Evidence of meeting #50 for Justice and Human Rights in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was amendment.
A recording is available from Parliament.
10:10 a.m.
Conservative
10:10 a.m.
Counsel, Criminal Policy Section, Department of Justice
Clause 2 deals with the offence of using a firearm while committing an indictable offence. It does not deal with the same thing as clause 9, which creates the two new offences under this bill—robbery to steal a firearm and breaking and entering to steal a firearm. Clauses 2 and 9 are not related and do not deal with the same thing.
Does that address your concerns?
10:10 a.m.
Bloc
Réal Ménard Bloc Hochelaga, QC
I had not quite understood the link the chairman was making, other than that you wanted to make sure that our vote was sustained. We are not asking for our vote to be reconsidered, because we are not dealing with the two new offences here.
10:10 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Art Hanger
It was my understanding that there was some concern with the opposition members and that they wanted to revisit clause 2. I may be mistaken.
Clause 15, clause 25, clause 28—
10:10 a.m.
Bloc
Réal Ménard Bloc Hochelaga, QC
Mr. Chairman, to avoid all confusion, I would also like to have an explanation of the scope of these two new offences and the link between them. I understand there are mandatory minimum sentences.
10:10 a.m.
Conservative
10:10 a.m.
Counsel, Criminal Policy Section, Department of Justice
Clause 15 of the bill—
10:10 a.m.
Counsel, Criminal Policy Section, Department of Justice
That is correct. We're adding two new referrals to the two new offences created under the bill, in other words breaking and entering to steal a firearm and robbery to steal a firearm. Clause 15 is not an offence as such. For all practical purposes, this is a consequential amendment to the creation of the new offences.
10:10 a.m.
Bloc
Réal Ménard Bloc Hochelaga, QC
So, individuals may go before a justice of the peace to obtain a wiretapping warrant for these two offences.
10:10 a.m.
Counsel, Criminal Policy Section, Department of Justice
Yes. The same thing applies to clause 25 of the bill, regarding the aggravating factor of breaking and entering to steal a firearm and robbery to steal a firearm. If the robbery takes place in a dwelling house it is referred to as a home invasion. So, given that new offences are being created which target the stealing of firearms specifically, the amendment to clause 25 would serve as a reference to these new offences.
10:15 a.m.
Counsel, Criminal Policy Section, Department of Justice
Clause 28 is similar, in and that it is also a consequential amendment. Here, we are dealing with breaking and entering. Section 662 of the Criminal Code provides that when there is insufficient evidence before the court to prove that a break and enter actually occurred in order to steal a firearm, a conviction can still be registered for the attempt to do so.
Under Bill C-10, a new offence is created, breaking and entering for the purposes of stealing a firearm. So, even if the Crown cannot prove that firearms were stolen, there may still be a conviction for breaking and entering for the purpose of stealing a firearm.
10:15 a.m.
Bloc
Réal Ménard Bloc Hochelaga, QC
And, in all of that, we eliminated all references to mandatory minimum sentences.
10:15 a.m.
Bloc
Réal Ménard Bloc Hochelaga, QC
The clause refers to aggravating factors; either wiretapping or breaking and entering.
10:15 a.m.
Counsel, Criminal Policy Section, Department of Justice
Yes. Mandatory minimum sentences are mentioned in the offences themselves, found under section 98 and proposed by clause 9 of the bill. These consequential amendments do not deal with mandatory minimum sentences.
These consequential amendments do not touch on the issue of minimum penalties. They're just references that are made to the new offence provisions created by the bill.
10:15 a.m.
Liberal
10:15 a.m.
Counsel, Criminal Policy Section, Department of Justice
That's correct. Clause 9 as amended does not provide a mandatory minimum penalty for those new offences that are created.
10:15 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Art Hanger
We're on clause 15. The vote on clause 15 can be applied to clauses 25 and 28 if there's unanimous consent.
10:15 a.m.
Some hon. members
Agreed.
10:15 a.m.
Conservative
