evidence-based solution. Canada's agricultural products are of the highest quality, and we have an excellent reputation, which we must protect. We also have a robust food export inspection system, one of the world's best, so we need to protect it at all costs.

Chinese officials told us that they found impurities in our canola exports, so we want to know what they found. We did testing before the product was shipped and after, once the information about the samples came in, and we still haven't found anything.

The experts have to come together to discuss the matter. Currently, the discussions are happening over the phone and by video conference, but I sent my Chinese counterpart a letter asking if he would agree to host a delegation from CFIA to examine the matter in greater detail.

[Richard Hébert, Liberal, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you very much.

I'll share my time with Mr. Peterson.

[Kyle Peterson, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Hébert.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'd like to welcome the ministers.

I think I have time for about one quick question. It has two parts to it, and it's for Minister Carr.

Are we leveraging our relationship with our trading partners as much as we can to help with this problem? I think it impacts all of our trading partners. As a corollary to that, are we ensuring that producers in Canada are aware of and are able to tap into the other trade agreements that don't involve China? What are we doing to support on that front?

[Jim Carr, Liberal, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

We are very aggressive in making Canadian producers and small and medium-sized businesses aware of the new trade agreements that are available to them. You might have noticed that in the fall economic statement there was considerable investment in trade, in trade infrastructure, and in the trade commissioner service, which will be substantially increased as a result of these investments because of the tens of millions of dollars added to Canada export....

The trade commissioner service is a service, by the way, that's free to all exporters. For those who feel uncomfortable with too much reliance on any one market, whatever that market might be, there is now more and more opportunity to expand their export possibilities. The Government of Canada seeks to partner with them. We talk all the time with our trading partners about liberalized trade and the rules-based system—we did that even before this and we certainly will after this—because we believe it's in the long-term interests of Canada and the international community.