Justice Committee on July 25th, 2019

[Christine Moore, NDP, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Very well, thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Anthony Housefather]

Before I get to the motion by Ms. Raitt, I want to thank the Right Honourable Kim Campbell for her continued service to this country and for the incredible work she continues to do in this and many other regards. Thank you so much on behalf of the committee and all Canadians. I know that all members of all parties would join with me in that.

Thank you so much, Minister Lametti, for being here today and giving us very frank answers to our questions.

I will excuse the witnesses because I think they don't need to sit there the entire time as we go through the motion, but you're welcome to stay, of course, to the extent you would like.

I am going to suspend for a second to let the minister and Ms. Campbell leave, and then I'll come back to the motion.

[The Chair, Liberal, Anthony Housefather]

I am now resuming the meeting. I wanted to look at all of the issues surrounding the motion. There are some small issues in terms of rewriting it, but I think Ms. Raitt is comfortable providing slightly revised wording. Therefore, I'm not going to get into that issue.

The issue I was trying to look at was that we had met on April 11, and Mr. Cooper had presented the following motion:

That the Committee sit additional hours to study the leak of information surrounding the Supreme Court of Canada selection process, particularly as it pertains to the leak of information surrounding the Chief Justice of the Manitoba Court of Queen's Bench; and that the Committee report its findings to the House no later than Friday, May 31, 2019.

I was concerned that this was an issue that the committee had already visited and defeated, which would make it not receivable. However, in the last three and a half years I have always erred in favour of the receivability of motions. I can say that the motion was worded based on something that Ms. Campbell said today. In principle, I think it's better to allow the motion to come forward and to have a discussion on it, and the committee can treat it how it wishes.

I'd ask Ms. Raitt to simply reread the motion as the clerk has redrafted it.

[Lisa Raitt, Conservative, Milton, ON]

Thank you, I will.

The motion, as it reads, Mr. Chair, is as follows:

That the Committee immediately begin a study into the leak of information related to the possible appointment of Justice Glenn Joyal.

[The Chair, Liberal, Anthony Housefather]

Thank you very much.

I'll give the floor to whoever....

Ms. Raitt.

[Lisa Raitt, Conservative, Milton, ON]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you very much for ruling this admissible. Through the questioning today something has become quite apparent to me, and it has been confirmed for me as well in the discussion I had with Ms. Campbell. It is that this is truly an important issue for us to study. The chair of the advisory committee for the Supreme Court of Canada nomination process has indicated that this is something she thinks MPs would be interested in getting to the bottom of. I agree with her and I appreciate that piece of advice.

I am also concerned that there seems to be a miscommunication, deliberate or not, with respect to what is actually being investigated now and who is being investigated. I understand that part of the defence, I guess, in saying no to a justice committee inquiry was that the Privacy Commissioner was doing his job.

As you may have noticed today, I brought up the fact that section 50 of the Privacy Act exempts any political staff or ministers or prime ministers from an investigation. Simply put, the Prime Minister will not be interviewed by the Privacy Commissioner. Minister Lametti will not be interviewed by the Privacy Commissioner. The cabinet ministers who were consulted as part of the previous process will not be interviewed by the Privacy Commissioner. Elder Marques will not be interviewed by the Privacy Commissioner. Mathieu Bouchard will not be interviewed by the Privacy Commissioner, and neither will Ben Chin be interviewed by the Privacy Commissioner.

The reason I'm concerned is that in response to my questions, the minister was very careful when I asked whether or not his political staff were going to be interviewed. He responded by by saying that his department would co-operate. That, I believe, is a deliberate attempt to split a hair. As a former minister, I don't appreciate it because I don't think it's being fair to Canadians, as it does not allow them to understand exactly what is being investigated now.

As a result, I'm proposing this motion so that there will be no gap in any investigation regarding this incredibly egregious leak of the personal information of Mr. Justice Glenn Joyal to the press, with the purpose, quite frankly, of delegitimizing whether or not Jody Wilson-Raybould was in favour of the charter. That's what it all comes back to.

As a result, I look forward to the comments by my colleagues around the table regarding the matter.

I would point out one last thing with respect to what Minister Lametti testified today. When I put it to Ms. Campbell whether or not she discussed the matter of the leak with Minister Lametti, she indicated that she had not discussed it with Minister Lametti as he went forward in the new process. That to me, as well, is of concern. At the very least, I think Minister Lametti should return to answer questions on the topic and, as I indicated before, anybody else who was involved in it.

This committee has the ability to call everybody. The Privacy Commissioner is barred by statute from calling the key people who politically had the information on a discussion between the former minister of justice, Jody Wilson-Raybould, and the Prime Minister of Canada. We're not going to get to the bottom of anything unless we have those people come forward and tell us what happened.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Anthony Housefather]

Thank you.

Does anyone on this side wish to intervene?

Since there are no other speakers, we will proceed to the vote.

[Lisa Raitt, Conservative, Milton, ON]

I'd like a recorded vote.

(Motion negatived: nays 5; yeas 4)

[The Chair, Liberal, Anthony Housefather]

Do the members of the committee have any other comments?

Not seeing any, I want to thank everybody for being with us today.

I imagine this is perhaps our last meeting before the election, so I wish everybody a very nice summer and a good campaign.

The meeting is adjourned.